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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lenny7 View Post
    For me, any pride or "mine is better" comes from hoping the 29er isn't the next 26. Where good wheelsets and tires are phased out and hard to find. Other than that, I could care less what people ride.
    As long as xc is the most popular type of mountain biking, 29ers will never be phased out. And given that xc is by far the most popular type of mountain biking and has always been, things here are not going to change and 29ers will continue to dominate the market.

    I am not sure why people can't understand the fact that xc is by far the most popular discipline in mountain biking and because if this and the fact that many other disciplines are now using 29ers (enduro and DH), 29ers are the most popular wheel size.

    Pretty basic logic that is not addressed by anyone claiming 27.5 is more popular than 29ers. For those that want 27.5" to be the most popular, how do you reconcile this?
    Get out of the gutter and onto the mountain top.

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  2. #102
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    XC is a type of racing, not a "riding style".

    Define XC riding?

    I agree that 29 is not going away, and is increasing in popularity, but there will be a need for smaller wheels and bikes because not everyone is tall enough to fit.

    I recently tried my first 29, an Evil Wreckoning, and was impressed but not blown away by the big wheels. I felt it could easily be the one bike for where I live, and I look forward to trying out some more 29s.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  3. #103
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    Why does it matter which is "most popular"?

    Though we do have that list that all mountain bikers must follow to be one.

    And one of those is to pick a wheel size and be a snob about it.

    Honestly though, I wonder if sometimes having a pissing contest is more important that being out riding . Can't lie Ive done it a time or 2 till I realized Im wasting precious riding time.

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  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    XC is a type of racing, not a "riding style".
    Straight from Wikipedia:
    "Mountain biking can generally be broken down into multiple categories: cross country, trail riding, all mountain (also referred to as "Enduro"), downhill, freeride and dirt jumping. However, the majority of mountain biking falls into the categories of Trail and Cross Country riding styles."

    Also, most every manufacturer has a catergory for XC bikes, just like they have one for DH, trail, enduro and DJ. No special disclaimer for the XC catergory bikes that says they are for racing only. XC is most certainly a type of riding style, but that is easily enough seen by using google. Give it a try.
    Get out of the gutter and onto the mountain top.

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  5. #105
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    Here's how I see it from an outsiders point of view:

    The bike market was getting a bit stale. Bike prices too high so folks were sticking with their old bike longer rather than upgrading every year or two. The 27.5 give the manufacturer something to sell folks. Riding a 'too small of a wheel' bike is a fantastic marketing gimmick. Brilliant actually.

    They attempted the same thing a decade ago with the 29" wheel, but 29er's weren't always the best choice for shorter riders.

    Do 27.5 and 29 inch bikes offer some improvement for some riders? Absolutely.
    Is that the primary reason bike shops are stocked to the brim with 27.5 bikes? Absolutely not. They are hoping that consumers will feel they are missing out on something with their 'outdated' 26" wheeled bikes.

  6. #106
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    Well, if we want to say whatever people are buying is what is great, then here:

    BMX up 32%

    Ebikes up 90%.

    Which one you buying next?

    So FWIW, 29 and 650B are dying a slow death as we speak, so I don't know who's losing less, but you guys go ahead and hash it out some more.

    src:BPSA: Dollar sales to retailers up in June | Bicycle Retailer and Industry News

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zowie View Post
    Which one you buying next?
    Why, a 29er e-bike, of course.
    =s
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  8. #108
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    Neither are actually dying at all. Theres a lot of info behind whats going on that's missing.

    First is that people arent buying as many new bikes every year as theres been no real new outstanding tech released for 2017 to the masses. Wheel sizes unchanged, drivetrains unchanged. Its a trend thats a rotating cycling, few years of big growth then slows down because nothing major to get people to replace their current bikes.

    Road is the biggest indicator of this as that market is grossly stagnant. Though the number of people riding road bikes is bigger than all others combined.

    Bmx growth is because popularity of cycling is coming back. Especially in BMX. More pump tracks and so are are being added every day with much less red tape and funding needed than trails both dirt and paved. Takes a vacant lot, a buddy with a skid loader, done. Cities and towns are all for it, costs them squat and looks great that they are doing something for the youth.

    Ebike growth is because now they exist more readily and look like something "cool". Not to mention more affordable now. Camping a couple weeks ago in a popular cycling destination for the area there was a lot of e-hybrid type bikes. Especially among the newly retired crowd.

    The up and down trend of bicycle sales will continue. Always has. Fat bikes becoming big made for a massive growth in that market. It has settled now with little in the way of anything new appearing. Plus bike caused a boost last year as well.

    Market flooded with fat bikes, those that like them have them, rest that jumped on the bandwagon and realized its not for them went other routes.

    You cant look at one years report to understand the market and how things are going to trend.

    Bmx and ebikes will never replace mountain bikes. Their just happens to be growth there right now, more than other sectors. It happens.

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  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by singletrackmack View Post
    Straight from Wikipedia:
    "Mountain biking can generally be broken down into multiple categories: cross country, trail riding, all mountain (also referred to as "Enduro"), downhill, freeride and dirt jumping. However, the majority of mountain biking falls into the categories of Trail and Cross Country riding styles."

    Also, most every manufacturer has a catergory for XC bikes, just like they have one for DH, trail, enduro and DJ. No special disclaimer for the XC catergory bikes that says they are for racing only. XC is most certainly a type of riding style, but that is easily enough seen by using google. Give it a try.
    Wikipedia, LOL. What is the definition of XC or trail? Serious question.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  10. #110
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    If you take a look at many GMBN videos where they compare squish to HT, they don't seem much different. Most people (myself definitely included) cannot tell the difference between 650b and 29. Once you gain enough experience, where you can throw a hardtail through a nasty rock garden and not eat sheet, you begin to develop appreciation for a certain application that fits your style better.

    In my opinion, it is a preference and each has its own advantages, but it boils down to skill and a type of riding you do.

    I'm in Chicago and I love my HT because frankly, FS would be a waste and actually quite annoying on flat trails.

  11. #111
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    People are going to see what they want to see.

    Living in So Cal...the types of bikes ridden are all over the map. Going to 5 bike shops in the same town...you're going to see all kinds of different inventory. The shop I used to work at stocked more road bikes than mountain bikes. You go to the shop 5 mins away...their inventory will be completely different. Locally I do see more 29r's than 27.5...but going to bike parks and shuttle runs...the majority are 27.5's (regardless of rider height). I don't see fat bikes at all. I still don't see many plus bikes.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    Wikipedia, LOL. What is the definition of XC or trail? Serious question.
    What is wrong with Wikipedia? But if you don't like wiki, try any other link that comes up on google and you will get the same answer as wiki. And the easiest definition of XC is everything that DJ, DH and endure isn't. It is the original mtb riding style.
    Get out of the gutter and onto the mountain top.

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  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by singletrackmack View Post
    What is wrong with Wikipedia? But if you don't like wiki, try any other link that comes up on google and you will get the same answer as wiki. And the easiest definition of XC is everything that DJ, DH and endure isn't. It is the original mtb riding style.
    According to Wikipedia, one of my friends was a founding member of 98 Degrees before creative differences led him to leave the band and pursue a career in law enforcement.

  14. #114
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    What's the difference between XC and trail? Trail and all mountain? Still no definition of XC, because there isn't one outside of racing.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    What's the difference between XC and trail?
    If you keep your wheels glued to the ground, you're riding cross country. Pop the bike off every tiny lip you can can find, you're on a trail ;0)

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Pig View Post
    If you keep your wheels glued to the ground, you're riding cross country. Pop the bike off every tiny lip you can can find, you're on a trail ;0)
    I pretty much agree with this. XC = JRA or racing (other than enduro).
    Newbies, roadies & weight weenies enjoy XC riding.
    Mountain bikers enjoy trail & AM.

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  17. #117
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    There is a big difference between XC and AM.

    And pig is right. XC has no real rough trails involved. And anything on XC can be rolled. Air time is at rider discretion.

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  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAKC Ind View Post
    There is a big difference between XC and AM.

    And pig is right. XC has no real rough trails involved. And anything on XC can be rolled. Air time is at rider discretion.

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    Yes, but when it comes to non-pro riders, many still prefer to use a HT just because it's more versatile and lighter.


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  19. #119
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    My rides often include trails that are included in the local stage of the BC Bike Race, a XC event. Classic XC race bike with steep angles are extremely rare here with most people on 140-160mm FS, with droppers being standard equipment. I don't believe in definitions or race, but instead rate bikes on a sliding scale.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  20. #120
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    In the last 2 days I've met 2 friends of mine who have just switched from 29 to 650b Evil Insurgents. They both said it was a tough call, but they chose the Insurgent over the similar 29 Wreckoning because they prefer the handling.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    In the last 2 days I've met 2 friends of mine who have just switched from 29 to 650b Evil Insurgents. They both said it was a tough call, but they chose the Insurgent over the similar 29 Wreckoning because they prefer the handling.
    Could you please let us know what they have in comon(tings like weight, height, experience, shape level, type of area they ride, etc...) Thanks

  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    In the last 2 days I've met 2 friends of mine who have just switched from 29 to 650b Evil Insurgents. They both said it was a tough call, but they chose the Insurgent over the similar 29 Wreckoning because they prefer the handling.
    I think this is an extreme example. The insurgent is a smaller bike. It's purpose is similar to the wreckoning however all reviews have pointed to the wreckoning handling sluggishly until up to speed. I wonder if your friends had chosen a more conservative geometry frame if they would've jumped ship.

  23. #123
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    They demoed a lot of bikes, we have a some great lbs in the area. I tried a Wreck and didn't find it sluggish at all, and I made a point of trying it on a tight & twisty climb.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  24. #124
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    i have a '17 bronson cc xtr build. 150/160 27.5 bike and a '17 fuel ex 9.9 xx1 130/140 29er

    if i had to choose just one it would be the bronson. it doesn't roll as well as the 29er but it is easier to handle and a faster high speed bike.

    each has its own strengths but for PNW trails a 27.5 is just more maneuverable

  25. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by singletrackmack View Post
    As long as xc is the most popular type of mountain biking, 29ers will never be phased out. And given that xc is by far the most popular type of mountain biking and has always been, things here are not going to change and 29ers will continue to dominate the market.

    I am not sure why people can't understand the fact that xc is by far the most popular discipline in mountain biking and because if this and the fact that many other disciplines are now using 29ers (enduro and DH), 29ers are the most popular wheel size.

    Pretty basic logic that is not addressed by anyone claiming 27.5 is more popular than 29ers. For those that want 27.5" to be the most popular, how do you reconcile this?
    most popular where? in oregon xc bikes really aren't that common. 130-160 bikes are what you commonly find and 27.5 around 2-1 over 29

  26. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by racebum View Post
    most popular where? in oregon xc bikes really aren't that common. 130-160 bikes are what you commonly find and 27.5 around 2-1 over 29
    Just because people have a 150mm bike, doesn't mean they aren't riding XC. A guy I know recently sold his '17 Fuel EX to buy a Remedy. To ride the trails that several local XC races are held on.

    It's pretty hard for a 29er to work with a 150mm fork and make a bike that fits people. That's a mighty tall front end for an all purpose bike, unless you're pretty tall. Thus, more people are on 27.5 in the longer travel segment.

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  27. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Just because people have a 150mm bike, doesn't mean they aren't riding XC. A guy I know recently sold his '17 Fuel EX to buy a Remedy. To ride the trails that several local XC races are held on.

    It's pretty hard for a 29er to work with a 150mm fork and make a bike that fits people. That's a mighty tall front end for an all purpose bike, unless you're pretty tall. Thus, more people are on 27.5 in the longer travel segment.

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    now that i totally agree with. xc trails are commonplace even if they aren't buying xc bikes to ride them

    i think the '17+ if you can get it light enough is a great aggressive XC bike and it's what replaced my asr-c. i only took a .6lb weight hit moving there too. hard to say no to a '17 9.9 for $3900 though factory demo, full warranty. it just happened to be 18.5. was my lucky moment of the year, asr paid for most of it

    my org comment was aimed at traditional 100mm xc and HT bikes. those seem to be a shrinking share of the market

  28. #128
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    For the last year Iíve been riding a Yeti SB6 and I love it. Time, money and lust started burning a hole in my pocket so I decided to build up a new TB3 earlier this year. I did both the 29er and 27.5+ wheels on it so I could cover the all the bases.

    This was my first time purchasing a 29er, I went from 26 to 27.5 on my last bike. Itís been an interesting ride with them, pun intended. The 29er wheels are fast and when Iím cranking mild terrain I love them, when it gets slow and technical rocky I find them much more cumbersome but very doable and when itís technical climbing it just becomes a chore. I find the wheels get hung up much easier in the aforementioned tech than my 27.5ís or 26ís did and it takes considerably more effort to make these little legs of mine keep the wheels turning. Iíve made a few changes to see if it helped like going to a 30T ring instead of my normal 32T and pretty much the same result with the obvious easier gears just got easier. With all that being said I put up some of my best times ever this year on my local trails riding the 29er.

    Iím actually really interested in how the 29er wheels would feel in a plow bike setup. Iíve been eyeballing frames like the Switchblade or Yeti 5.5 to see if itís a short travel bike / geometry issue Iím dealing with. I know itís not 100% the wheels as I ride with a bunch of people who ride 29erís on the same trails, who all rip and love them. So I guess I think I find its nothing more than preference of the rider, I believe any good rider can acclimate to any bike theyíre on. Its just the smaller preferences or handling that differentiate if they want 27.5 or 29.

    From a shop standpoint I think more of them feel safer selling 27.5 especially to newer riders because its perceived as more versatile. Very few people who have been riding for years walk into a shop and need bike picking help. Experienced riders mostly go to look at and/or demo a specific bikes.

  29. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAKC Ind View Post
    There is a big difference between XC and AM.

    And pig is right. XC has no real rough trails involved. And anything on XC can be rolled. Air time is at rider discretion.

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    What? I ride trail, 75% of my trails are rough, chunky and rocky. Does that mean I don't ride XC? Everyone has their own definitions. For their own trails and riding style. Boston, MA area rider. There is lift served. So downhill or a beefy type bike is usually used. There is trail riding where anybody will show up with anything that rolls. And there is racing, mostly on lighter bikes with less travel. Other talk is just semantics. 29ers dominate the trail riding these days. In my neck of the woods.

  30. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    What? I ride trail, 75% of my trails are rough, chunky and rocky. Does that mean I don't ride XC? Everyone has their own definitions. For their own trails and riding style. Boston, MA area rider. There is lift served. So downhill or a beefy type bike is usually used. There is trail riding where anybody will show up with anything that rolls. And there is racing, mostly on lighter bikes with less travel. Other talk is just semantics. 29ers dominate the trail riding these days. In my neck of the woods.
    In my opinion, the vast majority of trails are "XC".

    If I can take an XC bike down it at a decent clip and not die, that's XC. Blue Ridge/Pisgah? Yep. Moab? Yessir. NorCal? Totally, brah. Front Range? Yeah.

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  31. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    In my opinion, the vast majority of trails are "XC".

    If I can take an XC bike down it at a decent clip and not die, that's XC. Blue Ridge/Pisgah? Yep. Moab? Yessir. NorCal? Totally, brah. Front Range? Yeah.

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    ride your asrc down northstar

    i would seriously enjoy watching the go pro video. i bet you could do it, no idea how much speed you could carry

  32. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by racebum View Post
    ride your asrc down northstar

    i would seriously enjoy watching the go pro video. i bet you could do it, no idea how much speed you could carry
    Point being that the vast majority of the trails in that area (Tahoe) are XC trails.

    Purpose built, lift-accessed, single use directional trails aren't quite the same as MUTs, are they?

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  33. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    In my opinion, the vast majority of trails are "XC".

    If I can take an XC bike down it at a decent clip and not die, that's XC. Blue Ridge/Pisgah? Yep. Moab? Yessir. NorCal? Totally, brah. Front Range? Yeah.

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    My trail bike is a 29er with 6" of travel and beefy tires. Works well on most everything.

  34. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Point being that the vast majority of the trails in that area (Tahoe) are XC trails.

    Purpose built, lift-accessed, single use directional trails aren't quite the same as MUTs, are they?

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    oh for sure.

    still would be fun to try just to see how it goes

  35. #135
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    Sorry, just noticed this.

    Had a 2015 Pivot Les bottom bracket shell crack. They replaced under warranty and gave me the choice to upgrade to the 27.5+ boost frame for $50, so I chose that option. It will also run 29" wheels.

    Bottom bracket height on new frames is generally lower these days. When running 27.5+, it got even lower. Way too many pedal strikes for my taste. Also, on rolling terrain the 27.5 loses ground to the 29" wheels.

    I will say I'm spoiled as my main ride is a custom Ti 29er SS, rigid. The Pivot seldom gets ridden. I like the traction of the + tires, but the lower overall height is too negative for me.
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  36. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by azjonboy View Post
    Sorry, just noticed this.

    Had a 2015 Pivot Les bottom bracket shell crack. They replaced under warranty and gave me the choice to upgrade to the 27.5+ boost frame for $50, so I chose that option. It will also run 29" wheels.

    Bottom bracket height on new frames is generally lower these days. When running 27.5+, it got even lower. Way too many pedal strikes for my taste. Also, on rolling terrain the 27.5 loses ground to the 29" wheels.

    I will say I'm spoiled as my main ride is a custom Ti 29er SS, rigid. The Pivot seldom gets ridden. I like the traction of the + tires, but the lower overall height is too negative for me.
    Longer fork? And maybe try your 29er wheels too.

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    I have no idea why 27.5 dominates. I own both sizes. The 27.5 is a steel AM hardtail and the 29er is a 67į FS trail bike. Granted these aren't equal given that one is a HT and one if FS so my opinion might be skewed. I personally find the 27.5 more flickable and can throw it around easier. But on more technical, rocky, and downhills the 29er is more fun, and faster(that thing rolls). This could be the FS factor I don't know. It's more enjoyable to ride. I love my steel HT. If I didn't buy the 29er FS for my wife I'd ride it exclusively . I'm going to buy a FS for myself and it'll definitely be a 29er Jeffsey.

    Edit: for reference I'm 5'7" with a 28" inseam and ride every other day. So people saying "you just can't throw your leg over it"...that's just an invalid statement.

  38. #138
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    I'm still happy with my penny farthing. Sure, it is a little dated, but it shreds just as well as any 27.5 or 29er.
    Apart from when it hurts, I mostly enjoy single track.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blatant View Post
    You guys seem really angry. I have both wheel sizes and even at 6'2, both serve their purpose very well.
    Nailed it. This is basically the bike version of the AK 47 versus the AR15. It doesn't matter how long you argue the fan on the one side or the other will never give up their position.

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    I like my 2.6" wide tires on my 29er, but think I might like 2.8 or 3.0 even more. Since 29+ is just huge, it seems like I may like B+ most of all.

    So for all you who are not 650B fans, what do you think of B+ compared to 29? Not for cross country where 29 would seem better, but for somewhat technical single track with rock gardens and roots that are sometimes wet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rugerfan777 View Post
    Nailed it. This is basically the bike version of the AK 47 versus the AR15. It doesn't matter how long you argue the fan on the one side or the other will never give up their position.
    Well, except there is an answer to that. AR15 is better. It is not really controversial anymore. 650B vs 29er is much harder to say there is an actual correct answer.

  42. #142
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    Just bought a new bike...it's been 6 years since my last bike, a 29er HT. Going to a FS "XC" 29er FS (Niner RKT RDO). One thing that turned me off in my search was any brand that forced me into a 27.5 in the smaller frame sizes (I'm 5'6") like the C-Dale Scalpel Si, Yetti ASR, others. I was glad to get a Niner that gives me small framed 29er...I like 29ers...I have farted around on a 27.5 and I'm sure it would be just fine but the rollover on those wagon wheels is just where it's at for me. I ride "XC" which to me means "riding normal trails that includes both up and down"...you know...what everyone basically rides. I don't really any dominant wheel size where I am...it's a mix of both as far as I can see....the rowdier longer travel bikes are usually 27.5 and the shorter travel bikes or HTs are 29ers.
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  43. #143
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    funny thread. anyone dissing a 29er should watch the UCI XCO races. too many people are after riding that style for it to die any time soon. Nino Schurter had a lot to do with 27.5 gaining popularity and he still rides 29ers.

  44. #144
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    Actually theres a massive problem with thay argument. Your comparing pros to the millions of other riders out there. Just because world cup XC is on 29ers doesnt mean that 29er still dont have downsides that may not be what people want to deal with. Not even an "apples to apples" comparison.

    For me a standard xc 29er bike sucks. Too much flex in both frame and wheels. And skinny tires just arent my thing

    Everyone prefers what they ride for their own reasons and doesnt like 29ers for their reasons. Every bike and every wheel size has its tradeoffs. Pros on the other hand have far less tradeoffs than the rest of us deal with.

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  45. #145
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    I see many more 29ers than I do anything else. It's rare to see a 27.5.

  46. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by RAKC Ind View Post
    Actually theres a massive problem with thay argument. Your comparing pros to the millions of other riders out there. Just because world cup XC is on 29ers doesnt mean that 29er still dont have downsides that may not be what people want to deal with. Not even an "apples to apples" comparison.

    For me a standard xc 29er bike sucks. Too much flex in both frame and wheels. And skinny tires just arent my thing

    Everyone prefers what they ride for their own reasons and doesnt like 29ers for their reasons. Every bike and every wheel size has its tradeoffs. Pros on the other hand have far less tradeoffs than the rest of us deal with.

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    I can use this same argument that just b/c pro enduro etc. riders are riding X/Y/Z doesn't mean the average rider should be. What has happened lately is what happened in the '90s with XC pros...everyone wanted an XC race bike, now everyone wants a Enduro race bike for riding that it really isn't appropriate for.
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  47. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post
    I like my 2.6" wide tires on my 29er, but think I might like 2.8 or 3.0 even more. Since 29+ is just huge, it seems like I may like B+ most of all.

    So for all you who are not 650B fans, what do you think of B+ compared to 29? Not for cross country where 29 would seem better, but for somewhat technical single track with rock gardens and roots that are sometimes wet.
    Now there's a good question.

    I've got two wheelsets for my GG Trail Pistol -- 29x2.6" and 27.5x3" and I love them both. I've had the bike six months now and I'm still trying to decide which wheels I like better. But that might never happen. Deciding, I mean. Like I said, I love them both. Yeah, they're different but this way I can choose which wheels I want to run on a given day based on the mood I'm in, the terrain I'm riding, the pace of the group I'm riding with, etc.

    I've discovered that in chunky lava, the 29" wheels work better because the lower tire pressure of the Plus wheels allow those tires to stick in bigger holes and such. Too much traction actually can be a problem here. 29" wheels with slightly higher tire pressure really do roll through that kind of stuff better.

    On flowy trails, both wheels feel great. While the Plus wheels feel slightly sluggish on climbs (might just be my imagination), their amazing traction seems to make up for it on the downs and through corners. I never smile more than when I'm flying aboard 3" tires.

    In the end both wheels (I mean tires) outside diameters are within millimeters of one another which ironically is closest to 29". I def wouldn't consider employing 27.5" rims if I had to run skinny tires. Any by "skinny" I mean anything less than 2.5" wide. But for Plus tires, 27.5" rims ain't bad.
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  48. #148
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    Still riding my 08' 29er HT and wouldn't give it up.
    Almost got a 27.5 FS at one point but after riding someone $5k Cannondale 27.5 FS I was not impressed. Got hung up/slower on rough rocky sections allot more and the whole point of getting a FS bike to me was to go on rougher stuff. Maybe the 27.5+ would be different, haven't tried one of those.

    The technical climb, bigger wheels make it smoother right? I make it up them more often then the people around me on 26" bikes. But I also ride more then most of my friends. Wouldn't a longer bike be less likely to pull the front wheel up on the really steep sections also?

    Agree that for most people the technical climb shouldn't be so important. I go so much faster on every other part I could walk up the technical climbs and still be ahead, at least it seems that way. Going fast is the fun part of the ride.

  49. #149
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    With all the differing wheelsize opinions out there. One question that needs to be asked. If 29 ers have so many advantages why do all the winners choose riding 27.5? Rude, Hill, Gwin, Atherton. Dominating the 29ers in DH and Enduro.

  50. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by ringoesroadking View Post
    If 29 ers have so many advantages why do all the winners choose riding 27.5?
    The other question is, would they still be on 26 if the manufacturers hadn't stopped making them?

    The free-ride/down-hill scene does make a bit of a mockery of the idea that you can't get over rocks very well without 29er wheels. I was on some pretty rocky trails today and my 26er coped just fine.

  51. #151
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    I drank the 29 koolaid years ago. I have owned many ht and fs xc race bikes. two seasons ago I bought a modern 150/160 27.5 bike that was intended to replace my 26 uzzi. I recently sold that bike and needed something to ride so the uzzi got a tune up until I decide what to buy.
    After a few rides on the old uzzi I have come to the conclusion that 27.5 should have never happened. It was just a reason to hype the industry to sell bikes.
    Now I am having a hard time picking out a new bike. If I could decide on wheel size it would help a little. I think we are going to see more and more 29 FR and DH bikes. I wonder to what extent that the 27.5 will go away? Remember we all said that 26 would always be there.

  52. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by rlee View Post
    I drank the 29 koolaid years ago. I have owned many ht and fs xc race bikes. two seasons ago I bought a modern 150/160 27.5 bike that was intended to replace my 26 uzzi. I recently sold that bike and needed something to ride so the uzzi got a tune up until I decide what to buy.
    After a few rides on the old uzzi I have come to the conclusion that 27.5 should have never happened. It was just a reason to hype the industry to sell bikes.
    Now I am having a hard time picking out a new bike. If I could decide on wheel size it would help a little. I think we are going to see more and more 29 FR and DH bikes. I wonder to what extent that the 27.5 will go away? Remember we all said that 26 would always be there.
    Yeah, I agree. I think Giant really pushed the 27.5 thing hard due to them completely missing the 29er surge back in 2005-2012 thinking it was a "fad" and waiting for it to die. Like all things, 26" will come back. Just like neon colors have. Ha!

  53. #153
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    Look, when 29ers came out people's minds were blown with the extra roll-over you got. The industry went nuts on 29ers for everyone, even folks that are really short. 29ers were soon realized to not be the bees knees for DH/longer travel bikes or really short folks. Yes, the industry wants to sell you things, that's good b/c it drives some innovation etc.! Folks stuck with their 26ers in some applications. Enter 27.5. You get a *little* better rollover than 26 without the travel issues etc. of 29. I don't see how anyone lost out beyond luddites that hate change. Get off my lawn. Maybe 26 will come back at some point in certain applications but I feel like that won't happen just like cantilever brakes, threaded headsets, and 7 speed won't come back (thank God). We have moved on from 26, accept it. Using pros as justification is such a bad way to do this unless there is some science applied. Do you really think pros would ride anything that didn't give them the highest probability to win? You can line up a 26, 27.5, and a 29 and probably get v. similar times on all of them in an enduro/dh event with a pro rider, at least within the margin of error of this type of experiment. Sure, this gives weight to the argument of "why did we move away from 26 when it worked just fine" but it also gives weight to "the other wheel sizes work just fine too". Change happens all the time and you either accept it or sit around and complain about it.
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  54. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by GSJ1973 View Post
    Yeah, I agree. I think Giant really pushed the 27.5 thing hard due to them completely missing the 29er surge back in 2005-2012 thinking it was a "fad" and waiting for it to die. Like all things, 26" will come back. Just like neon colors have. Ha!
    Giant is interesting as they espoused the advantages of 27/.5 in all applications and then have backpedaled and gone to 29 for their XC applications (Anthem 29). They did this b/c folks like 29ers in this application. They don't like them b/c they suck/don't work well. Like most companies, we have landed on some bikes go 27.5 in the application that makes sense and some go 29er in the application that makes sense. Some companies are doing single models in both depending on size...cool...unless you are short like me and like 29ers. This is fine! I went with a brand (Niner) that doesn't do that. I am sure I would have been perfectly happy on a 27.5 if that is all I could get. I ride with a buddy who rides an Giant Anthem 27.5. I on my 29er HT. We have lots of fun on rides yelling out things on certain sections of trail. Over rocky/stutters..."HTs rule!" (not really!). In tight switchbacks, he will yell "27.5 4 life!". On flowy smooth sections "29ers rule!". All good fun.
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  55. #155
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    I can only add to this subject based on my LBS comments and that is 29 is out selling 27.5 now and it is a trend they see continue to sway that way.

    They still have more 27.5 than 29 bikes in stock but see the trend will make it opposite in the very near future.

    Not sure if it matters that much, might even be splitting hairs as I pass or get passed by all kinds of wheel sizes. I ride what I am happy with. If I end up with a 27.5 and it goes out of style, oh well, next bike will be a 29er, or whatever feels good on the next purchase.

  56. #156
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    Just bought a new 29er that I pick up today...really like the wagon wheels for "XC" riding. Would love to demo a 27.5 however at some point so I can make a more informed comment...never spent much time on one beyond f'ing around on my son's.
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  57. #157
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    29" AM/ endure bikes were pretty bad just 2-3 years ago. Boost hubs allowed proper chain stay lengths and other parts of the geometry puzzle to fall in place on 29ers. Not to mention the wagon wheels to not flex nearly as much

    Modern 29ers are faster bikes overall for most riders and conditions if we are talking brand new.

    I came off a 27.5" bike and I'd only recommend one for shorter people (i.e. shorter than 5'9" or so) or possibly downhill riding.

    I do think it's a mistake when someone is 5'5" and buys a 29er for AM riding, however XC riding you always need to be on the 29er unless you are tiny.

  58. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suns_PSD View Post
    Modern 29ers are faster bikes overall for most riders and conditions if we are talking brand new.
    I reckon 29ers are popular for exactly the same reasons as eBikes. They make life easier for lazy people who just want to go as fast as possible. Discuss? :0)

  59. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by ringoesroadking View Post
    With all the differing wheelsize opinions out there. One question that needs to be asked. If 29 ers have so many advantages why do all the winners choose riding 27.5? Rude, Hill, Gwin, Atherton. Dominating the 29ers in DH and Enduro.
    Thats because 29ers rule for xc racing. Ride what you like, start there.

  60. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Pig View Post
    I reckon 29ers are popular for exactly the same reasons as eBikes. They make life easier for lazy people who just want to go as fast as possible. Discuss? :0)
    Fast = lazy? Better rollover, less endos all good.

  61. #161
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    All of this is too funny.

    Are we going just a little bit overboard on this subject?

    I have to say, mountain bikers are more opinionated and passionate like no other.

    Carry on

  62. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Pig View Post
    I reckon 29ers are popular for exactly the same reasons as eBikes. They make life easier for lazy people who just want to go as fast as possible. Discuss? :0)
    Or you could just ride faster with the additional control?

    Maybe you should ride a tricycle with square wheels? Don't want to make it too easy now...

  63. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeoDon View Post
    I have to say, mountain bikers are more opinionated and passionate like no other.
    Coffee/Espresso forums

    At least with bike its more of a personal preference. Also where I ride 29 XC is all i need, but when I ride my brothers 26 that weighs the same it feels lighter in the turns. I can still turn just as fast on my 29 it just takes a little more effort/thinking/planning hard to explain.

  64. #164
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    Huh?

    This seems like it's a regional thing. A lot of people in my area are on 29ers if they are newer bikes.
    Life is too short to ride a bike you don't love.

  65. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Pig View Post
    I reckon 29ers are popular for exactly the same reasons as eBikes. They make life easier for lazy people who just want to go as fast as possible. Discuss? :0)
    Just another fad before they roll out the real size, 36".

    I mean how can these fanbois say 29ers are it because rollover is important with a straight face, and then proceed to ignore the holy grail of rollover brought to us by Coker decades ago?

    Discusting.

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