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  1. #101
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    29ers will survive simply because there is a significant difference in how they roll.

    I test rode some new 27.5 bikes recently and just couldn't feel any differences from my FS26er.

    Rode the new 2013 Kona Satori and with 5 pedal rotations knew I'd buy it. Now that I have about 3 months on it, I can honestly say...it feels very much like my Giant Reign, but rolls so much better. The slack HA/short chain stays, shorty stem works very well for my rocky loose San Diego trails. Haven't touched the Reign since.
    It wasn't me

  2. #102
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by Howeler View Post


    I test rode some new 27.5 bikes recently and just couldn't feel any differences from my FS26er.
    Weird response. It should either have felt slightly heavier and less nimble, or rolled and cornered slightly better - assuming you we're paying attention. Feeling nothing is illogical, captain

    More relevant to this thread is how heavy, flexy and clunky 29'er is compared to 650b
    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

  3. #103
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    Giant always plays to the masses. They make their profit on trying to get the most people on one bike. They were pioneers in offering only 4 road bike sizes. They are trying to do the same with mountain tires. Find the middle ground, make more money.
    Other companies will continue to care what bike nerds want.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Weird response. It should either have felt slightly heavier and less nimble, or rolled and cornered slightly better - assuming you we're paying attention. Feeling nothing is illogical, captain

    What I did notice was the lighter weight compared to my fat Reign. Really no huge difference in handling... not enough to make me want to buy one. (think too much cross over). Only been riding mtn bikes for 25 years or so.

    More relevant to this thread is how heavy, flexy and clunky 29'er is compared to 650b
    The Satori is in no way flexy or clunky, it does weight the same as my Reign.
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  5. #105
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    Re: What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Weird response. It should either have felt slightly heavier and less nimble, or rolled and cornered slightly better - assuming you we're paying attention. Feeling nothing is illogical, captain

    More relevant to this thread is how heavy, flexy and clunky 29'er is compared to 650b
    Be careful. Do not forget, this is a 29er forum...

  6. #106
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    In agreement with one article I read on the subject, I think this all boils down to Giant being increasingly outpaced in the 29er market by better handling bikes, and the frame limitations of the maestro susp.

    On the subject of 27.5 - if you prefer 26ers for their handling, you should try a 650b, at least on the front. It's an incremental but noticeable change, without much downside, if any. If you love your 29er and think it handles perfect, then don't bother with 27.5, you'll be completely underwhelmed. It's all personal preference... as usual.

  7. #107
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    650b will [...] probably out sale them in 1-2 years.
    Putting aside the small-minded and racist(?) "reasons," I'm calling complete BS on this prediction and just plugged in a reminder to dig this thread up to call you in it.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  8. #108
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    Re: What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by meltingfeather View Post
    Putting aside the small-minded and racist(?) "reasons," I'm calling complete BS on this prediction and just plugged in a reminder to dig this thread up to call you in it.
    Haha. I wouldn't expect anything less.

  9. #109
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    I should probably stop writing on this forum, as I am really bias, but why cannot all wheel sizes continue to be produced? Just because 26" is now the minority, why does that mean that the 650b (almost exactly like a 26" but worse), can take over.
    It would be like this in the real world: Now that whites are the minority in America, why do English speaking whites have to learn Spanish?

  10. #110
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Be careful. Do not forget, this is a 29er forum...
    Oops.

    Anybody want to buy a nearly mint TBc with some light Crest rim/Hope hub wheels?
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  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by CannondaleF9 View Post
    I should probably stop writing on this forum, as I am really bias, but why cannot all wheel sizes continue to be produced? Just because 26" is now the minority, why does that mean that the 650b (almost exactly like a 26" but worse), can take over.
    It would be like this in the real world: Now that whites are the minority in America, why do English speaking whites have to learn Spanish?



    Yes, you should stop posting yesterday.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcteague View Post
    Santa Cruz will be buying Giant?
    Have you any clue how big Giant is? Their name alone should be a clue.

    Tim
    I know...There's a thread on the Diamondback Over Drive that needs another post, too...

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjsb View Post
    I know...There's a thread on the Diamondback Over Drive that needs another post, too...
    Sorry for being a smart arse with my prior post. In my original post I was trying to say something that would be similar in ultra-hype as the Giant claims...On a more serious note I don't view what Giant is doing as very risky at all. They make tons of bikes wholesale for everyone, they don't seem to have the store concept like S &Trek so there probably more likely to be going head to head on the showroom floor with smaller companies who are selling out 27.5"...There's probably more pressure or at least Giant may perceive more pressure to respond.

  14. #114
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    [QUOTE=d365;10573353]In agreement with one article I read on the subject, I think this all boils down to Giant being increasingly outpaced in the 29er market by better handling bikes, and the frame limitations of the maestro susp.

    QUOTE]

    Without taking this thread in a completely different direction can i just add that MBR Magazine in the UK gave 5 out of 5 to the Giant Trance X29er in both 2 and 0 spec.

  15. #115
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    Giant can choose to "go away" & stay away for all I care.
    Corporate late-comers looking towards some new profit-driven niche.

    But so-called 29ers aren't going to disappear.
    With the exception of highly specific equipment, fundamentally: 700C is everywhere (road, touring, etc.).

    Even if rim & tire manus all disappeared tomorrow, there are enough tough components out there that can be adapted to the job for most people's needs:
    I have 700C Mavic 36H on XTs that have been going strong for 5 years. And Bruce Gordon only just re-launched the old Rock & Road tire in response to the "gravel grinder" thing.

    So I don't see any slow-down.
    And no future lack of components that would do the job for most people.

    Hell, if 29er is pronounced dead, just stock up when QBP empties its shelves & you're set for life.

    29er came from nowhere & was kickstarted by people who committed to buy small batches of the necessary equipment. That approach could now be repeated infinitely easier by a small group of 29er diehards.

    Giant? Ciao.

  16. #116
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    I don't get the Giant hate?

    Are people afraid that if Giant goes in a different direction, their beloved 29" bikes will all rot and disappear? Really, that is not going to happen. If 27.5" is Giant's business decision, than that is "their" decision. Frankly, I'm going to miss my 26" bikes but I never ranted because Niner decided not to build them. That was their business decision. Nor am I going to rant if the world turns to 27.5" bikes. Sh!t people, its the "ride" not the "ride" as has been said enough times by people more qualified to say such things than me. Adios! I'm heading to the shore and turning into a roadie and riding my 29" (700cc) bike for the next month 'cause there ain't no mountains or even respectable hills where I'll be. It will be interesting to see if this thread is still alive when I get back. I said earlier that I was interested in one 29" bike to replace my two 26" so I don't want them to go away either but if they do, they do, and I'll still have fun riding.

  17. #117
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    Easy to hate, and especially easy not to read

    That said, if the market progresses the way we believe it will, 29-inch will be phased out in approximately two years....again, totally dependent on market feedback."
    Like Giant will kill (our) beloved 29er wheels against our will in a free market. And their job is to make money, and they will push the 27.5 to bankruptcy. Right.

    They will produce 29er bikes as long as there is a market for them, those 29er molds and tubes will not go away anywhere.

  18. #118
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    The greatest free bike ad campaign ever.

  19. #119
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    If you read between the lines of their write up; Giant only said that they will be putting most of their focus and R&D development into the 27.5er size for most of their lineup. That means that they will pretty much stop all further development in the 26er size. That also means that they will not put much effort into developing the 29er size any further for now.

    This is most likely their business plan for the next 1 or 2 years. If things change in the market, they will certainly re-evaluate their business strategy.

    This does not by any means say that they will be completely abandoning their 29er product lines and all the profits associated with them. It only means that they will not be further developing these products for now.

  20. #120
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty $anchez View Post
    The greatest free bike ad campaign ever.
    Guerrilla marketing?
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  21. #121
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    [QUOTE=Andrewfuzzy;10575062]
    Quote Originally Posted by d365 View Post
    In agreement with one article I read on the subject, I think this all boils down to Giant being increasingly outpaced in the 29er market by better handling bikes, and the frame limitations of the maestro susp.

    QUOTE]

    Without taking this thread in a completely different direction can i just add that MBR Magazine in the UK gave 5 out of 5 to the Giant Trance X29er in both 2 and 0 spec.
    And What Mountain Bike gave high marks to the Anthem x 29er 1 for Trail Bike of the Year for 2013.

    Tim

  22. #122
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    Aren't Europe and Asia Giant's biggest markets? I know Europe is Shimano's biggest market, and 29ers really haven't taken off there yet, compared to North America.
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  23. #123
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    As long as 700c exists - 29er will be around too.
    "The ONLY person who needs to race.....is the entrant"

  24. #124
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by Varaxis View Post
    I know Europe is Shimano's biggest market, and 29ers really haven't taken off there yet, compared to North America.
    "Compared to N. America" is at once the operative phrase and sort of silly. The EU and US are two different places and equating them in terms of consumer markets is meaningless.
    That said, 29ers have taken off in Europe in the past couple if years, much more quickly than they did in the US, time-wise.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  25. #125
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    Giant 27.5 coming to a Walmart near you

  26. #126
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    Here is what I see.
    29ers are here to stay at least in within XC and some Trial.

    Specialized, Intense, Niner and others are trying to get 29ers into the longer travel All Mountain/Enduro arena, which may or may not take off and catch on.

    650b is taking off and will dominate the Trail, All Mountain and Enduro here over the next few years, and will also be big player within XC along with 29ers.

    26” wheels are going to die a slow painful death over the next few years.

    XC - 650b and 29ers (won’t see any new 26 XC bikes)
    Trail - 650b and fewer 29ers than today
    All Mountain/Enduro – 650b (don’t think 29ers are going to make it here)
    DH – 26 and 650b

    650b is going to kill off 26” and cut into the 29er Trail and XC bikes.

  27. #127
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    As many have said before, I don't think the growth of the 27.5" wheel size will affect 29ers as much as pretty much kill any substantial market for 26" mountain bikes. As the market for 26" bikes decline for certain segments (like XC racing), it will be interesting to see if new product introductions for things like forks and tires begin to forego the 26" wheel size. I don't think one manufacturer getting off the 29er train makes a difference, but what does it means if this is the start of a trend? Because if the other big manufacturers also decide that it costs less and takes less time to again develop for one wheel size, that means that the other 29er-specific parts like forks, wheels/rims, tires, seatposts, pedals, etc. will not be given the same R&D priority as 27.5". So in a few years we stop seeing the parade of cool new stuff for 29ers that we've been seeing for the past 3-4 years and, 29er frames and parts get relegated to a niche focused on XC riding.

  28. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjsb View Post
    probably more likely to be going head to head on the showroom floor with smaller companies who are selling out 27.5"...There's probably more pressure or at least Giant may perceive more pressure to respond.
    Unlikely, Giant own the factories that make a large portion of the smaller brands' product, whoever or whatever sells they win.

  29. #129
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    Re: What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    650b will certainly take away sales from 29er.
    Diehard 29ers will continue buying them, but 650b will eventually catch up with 29 sales # and probably out sale them in 1-2 years. Here are the reasons:

    -New riders will most likely pick 650b over 29. (it is a "new" think after all and lot of stores will steer them towards it)
    .
    I don't know about this rationale. You have to remember mtbr is the minority, most people walking into the bike shop will want the easiest to ride bike (in terms of being able to monster truck everything with little regard to line selection) which is the 29 and won't have any longterm connection to 26.
    Here is the thing about equality, everyone's equal when they're dead. - Gavroche, Les Misérables

  30. #130
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    Re: What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by bigkat273 View Post
    I don't know about this rationale. You have to remember mtbr is the minority, most people walking into the bike shop will want the easiest to ride bike (in terms of being able to monster truck everything with little regard to line selection) which is the 29 and won't have any longterm connection to 26.
    I believe the stores will present the 650b as a happy medium... Not too big (like a 29"), not too small (like a 26").
    Giants new rhetoric will be used.
    Plus, it is the newest and coolest wheel size right now. Most of the people want just that, the hottest think out there.
    Of course, it is questionable if 650b will be the best choice for them, but I have seen shops pushing 29" on people the same way before.

  31. #131
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    This Giant rant is completelt false. See they magnify the "chasm" of 25mm (26 to 27,5) like milestone and simulatenously dimishing the larger difference of 38mm (27,5 to 29").
    According to them the almost 29er achievements and traits are contained in those first 25mm and all above does not change much.
    I may ask if the first 25mm over a 26er are so critical, then just think how superb 63mm (jump from 26 to 29er) over a 26er is and how much more additional 38 mm over a 27,5" is.

    They might also invest those R&D momeny into 29ers creating wider hubs like 185-190 rear and 135mm front with 25mm axles, 38mm stanchioned 160mm 29er forks exactly as stiff like a 26er version plus some good light 36H rims and wheels crossed X4. This allows to remove some excess weight from the rims to the spokes, which makes the wheels feel lighter. It is by far cheaper than introducing some dubious wheelsize.

    Their logic sounds like being bribed by K.P.

  32. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    More relevant to this thread is how heavy, flexy and clunky 29'er is compared to 650b
    More relevant is how much more rolling resistance has a 27.5 vs a 29er.
    How prone it is to OTB, spinn out, losing traction and having high centre of gravity. And how jittery and twichy the new kiddy wheel is.
    All those 26er negative are present in 27,5 but less pronounced, zealot.

  33. #133
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by In2falling View Post
    Here is what I see.
    29ers are here to stay at least in within XC and some Trial.

    Specialized, Intense, Niner and others are trying to get 29ers into the longer travel All Mountain/Enduro arena, which may or may not take off and catch on.

    650b is taking off and will dominate the Trail, All Mountain and Enduro here over the next few years, and will also be big player within XC along with 29ers.

    26” wheels are going to die a slow painful death over the next few years.

    XC - 650b and 29ers (won’t see any new 26 XC bikes)
    Trail - 650b and fewer 29ers than today
    All Mountain/Enduro – 650b (don’t think 29ers are going to make it here)
    DH – 26 and 650b

    650b is going to kill off 26” and cut into the 29er Trail and XC bikes.
    +1

    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused-imageuploadedbytapatalk1375498258.079608.jpg
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  34. #134
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by Davidcopperfield View Post
    More relevant is how much more rolling resistance has a 27.5 vs a 29er.
    How prone it is to OTB, spinn out, losing traction and having high centre of gravity. And how jittery and twichy the new kiddy wheel is.
    All those 26er negative are present in 27,5 but less pronounced, zealot.
    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused-imageuploadedbytapatalk1375498323.392598.jpg
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  35. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    +1

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Ill bet $100 that 29ers are the top selling bike in 2016. I've ridden 650b over distance in difficult terrain... Not impressed.

    26" will be challenged. However, you never know what the next innovation will be. We could all be in 20" wheels in 10 years.
    Last edited by LB412; 08-03-2013 at 12:26 AM.

  36. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

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    If you've ridden for isntance Enduro 29 you would ditch 584mm rims, because there are unstable and lack traction vs 29er. Just arrange a 20 teeth front ring and 38 or 39 rear behing 34 or 36. Change your 26er habits.
    Enduro 29 is just 13mm longer than its 26er counterpart. Bulding it with smaller wheels would be a huge compromise (steeping back by 38mm) even bigger than a gain of 27,5 over a 26er (25mm). Completely out of whack.

    I see that you are religious fanatic on Pacenti's payroll for thrusting 27.5 down users throat. Many are fed up with your approach. It is your problem that cannot ride 29ers nor can you understand that there are different forces at work with bigger wheels, but you are lame at physics.
    We need parts designed around 29er wheel not 26er, can't you understand that?

    Had you bribed Giant's designer or God Kirk had done it?

    This Giant's 27,5er advertisement reads like penis enlargement pills ad, perhaps that's why you like it
    Who is it targeted at? Chimpanzees, gorillas or other primates? Definitely not at intellingent 29er riders.
    They are not making the world better by shrinking the wheel. They admitted they suck at bulding competetive 29ers.

    It has been proved that 26er HT is dead and by far outpaced by its 29er counterpart and out of the blued just 25mm larger wheel changes the whole physics and beats 29ers in HT? Ridiculous. Smelss only like money.
    Still there is rolling reaistance in 27,5er, OTB proneness, twichiness, lack of traction, high centre of gravity, those things do not disappear when the wheel just grows from 26 by mere 25mm upto 27,5. Some just fail to acknowlegde this.

  37. #137
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by Davidcopperfield View Post
    If you've ridden for isntance Enduro 29 you would ditch 584mm rims, because there are unstable and lack traction vs 29er. Just arrange a 20 teeth front ring and 38 or 39 rear behing 34 or 36. Change your 26er habits.
    Enduro 29 is just 13mm longer than its 26er counterpart. Bulding it with smaller wheels would be a huge compromise (steeping back by 38mm) even bigger than a gain of 27,5 over a 26er (25mm). Completely out of whack.

    I see that you are religious fanatic on Pacenti's payroll for thrusting 27.5 down users throat. Many are fed up with your approach. It is your problem that cannot ride 29ers nor can you understand that there are different forces at work with bigger wheels, but you are lame at physics.
    We need parts designed around 29er wheel not 26er, can't you understand that?

    Had you bribed Giant's designer or God Kirk had done it?

    This Giant's 27,5er advertisement reads like penis enlargement pills ad, perhaps that's why you like it
    Who is it targeted at? Chimpanzees, gorillas or other primates? Definitely not at intellingent 29er riders.
    They are not making the world better by shrinking the wheel. They admitted they suck at bulding competetive 29ers.

    It has been proved that 26er HT is dead and by far outpaced by its 29er counterpart and out of the blued just 25mm larger wheel changes the whole physics and beats 29ers in HT? Ridiculous. Smelss only like money.
    Still there is rolling reaistance in 27,5er, OTB proneness, twichiness, lack of traction, high centre of gravity, those things do not disappear when the wheel just grows from 26 by mere 25mm upto 27,5. Some just fail to acknowlegde this.
    The truth actually is that I plunked down serious cash on a TBc in April. Instead of sticking to my "zealot" guns and buying a similarly specced 650b, I succumbed to peer group and sales pressure and went for the wagon wheels.

    I'm not going to pretend that the TB is not a great bike, because it clearly is top shelf in its class. I upgraded the wheels and lowered the gearing, and it is a svelte sub 11.4 kilo, 120mm XC bike that climbs like a goat and does all the other 29'er stuff as advertised. However, I've given it 3 mos. of serious saddle time, and personally just can't fall in love with it. I find it clunky and cumbersome in tight single track, a challenge in tight switchbacks - going up or down- and just plain not a fun playful companion.

    At the price I paid, I expect to be in love with the bike unconditionally. I am not. Instead I have serious buyer's remorse and wish I had a Solo. Maybe my riding skills do suck- I'm willing to consider that. However, for $5000 why should I have to adjust myself to the bike? At that price, the bike should fit me.

    This reaction is personal and subjective, and your tedious and BS math is entirely irrelevant. To each his/her own. That's the bottom line, now and forever.

    As we say here in the States, F**k
    You, DC. You are living proof that the most obnoxious and insufferable people in the world are not necessarily 'Murcans. Thanks for helping to take the pressure off, you arrogant, elitist piece of shyte.
    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

  38. #138
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    End of the wheel size debate

    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused-variable-diameter_wheel.pngVariable-diameter wheel

    Someone needs to adapt this to cycling. Then we can adjust to the exact optimal size, down to the millimeter :-)

    (Image courtesy of Wikimedia)

  39. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by In2falling View Post
    Here is what I see.
    29ers are here to stay at least in within XC and some Trial.

    Specialized, Intense, Niner and others are trying to get 29ers into the longer travel All Mountain/Enduro arena, which may or may not take off and catch on.

    650b is taking off and will dominate the Trail, All Mountain and Enduro here over the next few years, and will also be big player within XC along with 29ers.

    26” wheels are going to die a slow painful death over the next few years.

    XC - 650b and 29ers (won’t see any new 26 XC bikes)
    Trail - 650b and fewer 29ers than today
    All Mountain/Enduro – 650b (don’t think 29ers are going to make it here)
    DH – 26 and 650b

    650b is going to kill off 26” and cut into the 29er Trail and XC bikes.
    This a dead on accurate account of the direction the market is headed right now.

    Also, manufacturers want new sizes because that drives sales. Imagine if we only had 26" bikes to choose from, I'd expect sales would be about 50% of what they are today. The only size I've seen leave the table is the 69er/96er series, which had it's own merits of combining the best of what the two sizes had to offer, now 27.5" is claiming to be all that and more.

  40. #140
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    Re: What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    At the price I paid, I expect to be in love with the bike unconditionally. I am not. Instead I have serious buyer's remorse and wish I had a Solo. Maybe my riding skills do suck- I'm willing to consider that. However, for $5000 why should I have to adjust myself to the bike? At that price, the bike should fit me..
    Did you demo the tallboy before purchasing? I'll admit 29 is not for everyone but if you didn't even try before you bought well then it's your own darn fault.
    Here is the thing about equality, everyone's equal when they're dead. - Gavroche, Les Misérables

  41. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigkat273 View Post
    Did you demo the tallboy before purchasing? I'll admit 29 is not for everyone but if you didn't even try before you bought well then it's your own darn fault.
    When I demo a LBS bike in the parking lot - I put it through the paces; curb hops/drops, grass, to simulate deep sand, plow thru any rock features the lot has, inclines, simulate switchbacks/tight turns, etc. I know they cannot substitute for a real-world trail...but I can get a fairly good impression how it will behave out on there.
    "The ONLY person who needs to race.....is the entrant"

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    Demo a Solo... My bet is you will be slower. Also, the modestly slacker TB LT feels much more nimble to me (I have both). I definitely climb faster on the regular TB but it is much less stable feeling on rugged descents.

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    Im in the market for a new ride. My idea of the best ride is a sus 29r that is light and throws like a 26r. I believe the reviews suggest such a beast; the Specialized Enduro! I'll have to try it for myself.

    I have not tried the 27.5. If the 27.5 can roll over things like the 29r and have over -solid stability on the trail; they got my vote. I'll try it out for myself. However, the reviews do not indicate the 27.5 functions as a full 29r. I believe the 27.5 is easier for the engineers to plan a bike build.

    I own a Fargo 29r; I ride all the time! My only complaint! It wont jump! no shocks. Drop down handle bars with 29r ridged frame makes for a very snappy trail bike! if a bike can be created with shocks that will act like the Fargo; I'll buy it!

  44. #144
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by bigkat273 View Post
    Did you demo the tallboy before purchasing? I'll admit 29 is not for everyone but if you didn't even try before you bought well then it's your own darn fault.
    Not exactly. But put in a few solid miles on friend's Niner,not enough apparently. Next was the pressure from friends. One has the same bike. Another works part time in a shop which is SC dealer. All agreed since I have a 650b trail bike already, getting a 29" XC bike just makes sense. At the time Solo was not out yet. Bronson too much bike for me and most local terrain. Hard to argue with that logic. To bad the guy who owns in has too big a frame for me, or I coulda done a proper demo.
    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

  45. #145
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by LB412 View Post
    Demo a Solo... My bet is you will be slower. Also, the modestly slacker TB LT feels much more nimble to me (I have both). I definitely climb faster on the regular TB but it is much less stable feeling on rugged descents.
    I could slacken the HTA 1* with angleset. Did this on my 130mm Jamis 650b and like it.

    1* would less make my TBc slightly slacker than stock TBLTc. Would this work/make sense for XC bike?
    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

  46. #146
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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused

    Quote Originally Posted by OMNICELLL View Post
    Im in the market for a new ride. My idea of the best ride is a sus 29r that is light and throws like a 26r. I believe the reviews suggest such a beast; the Specialized Enduro! I'll have to try it for myself.

    I have not tried the 27.5. If the 27.5 can roll over things like the 29r and have over -solid stability on the trail; they got my vote. I'll try it out for myself. However, the reviews do not indicate the 27.5 functions as a full 29r. I believe the 27.5 is easier for the engineers to plan a bike build.

    I own a Fargo 29r; I ride all the time! My only complaint! It wont jump! no shocks. Drop down handle bars with 29r ridged frame makes for a very snappy trail bike! if a bike can be created with shocks that will act like the Fargo; I'll buy it!
    Truly, I think you might be a 650b candidate as you sound stuck in the middle. Here are what I think are good articles on the theory behind the wheel:

    http://m.pinkbike.com/news/650B-For-...ain-Bikes.html

    http://www.rivbike.com/kb_results.asp?ID=88


    It is truly physically impossible for a 29" bike to throw like a 26'er. Pipe dream. Same with 650b, but closer. Read the Giant Press Release.

    650b is its own deal, neither 26" nor 29", but aspects of both . Whether this means a horrific insane hybrid as 29'er troll David Copperfield incessantly preaches (kool aid spittle frothing from his lips) or a much more pleasant animal as Giant and Rivendell explain, is in the eyes of the beholder.

    As an owner of a 130mm 650b and 120mm 29'er, certainly the 650b does not function as a full 29'er. More like a big 26'er IMO. I think that is to 650b's advantage especially in the "throws like" area. Wagon wheels IME can be unwieldy in certain situations. Although countless riders deny it - from trolls to
    pros- IME 650b rolls better than 26, but not near 29". So they can get hung up, where the wagon wheel would roll. In contrast, they are faster out of corners & more manageable in switchbacks, for example, but still have a good contact patch.

    I admit I drink the 650b Kool aid, so take my opinions with a grain of salt.
    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

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    What's happening with the 29er market!? So confused-26rs-live.jpgDude!

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    Didn't read the entire thread, but I'll probably join the list of posters being called names. I THOUGHT 650b was a fad until I rode a Giant Anthem for an hour today. It seemed (TO ME) to roll over objects like my 29er, yet rode like my 26" FS. I'm happy with my current stable, but down the trail ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fix the Spade View Post
    Unlikely, Giant own the factories that make a large portion of the smaller brands' product, whoever or whatever sells they win.
    Giant having their own factories probably explains the somewhat lower prices of their bikes, but I would think they would care a lot about retail competition if they are making more money from it.

  50. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by fos'l View Post
    Didn't read the entire thread, but I'll probably join the list of posters being called names. I THOUGHT 650b was a fad until I rode a Giant Anthem for an hour today. It seemed (TO ME) to roll over objects like my 29er, yet rode like my 26" FS. I'm happy with my current stable, but down the trail ...
    I had the opposite experience. Felt the 650 was the worst of both worlds with out any advantage. That said bikes are different and I haven't pedaled all.

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