Page 3 of 11 FirstFirst 1234567 ... LastLast
Results 201 to 300 of 1022

Thread: "Tai"-Jones

  1. #201
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    22
    This thread and the others that discuss this bike and it's riding qualities has been both inspirational and enlightening. I am now waiting for my Tai Jones to arrive and Like those of you who have waited and are waiting I feel ya. I"ll be really interested in how I'm going to build it up and if I will get a fat wheel also.

  2. #202
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Mas:





    We both love this thing.

    I wrote this at the beginning of the thread 7 months ago:

    "The Jones is a laser focused rigid "All Mountain" bike. I wanted to poo poo it as an exercise in marketing/swoopiness over substance (seriously, I bought it to test with every intention of not liking it and reselling it again fairly fast). Unfortunately I am completely impressed with the way it rides. I have never ridden a rigid bike that rides as well."

    Nothing in the above statement has changed in my mind.

    Nothing broken yet. I did get a squeak from a loos EBB, so I just snugged it a bit tighter and have not had any issues for a month or two.

    I want to pick up another one, so if you bought one and didn't like it, contact me.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  3. #203
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fixgeardan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    1,148
    Man I like that picture that drop really loos worse than it felt.I am going to try to give the fat front another chance I tried it once and wasnt impresed but according to the experts
    I must try it more than a handful of times to get really get a feel for it.I will try it a while
    but Im still not sure of any really benefits .I just really cant stand the way it looks!!

  4. #204
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    361
    Here's mine.. been riding it for a couple of months and getting it all settled in. Not a lot new to add really, just another nice frame and forks built up..

    (Sorry the pics aren't good)

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/67338272@N05/6288745850/" title="IMAG1038 by james-o, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6099/6288745850_31941a66cd.jpg" width="500" height="299" alt="IMAG1038"></a>

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/67338272@N05/6288226419/" title="IMAG1039 by james-o, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6043/6288226419_1e90d8715e.jpg" width="500" height="299" alt="IMAG1039"></a>

    The things I notice most riding this bike? This seems to be what most riders asked about the bike.. apart from "wtf is THAT??" and "is that a hybrid?" .. cheers for that.. : )

    Comfort. I added reflective strips on the frame and fork because my 3-5 hour loops have recently become 7-9 hours or more. I've found new trails, I explored - I got 'diverted' and rode home in the dark. In TOTAL comfort, like I've not known before. I expect I could feel comfortable for that time on a light FS bike, but it's not the same fresh, efficient, ergonomic comfort I have here. All my (minor) concerns about fit have gone, I've adapted to it easily and quickly and it feels so natural now. My first 4 or 5 2-3hr rides were worrying as I got a minor lower back pain, but it was simply unused muscles waking up - it's all gone now. It feels like a bike I've had for years.
    Now I've got used to the feel of the bike I really do feel the give at the rear, mainly the return spring after a landing compression, but also on faster, small-bump trails where it's really smooth. Less give up front, but the tyre and the grip position relative to the axle makes it really comfy and controllable anyway.

    FUN! This bike is like a 4X / FR hardtail and a lightweight XC bike rolled into one, the good bits of both.. it flies over, above and off things so well (I'm no big-dropper or jumper, just comparing to other fun bikes I've had on the same trails). It bunnyhops with ease, the front end pops up at will, it's just great fun to ride. I don't shy away from the fun lines like I sometimes did on my other rigid SS. And it covers ground on easy trails like an XC bike, so I can ride from place to place hitting the good stuff while always feeling like I'm on the right bike.

    A cheat bike? Some moves feel so much easier to get right on the Jones. A few tricky bits of slo-mo tech that I maybe clear in 1 in 2 or 3 attempts prevously are now most-of-the-time clears. It's got better body positioning from the start so I'm feeling in the right position to make the move. This really helps someone like me, I have the basic skills for technical riding but I'm inconsistent and need to feel confident on a bike to ride at my best.

    Confidence in the tyres / wheels - maybe all 29ers should be like this? 135mm front / dishless Hope SS rear with P35 rims and Ardent tubeless tyres at about 18psi are so stiff and so grippy, I'm glad I listened to Jeff's advice on the rims. I'd need to go a bit higher-pressure on faster rockier trails, but for fast rooty singletrack they're perfect.

    There's been a lot of glowing praise for this bike in the past and I can only agree with it, there's nothing I can add. I do think this may be the most 'complete', or best-evolved, bike I've come across though. In terms of being a fine example of what a bike (not just an MTB, but a 'bike') should be, I can't think of a more interesting design. The way it covers such a wide range of riding so well and works as a system (F+F, bar, wheel, geometry etc) puts it in a very small group of bikes.
    I was at a classic car + motorbike show a few weeks back. I was asked by a chap with some vintage motorbikes on show how old the Jones was. "3 weeks!" I said proudly. "Er, you get her second-hand then?" the guy said - he was thinking it was a classic 50's bike! I can see the links. There were some similar ideas in the old motorbike forks there.

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/67338272@N05/6288225399/" title="IMAG1034 by james-o, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6220/6288225399_7cfc1a1136.jpg" width="299" height="500" alt="IMAG1034"></a>
    Last edited by james-o; 10-28-2011 at 02:58 PM.

  5. #205
    mtbr member
    Reputation: atom29's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    318
    Well said. I sold my Lynskey to get my Jones, having never ridden a Jones. That was a bit scary but it worked out. In retrospect, the Lynskey handling was so mediocre, more so when rigid. I knew from my first ride on the Jones that I made the right call. I too was skeptical of the hype. Many products these days are far over hyped and don't deliver. Jones delivers.

  6. #206
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Quote Originally Posted by atom29 View Post
    I knew from my first ride on the Jones that I made the right call. I too was skeptical of the hype. Many products these days are far over hyped and don't deliver. Jones delivers.
    Ditto:

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/31282232?title=0&byline=0&portrait=0" webkitallowfullscreen="" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="537" width="716"></iframe>

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/31282252?title=0&byline=0&portrait=0" webkitallowfullscreen="" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="537" width="716"></iframe>
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  7. #207
    mtbr member
    Reputation: octavius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    277
    James-o, your initial thoughts on the jones could have been written by me. I'm totally on the same spot as you with my jones. The adventure has started and I totally love it.

    It's that good.

  8. #208
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    361
    Quote Originally Posted by octavius View Post
    James-o, your initial thoughts on the jones could have been written by me. I'm totally on the same spot as you with my jones. The adventure has started and I totally love it.

    It's that good.
    Great stuff, If you're enjoying the ride as much as I am, you must be a very happy rider : )


    Another 9hrs on the Jones today.. It's my time-machine bike, I don't know where the hours go. I started riding rigid SS partly to make my local trails (Chilterns singletrack) more technically challenging and fun. The Jones has gone and messed all that up, today I was scuffing in a off-stump-drop line into a bombhole (looked good, rode a bit lame) and tring to find something higher than about 2ft to wheelie off, just because the bike feels so capable. Rode a new line down a local hill, a very steep stall, line-up and shoot kind of run weaving around trees and down banks, the kind of trail I like most. The bike felt so balanced and easy to ride on a trail like that, almost made it feel easy.

    Enel, great vids again.. I wish I had some stuff like that locally. Dunno if i'd ride it as well but it'd be fun trying.

  9. #209
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Hey Enel, Just wanted to resurface your thread to let you know how important this thread, and the other Jones threads, was/were in helping me decide to get this:
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-jones-002.jpg  

    &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-jones-004.jpg  

    Last edited by Slow Danger; 06-08-2012 at 08:47 PM.

  10. #210
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by bluestatevirgin View Post
    Hey Enel, Just wanted to resurface your thread to let you know how important this thread, and the other Jones threads, were in helping me decide to get this:
    Sorry to quote my own post, but I haven't figured out text wrap yet. So I got my first shake-down ride in. To echo what other people have said, but to apply my own anology, this bike always feels perfectly balanced beneath you. Think of balancing a broom stick across your finger. Get your finger in the middle of the handle, with equal weight distribution, and the stick calms and your hand can relax. Move your finger position on the stick and inch or two either way and you have to struggle to find equilibrium. On other bikes, I always felt like I was shifting my weight around on the bike to find the sweet spot, depending upon terrain. On the Jones, I always feel like I'm in the spot. Hanging back off the bike to go downhill. Balanced. Standing to climb. Balanced. Weight forward to sit and spin. Balanced. Always. Like a finger dead center of a balanced broom stick.

    On the fat front. I have a pretty light set-up as fat fronts go. The tire comes in at 1150 grams, and the q tube I'm using is about as light as it gets. I can wheelie and get the front up no problem. Even easier than on the Yelli I used to ride. I do notice the weight going uphill, but the bike climbs so well that the big wheel doesn't frustrate me. However, the climbs on my home trails are short, steep, and punchy. I don't have to grind for very long before I'm going downhill again. It's not bad. I'll put it this way: the fat front came with the bike, as I bought second-hand--thanks Nitrous, and I can't afford a 29er wheel for some time. I'm not the least bit worried about riding that fat front all summer.

    Oh, and I included a pic of the MRP bling ring just because I got one.

  11. #211
    mtbr member
    Reputation: bonesetter2004's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    1,787
    ^ Very nice

    I would be tempted to put some tape around the ST/DT/BB junction just in case the chain drops in off the ring.

    While your chain may have been potty trained to make it not fall off, it only has to happen once and your tubes are deeply scratched (I don't use any kind of anti-drop devise on my 1x9 set-up btw, but have got clear 'helicopter tape' for the odd occasion)

  12. #212
    WNC Native
    Reputation: nitrousjunky's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    3,224
    Awesome BSV, good to hear it's working out for ya. Now you'll have to post an updated pic when the new purchase makes it on there.
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  13. #213
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Quote Originally Posted by bluestatevirgin View Post
    Hey Enel, Just wanted to resurface your thread to let you know how important this thread, and the other Jones threads, were in helping me decide to get this:
    Wow, thanks. I have to say that after well over a year on the Tai-Fe-Jones, I still feel quite at home on the bike. Nothing else is tempting me as far as rigid bikes go.

    I did get another used Tai-Fe-Spaceframe and build it up identical to the Diamond/truss. Riding them back to back, my first impression is that I really prefer the diamond frame. Go figure. I'll post some more pics/words on both when I get time.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  14. #214
    aka baycat
    Reputation: Ryan G.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    8,484
    Quote Originally Posted by bluestatevirgin View Post
    Hey Enel, Just wanted to resurface your thread to let you know how important this thread, and the other Jones threads, were in helping me decide to get this:
    Sweet, sweet ride. So the rear wheel is a 29er and the front wheel is one of the larger 26 tires?

  15. #215
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Enel. A lot of people crap on mtbr by saying nothing can be learned about bikes by reading other people's opinions about them. I disagree. Sure, I got the chance to demo a Jones before I bought, but reading about the bike allowed me to recognize where a Jones would suit my needs. And that I should find a way to test drive. I appreciate the time you put into this thread.

    Ryan G. The front wheel is a 26 inch, 50mm wide, fat rim. These are generally used on fat bikes, and there's a forum on mtbr dedicated to full-fat bikes. The tire on my bike is claimed to be 4 inches wide--though I don't think it's even close to that wide--and the volume of the tire brings it very close to where the circumference of a 29 inch wheel with a 29er tire is. I believe most riders would consider it a fat tire, and not a 26 inch tire. You should check out the fat bike thread.

    Bonesetter. Excellent advice. I was going to get an N-gear jump stop, but I've been reading that it's not entirely reliable. That may be user error of course. I don't like the looks of most chain keepers, plus I find them outrageously expensive for a small piece of plastic. I like your tape idea. I have no idea what helicopter tape is though. Got a link? I wouldn't mind a pic too, if it wasn't a problem for you. Maybe pm me. Edit: google is my friend. So I'd still be interested in a pic and some wrapping advice. Also, does it hold up well to water?

    Nitrousjunky. One last thanks, and now I'm done. I'm very happy with the bike. Your advice has been very handy. I think I'm going to ride this unicrown fork for about a month before I switch to the truss. I'll be able to have a good, direct comparison between the two. Imagine my dismay if it turns out I prefer the unicrown to the truss!
    Last edited by Slow Danger; 06-08-2012 at 08:56 PM.

  16. #216
    mtbr member
    Reputation: bonesetter2004's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    1,787
    Check out this pic, it's not the best quality, but you can see a few things - short rear mech, and the chain tension is high, also note the chain is not on its highest cog yet, so when it is the chain is nice and tight.

    The other thing to watch is chain line and the position of your chainring. BB width will effect this of course (not sure what width that bike is) If you get those three things good, it virtually stop any dropping of the chain and you shouldn't need any tape protection. I've ran the set-up on many hard tail and rigid 29er bikes fine, without any drop protector and no chain drop



    1x9 on a By:Stickle



    And on a Wolfhound (this bike has an extremely wide BB and I do use frame protection



    Couple of links for the tape. Here, or here's another from biketape.com. Basically it's a clear 3M tape which is used on helicopter blades. It doesn't go yellow with sun exposure and is extremely sticky (but will peel off easily)

    What I have done on the 'hound is use clear handlebar tape.

    HTH's

  17. #217
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    241

    Jones on fast terrain

    Hi, i haven been looking into the Jones frame and it seems to be very well thought off. I have some questions though. Most of the postings here describe it as a great bike to clear rough terrain, lots of boulder climbing and decending pitures here.

    However, where I live its flat, flat, flat. Only some very minor climbs and lot of fast forrest roads and some tight singletrack. This means higher speeds as well. How does the Jones cope with that? Sadle to bar drop is hardly there, and you are seated more behind the BB then usual.

    Thanks for your feedback.

  18. #218
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    361
    Quote Originally Posted by Jowan View Post
    Hi, i haven been looking into the Jones frame and it seems to be very well thought off. I have some questions though. Most of the postings here describe it as a great bike to clear rough terrain, lots of boulder climbing and decending pitures here.

    However, where I live its flat, flat, flat. Only some very minor climbs and lot of fast forrest roads and some tight singletrack. This means higher speeds as well. How does the Jones cope with that? Sadle to bar drop is hardly there, and you are seated more behind the BB then usual.

    Thanks for your feedback.
    My local trails have no more than 200m of height gain or loss and usually only 100-150m at a time, or less. It's rolling woodland singletrack in the south of England, no mountains, no rocks, just swoopy and rooty, some nice flow but almost no real tech unless you really look for it, even then it's nothing full-on. That's why I ended up on a rigid ss for a while and that's what brought me to the Jones. After 9 months + on the ti, all I can add to what I wrote above is that I've got more used to it, I'm riding more than onmy other bikes because I love the ride, I'm riding better because the bike encourages it (bluestatevirgin's balance-beam comments above nail it - I can't agree more) and 90% or more of my riding has been from my doorstep on those flowing, fast, fun trails. It's a lot of fun at speed and it seems to maintain a high speed very well - it's a 'fast' XC bike as well as a technically capable rigid bike.
    The bar and saddle position feels unusual at first but it really isn't any 'slower' or less efficient - quite the opposite once you're used to it. It also makes long rides more comfortable (plus the advantages of the 'balance' points made above). It powers out of corners as fast as any race bike, you just need to be willing to adapt a little - like many of us did to get used to lower bars on road or xc race bikes.

    I also got a steel diamond frame for bike-packing and travel recently (thanks to Biff in the UK - look him up if you're after a Jones in this part of the world). I rode it loaded-up across Spain for 10 days recently and it's as great to cruise all-day on faster / rolling dirt trails as it was looning-it down rocky Alpine-style descents. It's the most all-round great bike I've experienced.

    Quote Originally Posted by BSV
    Enel. A lot of people crap on mtbr by saying nothing can be learned about bikes by reading other people's opinions about them. I disagree. Sure, I got the chance to demo a Jones before I bought, but reading about the bike allowed me to recognize where a Jones would suit my needs. And that I should find a way to test drive. I appreciate the time you put into this thread.
    I totally agree - I joined up when looking up info on the Jones a while ago. Forums are for sharing info and stoke, this one's particularly good for that. Nice new bike BSV! : )
    Last edited by james-o; 06-10-2012 at 02:12 PM. Reason: typos and general idiocy

  19. #219
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    315
    i've been looking at the jones diamond frame for a bit, thinking of buying one from jeff in the fall. i'm really interested in jeff's (unique?) approach to frame geometry and design. my local trails (the north shore) can hardly be described as rigid-bike friendly, but everything i've heard and read about jones' bikes suggest they'll handle the tech and the gnar, albeit at low speed, just fine if the rider is willing.

    my only real concern about getting a jones (besides being a bit annoyed about the proprietary front hub: why not simply use a through axle if stiffness is the objective?) is the one-size fits all issue. i've read about and can appreciate the theory but here's the thing: i'm 6'2" and my preferences for tech riding, informed by experience in local conditions, are steep seat tubes for climbing and long top tubes/short stems for descending. the idea of sticking a long stem and layback post on a bike to get the right fit is a bit mind-boggling to be honest - my approach has been to get the right size/long frame to fit the short stem, not visa versa

    when i brought this up with jeff and asked about the possibility of a 24" frame he wouldn't bite; said at my height he wouldn't recommend it. he suggested a phone conversation to discuss the matter but that's not in the cards at the moment (long story). i'm looking forward to talking to him about it in the fall, but i'm wondering if anyone here has an experience or perspective that would be willing to share that might help my understanding, here

    thanks

  20. #220
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    1,266
    Quote Originally Posted by boomforeal View Post
    i've been looking at the jones diamond frame for a bit, thinking of buying one from jeff in the fall. i'm really interested in jeff's (unique?) approach to frame geometry and design. my local trails (the north shore) can hardly be described as rigid-bike friendly, but everything i've heard and read about jones' bikes suggest they'll handle the tech and the gnar, albeit at low speed, just fine if the rider is willing.

    my only real concern about getting a jones (besides being a bit annoyed about the proprietary front hub: why not simply use a through axle if stiffness is the objective?) is the one-size fits all issue. i've read about and can appreciate the theory but here's the thing: i'm 6'2" and my preferences for tech riding, informed by experience in local conditions, are steep seat tubes for climbing and long top tubes/short stems for descending. the idea of sticking a long stem and layback post on a bike to get the right fit is a bit mind-boggling to be honest - my approach has been to get the right size/long frame to fit the short stem, not visa versa

    when i brought this up with jeff and asked about the possibility of a 24" frame he wouldn't bite; said at my height he wouldn't recommend it. he suggested a phone conversation to discuss the matter but that's not in the cards at the moment (long story). i'm looking forward to talking to him about it in the fall, but i'm wondering if anyone here has an experience or perspective that would be willing to share that might help my understanding, here

    thanks
    I am 6'2" and have ridden a Jones Titanium Diamond 24" for a while. It is a bike that Jeff no longer makes. I run wide flat bars and a 70mm stem, a set up that I would recommend for general hell raising. I tried the h-bars, but I didn't like them for the way I ride the bike, maybe they would be fine for touring. I run a dropper post on the bike with a setback, and the seat is more than half way on its rails, and I run 175mm cranks. To be honest, I would have a hard time imagining fitting myself into a 23", as my bike though it feels perfect, is pretty compact feeling as it is. I run flat pedals (w/ 5.10 Impacts, size 13) and do get a little toe overlap. My rides require long climbs, with rocky, fast techy descents, with jumps and drops. I ride the bike on the same terrain that I take my 6" travel dually on.
    In theory with Jeff's seatube, the more exposed seatpost you have the longer the bike will get. So maybe if you ran 170mm cranks on the 23", you would have more exposed seatpost which would lengthen the effective top tube, and you would get rid of any toe overlap. Again for the way I ride the bike, I would not want to slap a long stem on there. If you can make it work for you it is an awesome bike, that I never grow tired of.

  21. #221
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Quote Originally Posted by boomforeal View Post
    i've been looking at the jones diamond frame for a bit, thinking of buying one from jeff in the fall. i'm really interested in jeff's (unique?) approach to frame geometry and design. my local trails (the north shore) can hardly be described as rigid-bike friendly, but everything i've heard and read about jones' bikes suggest they'll handle the tech and the gnar, albeit at low speed, just fine if the rider is willing.

    my only real concern about getting a jones (besides being a bit annoyed about the proprietary front hub: why not simply use a through axle if stiffness is the objective?) is the one-size fits all issue. i've read about and can appreciate the theory but here's the thing: i'm 6'2" and my preferences for tech riding, informed by experience in local conditions, are steep seat tubes for climbing and long top tubes/short stems for descending. the idea of sticking a long stem and layback post on a bike to get the right fit is a bit mind-boggling to be honest - my approach has been to get the right size/long frame to fit the short stem, not visa versa

    when i brought this up with jeff and asked about the possibility of a 24" frame he wouldn't bite; said at my height he wouldn't recommend it. he suggested a phone conversation to discuss the matter but that's not in the cards at the moment (long story). i'm looking forward to talking to him about it in the fall, but i'm wondering if anyone here has an experience or perspective that would be willing to share that might help my understanding, here

    thanks
    I can't comment too much on the fit. I am 6'1" and I like the small frame. I think you could adapt. (I run flat bars and 60mm stem).

    I will say that even though the front hub is a PITA, the 135 spacing builds a much more evenly tensioned, strong, stiff and durable wheel. More so than a TA would give you. I use bolt on hubs.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  22. #222
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    Bumping this up, because of some sweet pictures, but also to ask which front rim I should run. I had a fat front and I may eventually buy another one day, but I'd like to stick to 29er wheels. In the back, I'll get Blunt 35 or Flows. I'd like to run a big tire up front. Ardent 2.4 and the likes. Or even the Surly Knard? Would the Rabbit Hole be the best? Any other 35-50mm rims I should look at? Most of my rides are XC type with lots of climbs, and also lots of fast, chunky descents.

  23. #223
    mtbr member
    Reputation: octavius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    277
    phsycle?
    velocity p-35 and a nice big gato?

  24. #224
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    octavius, thanks. After talking to Jeff, he recommends wider = better, especially at low PSI's. Not sure if I want to go full on 50mm (Rabbit Hole) or stick with Blunt 35 (aka P-35). Getting the Blunts means no Knard (I believe they require 35mm internal width?), which I'd really like to try. This whole thing is starting to be a really expensive experiment...

  25. #225
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    I prefer big rims and beefy tires, but I don't have to do a ton of climbing. The Knard/Hole might be pretty light for beef--if advertised weights turn out to be true--but they also might take tubelessness out of the equation. Do you need to go tubeless? And I'm guessing here, but a Knard/Hole is going to be at least 300 grams heavier than a P35/Ardent would be. That's a price I'd pay, but the Knard is going to fit on the P35 anyways, so you could have cake and eat too.

    I've been researching over the past few months, but there isn't much to choose from in the 35mm-50mm 29er rim category.

  26. #226
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by phsycle View Post
    octavius, thanks. After talking to Jeff, he recommends wider = better, especially at low PSI's. Not sure if I want to go full on 50mm (Rabbit Hole) or stick with Blunt 35 (aka P-35). Getting the Blunts means no Knard (I believe they require 35mm internal width?), which I'd really like to try. This whole thing is starting to be a really expensive experiment...
    According to Surly's site, the Knard will fit on 35mm rims.

  27. #227
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    I see that now. I must have remembered incorrectly. However, I'm not sure how comfortable I'd feel about putting 3" tires on a 35mm rim at 15psi...

  28. #228
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    The only possible "complication" is that should you choose to go P35/blunt35 at the start, then desire to upgrade to a Rabbit Hole is that you may be hard pressed to find the RH rim for sale on its own.

    I'm kinda in the same boat, as I've got a pair of P35s waiting for my black diamond Jones. That said, I've told Jeff to build up an RH front wheel for me - he'll have built wheels in stock.

    Tire options for me up front, aside from the Knard, would be a Racing Ralph 2.4, Vee Rubber Mission 2.4, Vee Rubber Vee Trax 29x2.5, and of course the Ardent.

    If only the days would go by faster!

  29. #229
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    331
    So if I'm reading this thread correctly the steel spaceframe is a waste of time considering it a pound hevier? It seems like the comfort benefits of spaceframe design you only get with the Ti. I do love the aesthetic of the spaceframe.

  30. #230
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,469
    Quote Originally Posted by discodave View Post
    So if I'm reading this thread correctly the steel spaceframe is a waste of time considering it a pound hevier? It seems like the comfort benefits of spaceframe design you only get with the Ti. I do love the aesthetic of the spaceframe.
    Nah, you are reading it incorrectly.

  31. #231
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    Quote Originally Posted by agu View Post
    The only possible "complication" is that should you choose to go P35/blunt35 at the start, then desire to upgrade to a Rabbit Hole is that you may be hard pressed to find the RH rim for sale on its own.

    I'm kinda in the same boat, as I've got a pair of P35s waiting for my black diamond Jones. That said, I've told Jeff to build up an RH front wheel for me - he'll have built wheels in stock.

    Tire options for me up front, aside from the Knard, would be a Racing Ralph 2.4, Vee Rubber Mission 2.4, Vee Rubber Vee Trax 29x2.5, and of course the Ardent.

    If only the days would go by faster!
    Yeah, I'm thinking RH as well. Knard and 2.4+ should fit fine. I'm hoping split-tube tubeless will work.

  32. #232
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by agu View Post

    I'm kinda in the same boat, as I've got a pair of P35s waiting for my black diamond Jones. That said, I've told Jeff to build up an RH front wheel for me - he'll have built wheels in stock.


    If only the days would go by faster!
    You're saying that Jeff told you he was going to have Rabbit Hole's built up on his front hub? Is that only for persons buying complete bikes? I'll call Jeff and ask, but I want to be clear first. I'm asking for clarity because I understand that the demand for the rim will be high and that there may not be that many available.

  33. #233
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    Hi. Yes Jeff said he will have built wheels for sale. I originally asked him just about the rims. So i am assuming he will build a set or a front wheel for you if it's packaged with a frameset purchase :-)

  34. #234
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    Yes, confirmed with Jeff that he'll be taking preorders for RH front wheel or a wheelset soon. Even sent some teasers:




  35. #235
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Here's more info. on Knard/Hole from Jeff's blog:

    Knard on Jones. Another front wheel option. | Jones Bikes

  36. #236
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    someone invent a time machine...quick! December has to hurry up!

  37. #237
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    Still contemplating rims. Personally, I think rabbit hole is realistically a fall/winter '13 build. From every wheel builder I've spoken to, they say "maybe" March, but still not sure. So, now my focus is either P35 (Blunt 35), or Rollin Darryl fat front. I'm leaning towards Darryl and BFL/Nate combo.

    Just bought a Paul Whub on eBay and confirmed with Jeff the frames will be shipped late Dec/early Jan.

  38. #238
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by phsycle View Post
    Still contemplating rims. Personally, I think rabbit hole is realistically a fall/winter '13 build. From every wheel builder I've spoken to, they say "maybe" March, but still not sure. So, now my focus is either P35 (Blunt 35), or Rollin Darryl fat front. I'm leaning towards Darryl and BFL/Nate combo.

    Just bought a Paul Whub on eBay and confirmed with Jeff the frames will be shipped late Dec/early Jan.
    So the rims won't be avilable until March? Not December? How about the Knard tire?

  39. #239
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    Knard is the same deal. Even when available, on a very limited basis, from what I've been told. This will also command a very high price. Not really worth it, IMO. Jeff seems like he enjoyed his time on the RH/Knard, but not super jazzed by it. Sounds like he prefers fat fronts more. (BFL or Nate).

    I decided to go Blunt 35's (P35) as I found a good deal on it. I'll match those to my current Ardent 2.4's. then will await a RH/Knard build next year some time.

  40. #240
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    yea, looks like a P35/Blunt 35 front is in my more realistic future.

    I'm sure there will be several other tire models from Surly (or other manufacturers) that will fill the Rabbit Hole nicely...so maybe a wait and see attitude may be more prudent.

  41. #241
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    271
    Any reason a Kris Holm 29er rim wouldn't work as well as the RH? 47mm and double walled.

  42. #242
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    Quote Originally Posted by AllRounder View Post
    Any reason a Kris Holm 29er rim wouldn't work as well as the RH? 47mm and double walled.
    That should work, laced to a 36H Paul front hub - Kris Holm rims are only available in 36H I think.

  43. #243
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    Quote Originally Posted by AllRounder View Post
    Any reason a Kris Holm 29er rim wouldn't work as well as the RH? 47mm and double walled.
    My quick search didn't come up with anything, but do they make those in 32h? What's the weight? Seems like it would work just fine. Too bad I already bought 32h Paul Whub.

    Just FYI for anyone looking for a Whub. Search on eBay. $126 shipped. There should be 3 left. Just ordered mine yesterday.

  44. #244
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Search k Holms rims here and on the 29er component forum. Some issues to consder.

  45. #245
    hispanic mechanic
    Reputation: sslos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,481
    Dragging this thread back up for what may be an odd question. Does anyone on here have any experience racing their Tai Jones in ultra endurance events (100k-100miles?)

    Thanks,

    Los
    Whiskey is my yoga.

    dongerparty.com

  46. #246
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    sslos - I'm planning on one next year. It's a 50 miler, but may also do a 24hr. I had a Nimnle 9 until a month ago, so I'll try to post up a brief review.

  47. #247
    hispanic mechanic
    Reputation: sslos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,481
    Quote Originally Posted by phsycle View Post
    sslos - I'm planning on one next year. It's a 50 miler, but may also do a 24hr. I had a Nimnle 9 until a month ago, so I'll try to post up a brief review.
    Well, sounds like just the person I need to hear from!
    I've done a really rocky, technical, punishing 50 mile (El Paso Puzzler,) and a smoother 100 mile (High Cascades 100,) on my Nimble 9.
    While I love the N9, I've always been curious about the Jones geometry. I had a great, hour or so long conversation with Jeff back around 2001, but the finances to get a Jones built Ti frame never happened. I guess the steel diamond frames have made me "Tai" curious...

    Los
    Whiskey is my yoga.

    dongerparty.com

  48. #248
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,180
    It's a total leap of faith. I love the N9, but couldn't swing both at the same time. So sold the N9 and ordered the diamond/unicrown. If I end up liking the geo, my plan is to sell that and get the spaceframe/truss fork. The "full rigid" part has me worried, but I'm going to outfit it with Rabbit Hole/Knard to take a bit of the sting away.

    If I don't like it, I'm going back to a N9 or Yelli.

  49. #249
    hispanic mechanic
    Reputation: sslos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,481
    Weird double post.
    Last edited by sslos; 12-13-2012 at 08:13 PM. Reason: Strangely delayed double post.
    Whiskey is my yoga.

    dongerparty.com

  50. #250
    mtbr member
    Reputation: dRjOn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    2,274
    sslos: fwiw ive ridden quite a few 12 hour races, 100mile east coast USA and UK races on my jones over the years,as well as long rides not racing - its a merlin built ti frame and truss fork. In terms of handling its fantastic...no issues. great position for longer races. I *do* sometimes find the truss fork/enve rim combo beats me up a little on very long rocky races, but its hard to say if this is any more than you'd expect given its a fully rigid bike. my guess is a unicrown would be slightly more forgiving. the true beauty of the truss is the rigidity when you stuff it into a corner or rocks or brake hard...

  51. #251
    hispanic mechanic
    Reputation: sslos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,481
    Quote Originally Posted by dRjOn View Post
    sslos: fwiw ive ridden quite a few 12 hour races, 100mile east coast USA and UK races on my jones over the years,as well as long rides not racing - its a merlin built ti frame and truss fork. In terms of handling its fantastic...no issues. great position for longer races. I *do* sometimes find the truss fork/enve rim combo beats me up a little on very long rocky races, but its hard to say if this is any more than you'd expect given its a fully rigid bike. my guess is a unicrown would be slightly more forgiving. the true beauty of the truss is the rigidity when you stuff it into a corner or rocks or brake hard...
    I appreciate the feedback! I really don't know exactly why I'm considering this bike. I'm very happy with how my Nimble 9 rides. I guess I'm just itching for something different.
    I want to try one before I decide on a custom. I still have major lust for a Vertigo like yours...

    Los
    Whiskey is my yoga.

    dongerparty.com

  52. #252
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    One week before the steel diamond arrives.

    Can't the stork fly any faster?

    Mmmmmust be patient!

  53. #253
    tao
    tao is offline
    succinct
    Reputation: tao's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    217
    I would be all over this if not for the EBB.
    plunging like stones from a slingshot on mars.

  54. #254
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by tao View Post
    I would be all over this if not for the EBB.
    It's a very nice ebb. No problems for me and I'm a fat dude. And I haven't heard of anyone else having problems with the Bushnell (I believe) ebb in the Jones. However, Jeff can set you up with a regular external bearing bb if you want. Check with him.

  55. #255
    For your health.
    Reputation: Dr. Steve Brule's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    37
    Yes, the Bushnell ebb has been much more reliable than the sliding dropouts I had previously. Although maybe you are implying you will never ride single speed.

  56. #256
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fixgeardan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    1,148
    Between Enel's 2 Jones and mine And a lot of hard miles no problems at all with this
    EBB set up. They have been perfect.

  57. #257
    .44
    Reputation: stremf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    1,220
    Few proper rides on mine now. The assessments in this thread are pretty spot on. I've never been able to take some of the chunky sections on a rigid as fast as the Jones. Although I've got wide rims and tires than my other rigid bikes which probably greatly contributed to that. Techy down sections were spectacular.

    I jumped into this blindly without a test ride or fit. I'm 5'11" and it fits great. I also love the Loop bar for its multiple hand positions and sweep. EBB has been flawless, as I installed per instructions (plenty of lube and 190 in/lb torque).

    One negative? Weight. I'm at 27.5 lbs running singlespeed with above average parts. I can definitely feel this compared to my Niner which is right at 20 lbs.

    But I believe there is an advantage to the heft. It's like driving my 2,700 lb sedan vs my 5,000 lb SUV. A little snow slosh on the road or slight bump, and my sedan gets bounced around, where my SUV keeps going in its line of path. I noticed the same where the Jones will hold its line much better through the chunk. Maybe it's the weight, maybe geo, I don't know, but it works. I'm going to keep testing this for the rest of the season and if I'm still in love, I'll be ordering the spaceframe.

  58. #258
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    So you got the Diamond frame and unicrown fork?

  59. #259
    .44
    Reputation: stremf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    1,220
    Yes, diamond/uni combo.

  60. #260
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by stremf View Post
    Yes, diamond/uni combo.
    Cool. I highly recommend the truss fork, especially for chunk. When you say you are going to order the spaceframe, do you mean in titanium? If you're thinking the steel spaceframe, I recommend you seek out one of Enel's other threads titled "fraternal twins". He compares the spaceframe to the diamond frame in steel. He makes a good case for the diamond frame.

  61. #261
    .44
    Reputation: stremf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    1,220
    I don't have the time or patience to wait for a Ti. I did read the comparo between the diamond and spaceframe, which I appreciated. If I can show my shallow side a bit now--I think the spaceframe looks gorgeous and have always wanted one. I love the swoopy lines and overall aesthetics, especially paired up with the truss fork. Yes, definitely form>function here, but I'm ok with that. Plus, I'm buck-sixty on a good day, so I don't think it'll make that much difference.

  62. #262
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,469
    I'm sure you will enjoy the another bike just because you think its cool. I say you go for it.

    I have a steel diamond frame with a ti truss fork. I just ordered a Gravity Dropper post. When I put that on my bike will weigh over 30 lbs. I still love riding it though. (currently 1x9)

  63. #263
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    The more I look at the diamond/truss combo, the more I like it! Alas I've got a diamond/uni en route (shipping was delayed by a week!).

    Maybe I'll score a steel (or ti) truss as a future upgrade...

  64. #264
    mtbr member
    Reputation: ppfeifer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    276
    agu-

    Congrats on your purchase! I got a green diamond/truss last month and it's a wonderful bike. The fat front is a lot of fun. I highly recommend trying it. Once I accumulate 100 miles on my new Jones I'll post a review.

    How do you plan to build her up?

  65. #265
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    Quote Originally Posted by ppfeifer View Post
    agu-
    How do you plan to build her up?
    Not sure if I'll be going fat-front but for now I'll be using silver P35s front and rear. Build will be as an SS - carrying over some choice parts (Jones H-Bar), maybe do a geared 1x9 option in the future for longer rides by swapping cockpits (Jones Loop) and rear wheel.

    Al the parts are eagerly waiting for the frame and fork to arrive, but it won't be till mid-Feb before I get it built and ridden. Pics for sure!

  66. #266
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    2,978
    I have been reading about the new Jones steel bikes for quite a while now. My friend finally popped for a space frame and truss fork model. Beautiful bike. Built up with P35 rims with huge Continental tires, shimano 2x9 with dual control levers and h type bars. On one of his first rides up Coyote Canyon out of Borrego Springs, he had one of his best rides on that section ever. Cleared huge chunks of the rocky bypass and in the loose sandy section up Sheep Canyon he was ahead of his group and the bike just motored up nice and straight.
    He offered to let me borrow it for a week and I jumped at the chance! Now a few things about us. He around 6'3' and around 230 plus. I am at the opposite end of the spectrum at 5'5" and around 135 to 140. I ride a TOBE ti framed bike with a Reba and am into longer distance riding and bikepacking. I have over 10,000 miles on my bike.
    I set up the Jones with a shorter stem (70MM) and my thudbuster and brooks saddle. I played with my position quite a bit until I got comfortable with it. My first impression was that it felt like riding a cross between my present bike and my Pugsley (which I no longer have).
    My first two rides were on the road since that is where some of my rides take place. The Jones handled solidly but didn't nearly roll as nice, probably due to the heavier wheels and tires. I could really tell the weight difference between the two bikes. Now many of you may ask why the heck I am doing a road comparison? Well that is because that is some of what I ride and the Jones is sold as a do it all type bike and is sold with bikepacking bags. A lot of bikepacking uses road connectors so for my type of riding it is an important part of the evaluation.
    Now onto a singletrack ride with a road finish. The singletrack day was up at MT. Laguana with some fine single track. The steering of the bike threw me off and I kept running into rocks and up onto the rim of the singletrack. The rigid front end was brutal for me. In the buffed section of the trail it was ok but throw in a bunch of rocks and my arms were taking some serious punishment. I fell behind my group quickly and realized I wasn't having much fun and my confidence was certainly ebbing. We stopped to regroup and we let out as much air as we dare. The ride improved but it was still harsh and I never came to grips with the bikes handling. I rode the Jones back home using a mix of singletrack, dirt road and pavement. By the time I got home my analysis was done. I hopped on my TOBE bike for a quick spin and the difference was night and day.
    My friend loves his Jones and frankly I hated it. I think a lot of it has to do with our size and the fact that my muscle memory from riding my TOBE bike just didn't allow me to ever get comfortable on his Jones. Also the weight difference and the very harsh front end makes it tough on a smaller guy. He feels he gets compliance out of the spaceframe and truss fork whereas I got none.
    I really wanted to like the Jones after reading so many favorable reviews on it. I love the looks of his bike and it works well for so many riders but not for me.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-1.jpg  

    &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-2.jpg  


  67. #267
    mtbr member
    Reputation: bonesetter2004's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    1,787
    First couple of rides on my first rigid (29er) I thought my eyeballs were going to pop out, and couldn't wait to get home. Onto my second and this one is my main bike now - love it

    And, isn't Jeff's truss fork supposed to be rock solid, with no compliance?

  68. #268
    .44
    Reputation: stremf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    1,220
    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf View Post
    I really wanted to like the Jones after reading so many favorable reviews on it. I love the looks of his bike and it works well for so many riders but not for me.
    Yup, it's not for everyone. Jeff states this right on his website.

    "Sure, itís not for everyone, some people wonít want or like it,"

    But thanks for the honest feedback.

  69. #269
    mtbr member
    Reputation: ppfeifer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    276
    I concur with stremf. richwolf, thanks for sharing your experience. It's nice to read a review that isn't complimentary but is done tastefully and positively.

  70. #270
    Gotta pay to play
    Reputation: michaelscott's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    690
    After a few years of saving I finally had the scratch to buy a built up steel spaceframe SS from Jeff.

    King SS rear hub tied to 35 Velocitys with Ardent tire for rear.
    Jones hub tied to 65mm Large Marge Lite with Big Fat Larry for front.
    King Headset, loop bars. Orange flavors on hub, headset, and tapes.

    Bike should be ready in a month or so. I'll update you all with pics and a review when it arrives.

    The wait is going to kill me.

  71. #271
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    Rushed home from a family holiday to start on the build...not complete yet but it's coming together nicely:

    Old-school Jones H-bars (curved, so not that old-school)
    Syntace F149 stem, 90mm
    Syntace P6 alloy seatpost
    Syntace Superlock clamp
    Avid FR-5 levers
    Yokozuna Reaction brake cables
    Avid BB7s
    Avid G2CS rotors, 160mm
    ESI Chunky grips, cork tape
    Selle Italian Trans-Am saddle
    Jones front hub, Velocity p35
    CK ISO SS rear, black, Velocity p35
    CK BB
    Shimano XT crank, HBC 34t chainring
    HBC 19t rear cog
    Shimano CN-7701 chain

    Tire choices as follows:
    Vee Rubber Flying V 29x2.35
    Vee Rubber Mission 29x2.4
    Schwalbe Racing Ralph 29x2.4

    EBB is either invisible, was eaten up by the box, or wasn't shipped. Jeff has been very helpful and this should be resolved soon. Going to borrow a Bushnell EBB from a riding buddy in the meantime.

    Seatpost and saddle choice to be refined after some riding time. Photos soon, I promise!

  72. #272
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076

    "Tai"-Jones

    Here's the bike, patiently waiting for its EBB...

    &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-imageuploadedbytapatalk1360642202.037525.jpg

  73. #273
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    4,211
    Quote Originally Posted by agu View Post
    Here's the bike, patiently waiting for its EBB...
    Did you at least sit on it and coast down a hill?

  74. #274
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076

    Good job!

    Not downhill, but did so along the street in front of the house!

    A riding buddy will loan me a Bushnell EBB off of his Seven till the real EBB gets here.

    Edit: loaner EBB works like a charm. Will give it a whirl tomorrow. Pics to follow.
    Last edited by agu; 02-12-2013 at 06:30 AM.

  75. #275
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf View Post
    My friend loves his Jones and frankly I hated it. I think a lot of it has to do with our size and the fact that my muscle memory from riding my TOBE bike just didn't allow me to ever get comfortable on his Jones. Also the weight difference and the very harsh front end makes it tough on a smaller guy. He feels he gets compliance out of the spaceframe and truss fork whereas I got none.
    You are correct. The Jones is a particularly un-compliant frame, especially up front in the fork. You hated it because you are used to a suspension fork and a noodly Ti hardtail frame. Nothing wrong with that, but these are completely different beasts.

    Anyone who buys the Jones "vertically compliant and laterally stiff" marketing line is drinking kool aid. These bikes are stiff. Period. They also perform beautifully when it matters.

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/57295777" width="600" height="337" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe> <p><a href="http://vimeo.com/57295777">Goat Camp Jackhammer</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user457842">Enel</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/57295654" width="600" height="338" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe> <p><a href="http://vimeo.com/57295654">Goat Camp Spiral Staircase</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user457842">Enel</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  76. #276
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    458
    There's a video on the Jones website showing the amount of vertical movement in a Ti Spaceframe - there is much more than I thought there would be - and I own a Ti spa Spaceframe, so have years of riding one under my belt as it were.

  77. #277
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    2,978
    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    You are correct. The Jones is a particularly un-compliant frame, especially up front in the fork. You hated it because you are used to a suspension fork and a noodly Ti hardtail frame. Nothing wrong with that, but these are completely different beasts.

    Anyone who buys the Jones "vertically compliant and laterally stiff" marketing line is drinking kool aid. These bikes are stiff. Period. They also perform beautifully when it matters.

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/57295777" width="600" height="337" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe> <p><a href="http://vimeo.com/57295777">Goat Camp Jackhammer</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user457842">Enel</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/57295654" width="600" height="338" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe> <p><a href="http://vimeo.com/57295654">Goat Camp Spiral Staircase</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user457842">Enel</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>
    Nice riding but real techy stuff is not my cup of tea. To old and fragile for that!
    I don't consider my ti frame noodly at all, but being small and light it shouldn't be. My bike flies, coasts well, climbs well and descends as fast as this guy dares go, plus it has made a great bikepacking rig.
    I have done my share of rigid bike riding, single speed rigid etc so I know what rigid feels like. Jones does bring a whole new definition to rigid though!
    Other than the harshness of the Jones I still couldn't come to grips with it's handling although my "big" friend likes it.
    I guess if there was one ultimate bike the industry and life in general would be boring!

  78. #278
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076

    "Tai"-Jones

    Finally built! Pics as proof, will get some dirt mileage later today, I hope.

    &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-imageuploadedbytapatalk1360713714.650959.jpg

    HBC drivetrain (purchased years ago aka the good ol' days)
    &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-imageuploadedbytapatalk1360713733.206035.jpg

    Tires are VeeRubber Flying Vs, 29x2.35. Fast rolling and great on dry trails. Have my staple 2.4 RaRas on standby.
    &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-imageuploadedbytapatalk1360713796.526855.jpg

    Riding around the street the bike feels lively, yet stable and sure footed. Not gonna win any weight weenie contests but that's not the point of a Jones, right?

  79. #279
    Gotta pay to play
    Reputation: michaelscott's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    690
    Sharp looking ride Agu! Can't wait for your review.

  80. #280
    mtbr member
    Reputation: jsqueri's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    204
    It's funny, I've never felt my Jabber flex so much since after reading this thread. I just need a bit more data before I'm able to rationalize yet another bike purchase.

    Can anyone tell me the benefit of the non suspension adjusted geometry?

  81. #281
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fixgeardan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    1,148
    Ive had my Jones for awile now.Just upgrades wheels and tires. Im really liking this set up. Its a little porker but makes me smile .
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-p1000612.jpg  

    &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-p1000613.jpg  

    &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-p1000615.jpg  


  82. #282
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076

    Cool-blue Rhythm

    Quote Originally Posted by michaelscott View Post
    Sharp looking ride Agu! Can't wait for your review.

    Took it on a nearby trail today, short loop which let me tweak positioning and tire pressure after each lap. Initial observations:

    1) steering is precise, front end refuses to deflect off of ruts and roots too.
    2) the ride is firm, not as flexy as other steel frames, but that means more stability.
    3) #2 can be mitigated by running lower tire pressures. Right now I'm on 19psi front and rear.
    4) bike is nimble, yet stable. Geometry is dialed! Had a few pedal strikes during my first 2 laps but a bit if anticipation and pedal positioning/stroke timing during the next laps made that disappear.
    5) weight as built is 25.5lbs.

    More photos and reflections as it gets ridden more.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-image.jpg  


  83. #283
    Administrator Administrator
    Reputation: rockcrusher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    9,030
    Quote Originally Posted by fixgeardan View Post
    Ive had my Jones for awile now.Just upgrades wheels and tires. Im really liking this set up. Its a little porker but makes me smile .
    Knard up front! Good to see that would fit. I assume it is the 29er version.

    Quote Originally Posted by agu View Post
    Took it on a nearby trail today, short loop which let me tweak positioning and tire pressure after each lap. Initial observations:

    1) steering is precise, front end refuses to deflect off of ruts and roots too.
    2) the ride is firm, not as flexy as other steel frames, but that means more stability.
    3) #2 can be mitigated by running lower tire pressures. Right now I'm on 19psi front and rear.
    4) bike is nimble, yet stable. Geometry is dialed! Had a few pedal strikes during my first 2 laps but a bit if anticipation and pedal positioning/stroke timing during the next laps made that disappear.
    5) weight as built is 25.5lbs.

    More photos and reflections as it gets ridden more.
    If you are getting too many pedal strikes, flip that BB over. I initially started mine with the BB in the low position and while I loved the feel of being that low I was getting an insane amount of pedal to rock strikes, so I flipped it over and it is much better now. I am thinking the 50% vertical/back position would be the best for me. That'll be my next adjustment.
    Try this: HTFU

  84. #284
    Administrator Administrator
    Reputation: rockcrusher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    9,030
    Comment regarding EBB. I have done nothing to the bike since assembling it and riding it. I recently took a very snowy ride on Mt. Lemmon that was more of a hike with my bike in 1 foot of new fresh snow than riding. I just rode it today and have noticed a little bit of creak from the BB but like all EBB's in the desert the ultra fine dirt gets in and then when it gets wet causes creaks. Nothing a quick pull, wipe, grease and reinstall won't solve.

    My old el Mariachi I would just pack the EBB with grease from a grease gun through one of the holes until it emerged out of the rest of the holes. Worked like a charm for years of riding in the desert. Only caveat was packing with a grease that wouldn't run out in the 100įF temps where I store my bike and the end of occasional rides. (CV joint grease works well down here).
    Try this: HTFU

  85. #285
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    Thanks for the tips, Rockcrusher!

    I'll fix the EBB orientation once the real EBB gets here. Right now I am on a loaner Bushnell. Right now it's at the 7 o clock position, viewed from the non-driveside.

  86. #286
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fixgeardan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    1,148
    Yes Knard 29er. I had to put my EBB straight back due to toe overlap with the Knard.
    Weighed mine tonight 30.45lbs! Oh but it rides much lighter "ya right" . Rolls good
    and plows over everything.

  87. #287
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Quote Originally Posted by agu View Post
    Finally built! Pics as proof, will get some dirt mileage later today, I hope.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	ImageUploadedByTapatalk1360713714.650959.jpg 
Views:	518 
Size:	127.1 KB 
ID:	771282
    That is a handsome bike. Congrats.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  88. #288
    Powered by ice cream.
    Reputation: Enel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,309
    Quote Originally Posted by fixgeardan View Post
    Ive had my Jones for awile now.Just upgrades wheels and tires. Im really liking this set up. Its a little porker but makes me smile .
    Those pics do no justice to the massiveness of those tires on those rims.

    Quote Originally Posted by fixgeardan View Post
    Weighed mine tonight 30.45lbs! Oh but it rides much lighter "ya right" . Rolls good
    and plows over everything.
    And be sure to tell everyone about the gearing required to push those beasts.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  89. #289
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    361
    Agu, it looks great, really like the silver rims. Enjoy! )

  90. #290
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    Thanks Enel & James-o. The silver rims are actually raw with a protective clear cost. I had a set of anodized red P35s that looked much worse for wear, so decided to have them refinished. (In hindsight maybe I should have asked them to put a ti tint to it.). While I was building up the frame it was only then that I noticed the details in it - the shaped/flattened/ovalized sections on the seat and chain stays, the internally tapered steerer tube (found out after examining the cut portion), among other things. Jeff Jones reveals more in a new post on his blog.

    Aesthetics aside...

    The frame/bike really surprised me once I got going in the rough stuff. It stays planted, yet responds quickly to weight shifts and body English. It certainly isn't as compliant/flexy as my previous steel bikes but the riding position and chubby tires do take the sting out of things. Tires fitted are Vee Rubber 2.35s, running at 17psi front, 18.5 rear. Still thinking of getting a ti layback post, may borrow an alloy one just to see how that affects fit and handling.

    Thanks too, to all the other Jones riders in this forum who've shared their experiences - hopefully I can contribute some of my own too.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails &quot;Tai&quot;-Jones-p1010289-copy.jpg  

    Last edited by agu; 02-16-2013 at 03:30 AM.

  91. #291
    Administrator Administrator
    Reputation: rockcrusher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    9,030
    Took my fat front (larry) diamond to the 24Hr in the Old Pueblo course yesterday to get in a lap while my wife set up her camp for the race. Kids left with her I headed out and hit the track. Even with a head wind and stopping a couple of times to clean my glasses plus the hefty front tire I managed to get within a few seconds of my fastest time out there ever (which was during the race a couple of years ago when I was in better shape). The best part was catching and passing the Specialized Carbon FSR dude on the final fast, rocky flowing descent and hearing people call out "Wow did you see that dude fly?" on the last rock drop (if you know the course you know of where I speak, if not it isn't for the faint of heart or those uncomfortable with steep rock faces with abrupt landings).

    The bike is so precise that I can really make it sing. Each time I ride it it amazes me with the versatility and capabilities.
    Try this: HTFU

  92. #292
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    369
    agu, when u have decided to go ti..please send that thing to me ok...

  93. #293
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mattbryant2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    1,162
    *Sigh* I wish a Jones would fit me.

  94. #294
    mtbr member
    Reputation: idaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    497
    Update on Jones' blog shows a red diamond frame that's 0.4lbs lighter. Nice to see he's not settling but, instead, looking for ways to improve.
    This could be my next bike but I gotta break the bike that's under me first.
    Cheers,
    M

  95. #295
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    Mojak...you mean, you wanna swap with your Mones?!?!

  96. #296
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    369
    Quote Originally Posted by agu View Post
    Mojak...you mean, you wanna swap with your Mones?!?!
    err....

    i am seriously thinking of adding a diamond/ truss combi with gears to add to my ss Mones...again subject to wife's seal of approval.

  97. #297
    agu
    agu is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: agu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    1,076
    Quote Originally Posted by mojak View Post
    err....

    i am seriously thinking of adding a diamond/ truss combi with gears to add to my ss Mones...again subject to wife's seal of approval.
    easy! get a red one for her! :-)

  98. #298
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    797
    Quote Originally Posted by idaz View Post
    Update on Jones' blog shows a red diamond frame that's 0.4lbs lighter. Nice to see he's not settling but, instead, looking for ways to improve.
    This could be my next bike but I gotta break the bike that's under me first.
    Cheers,
    M
    Yep. Anyone who rides a Jones has likely spoken with Jeff before ordering up. I was really impressed with the passion he has and in how much he believes that his "system" works. To me, he's his best ad campaign. One 15 minute phone call and I was sold.
    Enjoy the ride!

  99. #299
    Gotta pay to play
    Reputation: michaelscott's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    690
    Quote Originally Posted by LBIkid View Post
    Yep. Anyone who rides a Jones has likely spoken with Jeff before ordering up. I was really impressed with the passion he has and in how much he believes that his "system" works. To me, he's his best ad campaign. One 15 minute phone call and I was sold.
    Every time I call Jeff is isn't a 15 minute conversation. It is at least an hour! First couple times I talked to him I thought "Wow. What a great guy- he spent this much time talking to me and I haven't given him any $$ yet." Now I am selfishly wishing he doesn't pick up the phone until my bike is done. He said he is really back logged right now.

  100. #300
    Administrator Administrator
    Reputation: rockcrusher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    9,030
    It's funny but I have had many many bikes over the years from full bike to ala carte boutique bikes and all of them I end up tinkering with, adding this or that or stems or bars or whatever. My jones is the only bike that aside from changing tires or going either 29er front or fat front I haven't done anything to. Each time I get on it is right. Occasionally I look for excuses to replace things because they are worn but still haven't really worn anything out enough to justify replacement. The package as a whole is just that I package. The bar, fork, frame all just work so well together there really isn't much else to dicker with. Unfortunately.
    Try this: HTFU

Page 3 of 11 FirstFirst 1234567 ... LastLast

Members who have read this thread: 37

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •