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  1. #1
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    Spotted at the UCI race : Ksyrium SL wheels, 45mm tubulars

    A Belgian rider rode what seemed like a custom alu frame, V-brake specific, 26" PAce rigid fork.
    Ksyrium (I think SL) wheels with 45mm Dugast tubulars (it said 45 on the casing, but they seemed at least equally wide to my 47mm Crow). The tread stuck to it I do not know by name. Low fish scale type semi-knobs, totally covering the surface, unlike the Fast Fred. A bit like a Larsen, but shallower. Seemed fast.
    How did the rider do? DNF, front tubular disengaged from the rim. The rider wasn't very talkative when I tried to chat, so no more info that what I've seen.

    Main reason I've not gotten fancy tubulars myself, apart from doubting the speed and grips benefits over latex-tubeless : rim width. Already 30mm CX tubs need to be glued really well to stay put in a race. Tubular rims are typically 20-21mm wide, we need a specially maderimstrip that mounts to a tubular to add width, or simply a 30mm wide rim to have more glue surface holding the tire in place, and reducing pinch flat factor.

    Myself? Superb start (Masters 30+), from 70th onto lake beach to 13th in a matter of 250m. 29" with low-psi tires (Crow and XR front) just made all the difference, I blew past people already on foot. Rode in the way of others from then on, very bad race. My finish? DNF. My first pinch flat in years. Leaving the beach there was a sharp wooden ridge to hop onto. at the bell I mis-timed that due to rolling faster than before and getting off-line a bit, shallow angle to the ridge. rear tire was too soft all race. Rim (WTB Speedmaster) clearly too anrrow to keep it stable, and narrow rims do hit more easily.

  2. #2
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    Must've felt great rolling by all those guys on foot.
    Must've felt bad holding everyone up.

  3. #3
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    No, it felt like revenge, at times I'm the one being held up. Good to be on the side from time to time (more often than not, to be honest)

  4. #4
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    Did the tread look like this?
    inno.jpg
    Ritchey Innovader (discontinued).
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  5. #5
    mvi
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    I thought about this to address the roll off problem: Take 30 mm wide carbon fibre tape, sandpaper the rim with very course sandpaper, put the CF tape and hardener around it tight. Glue the tire later on its new , wider surface.
    A lot of MTB courses here seem too rocky / rooty for this.
    I once flatted two (cheap) TUFO's in one pretty low inpacct on a steel pipe in warm up.

  6. #6
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    Yes Shiggy, that was it, thanks for kicking my memory's butt :-)

    I suppose the guy had the Innovader 26" tread stretched over the 700c casing...

    Tufo's have butyl innertubes, which doesn't help the pinch flat situation I think (I did it too). It would be interesting to learn what effect sealent could have on such pinch flats. If the casing is not hurt, could the sealent take over the sealing duties?

    Specially for disc wheels, I'd consider a rubber or plastic rim strip that not only offer the wider glue surface, but also has edges falling against the top of the "rim track" for lateral stability. This material outside the regular rim would also act as pinch flat cushion.

  7. #7
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    That guy I saw I think 2 years ago already Cloxxki. But back then I didn't knew what I was seeing. Maybe we're not talking about the same guy, but it looked like crossmaxx disc hubs laced to Ksyrium rims, with some dugast tires on top of it!
    If You want Plush, Buy a Couch...
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  8. #8
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    This gus was running a V-only setup on a PRO WINNER labeled basic looking frame in so-so sponsor colors.

  9. #9
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    I believe Ritchey made the Innovader as a 45 mm 700c tire for a while. Shiggy?

  10. #10
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by sean350
    I believe Ritchey made the Innovader as a 45 mm 700c tire for a while. Shiggy?
    Not that I recall.
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  11. #11
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    is that possible?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ninko
    Maybe we're not talking about the same guy, but it looked like crossmaxx disc hubs laced to Ksyrium rims, with some dugast tires on top of it!
    does anyone know (or have tried) to lace a crossmax hub to ksyrium rims? using which spokes? are the spoke heads/beds the same btwn the two wheelsets? seems unlikely but for 29er trekking on fireroads it could be a good set up if not too much edging was called for.

  12. #12
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by mathewsen
    does anyone know (or have tried) to lace a crossmax hub to ksyrium rims? using which spokes? are the spoke heads/beds the same btwn the two wheelsets? seems unlikely but for 29er trekking on fireroads it could be a good set up if not too much edging was called for.
    Why bother? Mavic/Hutchinson UST go 29er
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  13. #13
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    This is what I was thinking of:
    http://www.worldclasscycles.com/ritchey_zed.htm

    700 x 42 Z.E.D.

    Very similar tread to what you'd posted.
    -Sean

  14. #14
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    While the Zed is the largest 42 I'm aware of, the tubular I saw really was wider. I suppose it was a 26x2.1 stretched to match the ~29x1.9 casing. Already in 2004 there were reports that world class XC stars had such tubulars made, just in case, with their sponsor's treads.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by sean350
    This is what I was thinking of:
    http://www.worldclasscycles.com/ritchey_zed.htm

    700 x 42 Z.E.D.

    Very similar tread to what you'd posted.
    -Sean
    Unfortunately, those tires are out of production. It is the perfect tire for the back of my monster cross bike. Anyone know if they are still available somewhere in the US?

    Mark

  16. #16
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloxxki
    While the Zed is the largest 42 I'm aware of, the tubular I saw really was wider. I suppose it was a 26x2.1 stretched to match the ~29x1.9 casing. Already in 2004 there were reports that world class XC stars had such tubulars made, just in case, with their sponsor's treads.
    No need to stretch the 26" tread. Just use the tread from more than one tire.
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy
    No need to stretch the 26" tread. Just use the tread from more than one tire.
    Having stretched a 26x2.35" Fast Fred tread-only over a bald 2.1 casing, I would think that this is the easier of approaches. 2 spots for the tread to align and stay in place? I'm pretty sure the Ksyriums had one-piece 26" treads on there.
    For a 36" tubular (don't get me started...) I'd use two, yes.
    Klok - XC - Skate - Ski

  18. #18
    mvi
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    I saw a picture of Museeuw on the weight weenies board , that showed Johan on a MTB in a beach race nwith big 650C? tubulars on carbon rims.
    Will look for the link.

  19. #19
    mvi
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  20. #20
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    At the UCI races 650c is actually very common. Easily half a dozen of them in the Benelux Cup Elite race last sunday. Racing Ralph and Comp S and such treads are popular. Rarely see the (probably slow) Tufo's anymore.
    650c looks quite large as the tubular is generally a bit smaller than the usual 2.1 casing. The half inch of rim size then adds up.
    A friend has 650c Comp S Dugasts, even with the original casing still attached to the tread. Corners like nothing else, he says.

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