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  1. #1
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    Pivot 429 Carbon or Santa Cruz Tallboy

    Which one would you go with?

  2. #2
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    Um... is a Carbon 429 available?
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

  3. #3
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    yes, just announced. Check out their website.

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    Wow that was quick... I heard some rumors but didn't know it was available already...

    I think for the sake of being one of the first ones to get your hands on the Carbon 429 its a no brainer!
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

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    429

  6. #6
    Carbon & Ti rule
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    Out of those 2, 429
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    Looking to get my first bike and these are the two bikes I was looking at. I thought I was going to buy the Tallboy simply because of Carbon...

    What is the 429 carbon price? And availability?

  8. #8
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    Ride 'em both and then decide....
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    If rear tire clearance isn't an issue, then definitely the Pivot. This one looks awesome, but still wish they would have done a 529.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyjack View Post
    Ride 'em both and then decide....
    Where do all you people live that can actually test ride a out of the norm bike? There's not even a dealer in my state that carries a SC or better yet a Pivot! I doubt anyone on here has even swung a leg over a 429 carbon yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    Where do all you people live that can actually test ride a out of the norm bike? There's not even a dealer in my state that carries a SC or better yet a Pivot! I doubt anyone on here has even swung a leg over a 429 carbon yet.
    +1! Only thing I can ride within a 5hr drive is Trek & specialized!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    Where do all you people live that can actually test ride a out of the norm bike? There's not even a dealer in my state that carries a SC or better yet a Pivot! I doubt anyone on here has even swung a leg over a 429 carbon yet.



    Arizona, you can demo virtually anything here. Go west young man. Oh, 429 carbon FTW!

  13. #13
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    Any idea how the 429 frame is going to be constructed? Research how the frames are built first!!!! I'm not a carbon expert and someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I would look for a single lay up not glued together tubes.

  14. #14
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    Here is an Email I received from Pivot about the 429c

    Thank you for your email and interest in our bikes.

    The final weight hasnít been published yet, as we are not in final production mode. It will be around ľ lbs lighter than the alloy frame, putting it as one of the lighter frames on the market. It will begin shipping in small quantities in late November, early December.

    Please let me know if you have any other questions.
    Best regards,

    Daniel Limburg | Terrestrial Sales Manager | 1829 West Drake Drive Suite 104 | Tempe, AZ 85283 | office: 480-467-2920 | cell: 480-371-4661 | fax: 480-467-2930 | email: daniel@pivotcycles.com | skype: daniel.limburg | Home | Pivot Cycles - Mountain Bikes for XC, Trail, Downhill | Home - BH Bikes


    1/4 of a lb lighter than the alloy? Doesn't sound like its going to "one of the lighter frames on the market" to me... I hope its more like a 1/2 lb...
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

  15. #15
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    I wonder if their numbers are strewed by the direct mount F. derailleur and PF92 BB wights added to the frame weight package?


    I really like my Tallboy Carbon, and I think originally many stated that they didn't "trust" carbon for their type of riding which made it more appealing to those that opted for the 429.

    Originally the biggest turn offs about the 429 was the geometry..particularly the longish stays, but it appears the they have shortened them down to 17.65"....still longer than the Tallboy, but not by much.

    I think for many, the most appealing thing is a "Carbon DW-Link" XC Racer that is also suitable for trail...I guess. Sounds exactly like the Tallboy, but with DW-Link

    BTW..before everyone gets excited about them offering size "Small" check the geo..its a 23" TT which is equal to the medium of the Tallboy...but with slightly more standover.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    Where do all you people live that can actually test ride a out of the norm bike? There's not even a dealer in my state that carries a SC or better yet a Pivot! I doubt anyone on here has even swung a leg over a 429 carbon yet.
    I'm in Boston area. I test rode a TB for a month before ordering mine. Another shop that deals Pivot's offers shorter test rides (weekends), I'm sure he'll have a carbon 429 as soon as they're shipping.
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  17. #17
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    I live in S. Florida and up until 2 months ago, both Santa Cruz and Pivot out of the same shop. They stopped carrying Santa Cruz due to allegations that the shop was illegally exporting their bikes south of the border. I am both sad and mad at SC with this situation..

    I would like to take the Pivot for a ride, rode the aluminum one of course....but it didn't ride nothing like my Tallboy..but then again, I typically ride a Ti SS so I am not so much in the market for another Carbon FS 29er.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by KaneK View Post
    +1! Only thing I can ride within a 5hr drive is Trek & specialized!
    Here in Orange County, California you can name the bike you want and you can demo or test ride in a parking lot anytime you want.

  19. #19
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    Parking lot demos can be good, but if I'm going to drop this kind of cash on a bike, I want to get it out in its natural environment first. And I know that's unfortunately tough to do with bikes like this because of cost and lack of dealers. Well worth it, though.

    As for the original question, if it rides as well as the Al 429 (or better!), then the 429 in a heartbeat!! I'm looking forward - sort of - to demoing one eventually. I say sort of, because it might cost me money....

  20. #20
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    The Winner Is .....

    My final 3 bikes were the Jet 9, Pivot 429 and TallBoy.c. All very nice bikes and great companies. Pivot carbon 429 is not out for another 6 months, plus they have been in business for only 4 years. A tad green. Niner was nice and probally would have been equally happy with the Jet 9. But the winner is a BlueTall Boy.c. A very solid company, with good customer support, or so I've been told. I did your typical research and found nothing but great reviews. No demos were available, so I was limited to a parking lot ride. For the home trails I ride the TBc is a great fit. Also, it will handle out west trips as well. TBc is currently being built and I should have it by this Monday.

  21. #21
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    Congrats on your choice!

    And not that it matters, but yes, Pivot has only been around for a few years (5, I believe). However, Chris Cocalis, the owner, has been around a lot longer. He started Titus in '91, so I think you could be pretty darn comfortable that Pivot knows what they are doing and not worry about that aspect, at least.

  22. #22
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    I find it interesting that so many people are quick to recommend the pivot over the tallboy. Considering the tallboy has been around for a few years already and has been highly reviewed by so many people and publications I would think that the tallboy would be the recommendation at this point in time. Maybe a year down the road I'll think otherwise but At this point the tallboy is the obvious choice in my opinion.
    My disclaimer to this post is that I do own a tallboy carbon. I have been intrigued by the pivot bikes (5.7 carbon looks very sweet) but I've yet to actually see one in a store or on the trail. I'm in Canada so perhaps the haven't arrived by dogsled yet.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeriderguy View Post
    Considering the tallboy has been around for a few years already and has been highly reviewed by so many people and publications I would think that the tallboy would be the recommendation at this point in time.
    I dunno... the people that I trust the most seem to all unanimously agree on the major pitfalls about the TB including myself.

    I would assume the recommendations of the 429 over the TB would be those who prefer a decent pedaling platform.
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ace5high View Post
    I dunno... the people that I trust the most seem to all unanimously agree on the major pitfalls about the TB including myself.

    I would assume the recommendations of the 429 over the TB would be those who prefer a decent pedaling platform.
    Interesting. I've only ever seen very positive reviews of VPP. Each to their own I guess- they do take a bit of experimenting to find the sweet spot as sag is crucial to setup on vpp. However I cannot say I've ever seen a review of
    A vpp bike (intense or sc) that faulted their pedaling platform. But hey I guess I learn something new everyday

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeriderguy View Post
    Interesting. I've only ever seen very positive reviews of VPP. Each to their own I guess- they do take a bit of experimenting to find the sweet spot as sag is crucial to setup on vpp. However I cannot say I've ever seen a review of
    A vpp bike (intense or sc) that faulted their pedaling platform. But hey I guess I learn something new everyday
    Its just an opinion that some of us ex TB owners share, and a fine line to walk when critiquing one of the all time most popular FS 29ers

    Not a lot of people are likely going to be quick to point out its flaws... There are some things the TB does well, and I have a feeling the people (like myself) that it did not suite well are comparing it to at least the Top 2 or 3 FS 29er pedaling platforms in existence, so it is a relative opinion...
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

  26. #26
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    Ace5high,
    Can you elaborate on what you feel the TB's weaknesses are? Thanks,
    dew

  27. #27
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    Here my two cents:
    1. The Pivot is $300 more than the Tallboy Carbon ($2500 at CC v. $2800)
    2. I have a Tallboy Carbon and absolutely love it. It wanders a bit on really slow climbs, but it allows me to climb things I normally wouldn't.
    3. No grease ports on the Pivot. Pivot says they are not needed.
    4. There are way more Tallboys out there than Pivots, so for originality you might consider the Pivot.
    5. Speaking of grease ports and pivots, the DW links places the lower pivot above the bb, where as the VPP on the SC places the lower pivot below the BB. I get nervous i could snap off the grease port on my SC. However, i never use it, so, not sure it is an issue.

    I love the SC. It is the best bike I have ever ridden. You won't go wrong with either one.

  28. #28
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    Ace,

    I don't want this to come as me scrutinize you or your taste, riding style, or decision for switching from the Tallboy, you have your reasons, and I will respect them. Different suspension react differently in different climbing situations. What works great in the smooth doubletrack style climbs of North Carolina doesn't necessarily work well on the loose rocky gnar out in Arizona..thats been my experience. I am not sure how much experience have with riding the Tallboy outside of Florida or the Giant you are on now..but I can tell you from experience that the Tallboy is a much more versatile climber in many more situations than many of the other bikes out there. It does have a more active suspension while climbing than say a DW-L or Maestro, but when you absolutely need grip, from my own personal experience...the VPP just does it better in the situations are tougher. Of course if you only ride in the SE, climbing and pedaling performance aren't as necessary..most of it is so short it doesn't matter..and the long flats they are all pretty equal.

    Hell for me, I can't really even justify using it in anything here in Florida..especially when its all doable on a SS relatively around 2:1.

    I've had my Tallboy since early 2010 and its been out to AZ, NM, UT, MI, NC, SC, GA, TX, AR, OK, PA, NJ, VA, MD, WI, and IA. I think its seen quite a large variety of trail riding, different types of terrain, different types of climbing and descents...enough for it to be fair to say that it truly is a strong bike in everything XC and trail. I have spent plenty of time on a Giant AX29, Spec SJ FSR29, some time on the 429 (AL), BMC SF29, Jet9 and others..and I would say of all the bikes that I have ridden..there is only one other bike that I would actually consider....the Devinchi Atlas RC. The Split Pivot, thru-bolt, and short stays make for a pretty spectacular combination. The 429 and Giant AX29 and Jet9 all pedal great..but they excel at smooth climbs...I started to see shortcomings when I started riding chunk.

    In that time, I have replaced one axle bolt because I over torqued it...SC had a whole new set of bolts to me 4 days later..you can't even get that from Giant if you were to walk into the shop, and their stuff is guaranteed for life (bearings hardware) which matters to me most since those are the wear and tear parts that are usually the first to go on a frame.
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  29. #29
    Carbon & Ti rule
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeriderguy View Post
    I find it interesting that so many people are quick to recommend the pivot over the tallboy. Considering the tallboy has been around for a few years already and has been highly reviewed by so many people and publications I would think that the tallboy would be the recommendation at this point in time. Maybe a year down the road I'll think otherwise but At this point the tallboy is the obvious choice in my opinion.
    My disclaimer to this post is that I do own a tallboy carbon. I have been intrigued by the pivot bikes (5.7 carbon looks very sweet) but I've yet to actually see one in a store or on the trail. I'm in Canada so perhaps the haven't arrived by dogsled yet.
    Yet some of the people that say 429 have owned a Tallboy Carbon & sold them because they didn't like them, I am 1 of those people.
    Last edited by muzzanic; 08-09-2012 at 03:01 AM.
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  30. #30
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    My shop carries both bikes. I went with the Tallboy C.

    What dubdryver said, I can't say any better. The Tallboy can climb in the chunk outstanding and down hill it just carves it up. For the money the bike looks like something too, yet, the 429 for the money looks really terrible. Considering their anodized frames, which look awesome I might add, I was expecting so much more than that paint scheme. IMO, I give a vote for the Tallboy C. Its tried, true, and SC takes care of their customers waaaay after warranty. Not many companies do that, SC does.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by dubdryver View Post
    Ace,

    I don't want this to come as me scrutinize you or your taste, riding style, or decision for switching from the Tallboy, you have your reasons, and I will respect them. Different suspension react differently in different climbing situations. What works great in the smooth doubletrack style climbs of North Carolina doesn't necessarily work well on the loose rocky gnar out in Arizona..thats been my experience. I am not sure how much experience have with riding the Tallboy outside of Florida or the Giant you are on now..
    I wasn't going to respond to the above post because my intent was not to turn this into a TB bashing thread. Well at least thats the impression TB owners might get if I criticized anything at all about it...

    There are many short comings I could point out compared to the many many other FS 29ers I've owned and ridden up and down the east coast...But the TB is a cool and "Fun" trail bike. Ive said it before many times the amount of pedal feedback was more than I could stomach on a 29er FS platform. I know of many others that would agree with me on this. For everyone that might not be such a big deal, but to me it is, so it much has to do with particular taste. SC has some of the best customer service in the industry and MANY other manufacturers should learn a thing or two from them. At the end of the day, my Anthem is faster, bobs less, corners better (especially under suspension activation) is much better DH, handles chop and trail chatter better than the VPP, and holds more traction during climbing...

    While I'm at it, so you don't think Im being one sided, Ill provide a list of things I feel the TB is better at. It feels more alive on the trails, has more "fun factor", lets me loft the front wheel and manual easier, front triangle feels slightly stiffer, slightly more "cuttable" in tight switch backs (slightly), oh and I go over the handlebar slightly less
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

  32. #32
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    I must add:

    My Tallboy is the longest standing rig in my stable... I have changed many bikes in the last three years, but Tallboy was a keeper.

    Yes - I agree 100% that it has too much pedal feedback for a platform FS bike, which sucks during acceleration, technical climbs but the suspension design addresses this deficiency a bit - so it is not that bad.

    I also agree on the FUN factor... I can't put my finger on it, but this bike is simply the most fun bike for me to play around....

    3 years with the same bike - for me it is quite something...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace5high View Post
    I wasn't going to respond to the above post because my intent was not to turn this into a TB bashing thread. Well at least thats the impression TB owners might get if I criticized anything at all about it...

    There are many short comings I could point out compared to the many many other FS 29ers I've owned and ridden up and down the east coast...But the TB is a cool and "Fun" trail bike. Ive said it before many times the amount of pedal feedback was more than I could stomach on a 29er FS platform. I know of many others that would agree with me on this. For everyone that might not be such a big deal, but to me it is, so it much has to do with particular taste. SC has some of the best customer service in the industry and MANY other manufacturers should learn a thing or two from them. At the end of the day, my Anthem is faster, bobs less, corners better (especially under suspension activation) is much better DH, handles chop and trail chatter better than the VPP, and holds more traction during climbing...

    While I'm at it, so you don't think Im being one sided, Ill provide a list of things I feel the TB is better at. It feels more alive on the trails, has more "fun factor", lets me loft the front wheel and manual easier, front triangle feels slightly stiffer, slightly more "cuttable" in tight switch backs (slightly), oh and I go over the handlebar slightly less

  33. #33
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    I think they are both excellent. I spent a good amount of time on both (alum 429) before I bought my RDO. My take
    Pivot is stiffer
    Pivot suspension felt stiffer to me more racy
    Tallboy had feedback that was noticeable
    Tallboy was very fast for me on lap times
    Tallboy was better climbing and on downhill but I felt more confident everywhere on the Pivot. My lap times said otherwise as the TB was by far the fastest bike I had been on until I got my RDO.
    I would get a 120mm front fork on the TB if you go that route. Makes it a far more flexible bike

  34. #34
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    Here's a test I do when attempting to ascertain a bike's lateral stiffness. Stand next to the bike and apply lateral force to the crank arm in it's lowest position. The bike has to be on a surface so that the tires can't slide out sideways. The visible flex gives you a good indication of how good any frame can track in either aggresive uphill or downhill situations when different forces are apllied to each wheel ie. Porcupine Rim etc..... The more you weigh, the more flex you will generate and the more importance I would give to this test. Testing these two bikes in this way is quite revealing. J

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaymorr View Post
    Here's a test I do when attempting to ascertain a bike's lateral stiffness. Stand next to the bike and apply lateral force to the crank arm in it's lowest position. The bike has to be on a surface so that the tires can't slide out sideways. The visible flex gives you a good indication of how good any frame can track in either aggresive uphill or downhill situations when different forces are apllied to each wheel ie. Porcupine Rim etc..... The more you weigh, the more flex you will generate and the more importance I would give to this test. Testing these two bikes in this way is quite revealing. J
    It is a good test and all, but how could anyone do that with an unreleased bike...
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

  36. #36
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    You can't do this on an unreleased bike and it is not the end-all, be-all test when picking bikes. It's just a tool to use as you gather info on any bike purchase. J

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaymorr View Post
    You can't do this on an unreleased bike and it is not the end-all, be-all test when picking bikes. It's just a tool to use as you gather info on any bike purchase. J
    Oh I wasn't doubting you, I think its a good idea too. I do it a little different, by sitting on the bike and putting my pedals parallel to the ground brakes locked and then stand on it...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaymorr View Post
    Testing these two bikes in this way is quite revealing. J
    I misunderstood the statement is all, thought you were saying you did this on a Carbon 429
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

  38. #38
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    429 and TB

    Hey there folks. Looks like the 429 is going to be a little heavier than the TB. If the DW link is close to the design on the AL 429, the 429 C will pedal better than the TB for sure, and the TB will have slightly plusher suspension (but PUSH shock tuning can change this, for a price).
    The AL 429 has the most lateral stiffness of any suspension bike I have encountered, way more then the TB, this will be a factor, especially for a larger/heavier rider, if it is retained in the 429 C.
    The CS difference is inconsequential, but the sizing difference is real, those who like a longer top tube with low standover will have a preference for the 429 C.
    The TB is a proven bike, but the 429 C is from a very reputable manufacturer, with a proven track record. I would feel confident ordering a 429 C based on my experience riding a friends AL 429.

    Both bikes are great, and I could see one rider preferring one, and another rider preferring another: I value lateral stiffness, and efficient pedalling, and I prefer the low standover/longer top tube geometry of the 429 C, so that is the bike I would choose between these two, but I would also consider the Jet9 RDO and test ride it as well (I live in CO, test rides and demos are available).

  39. #39
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    Had a Tallboy and a Scalpel. The only carbon fiber frame I would consider now is the Pivot.

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    One HUGE consideration here between the SC and Pivot frames is the terrain you'll be riding. The lower front section of the rear triangle on SC frames hangs down pretty low. You can hit it on things like rocks that are sticking up if you do not pay close attention. The Niner frames are even worse in this case. Suspension designs between them are all equally efficient where climbing is concerned, so the Pivot wins out due to best in class ground clearance.

  41. #41
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    Rode my buddies Tallboy one day. I crapped my pants it was so fun. And I own, both a rip9 and sc nickel suspension bikes.
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  42. #42
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    you will smash your chain ring against rocks way sooner

    than any part of the frame... If this is a deal breaker between two bikes - I am a bit puzzled...

    But if that will float your boat - I guess it is ok...

    Pivot looks nice in pics... All bikes mentioned in this thread are really nice bikes... We are blessed that we can consider them as our next purchase....

    Quote Originally Posted by ambassadorhawg View Post
    One HUGE consideration here between the SC and Pivot frames is the terrain you'll be riding. The lower front section of the rear triangle on SC frames hangs down pretty low. You can hit it on things like rocks that are sticking up if you do not pay close attention. The Niner frames are even worse in this case. Suspension designs between them are all equally efficient where climbing is concerned, so the Pivot wins out due to best in class ground clearance.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    than any part of the frame... If this is a deal breaker between two bikes - I am a bit puzzled...

    But if that will float your boat - I guess it is ok...

    Pivot looks nice in pics... All bikes mentioned in this thread are really nice bikes... We are blessed that we can consider them as our next purchase....
    I agree they are all awesome frames. Unfortunately, (most) rocks are pointy, not tabletop flat. You're bound to eventually/periodically "miss align" your bike's trek through as you pass over/around rocks like these. So do this: The next time you see someone on a Tallboy or a Niner (any), ask to see the underside of the front section of the rear triangle. Count the bash marks and report your findings back here.

    All I am saying here is that it is far cheaper to replace a chain ring than it is to replace a rear triangle. In truth, I'd happily own any one of these frames. I'd just have to be "a little more selective" when rolling through rocky terrain on the SC or the Niner. See, I get a kick out of rolling directly over big rocks. My 429 clears everything so far...

  44. #44
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    I don't have to ask around. I own one.

    And for the last 3 seasons I have been riding the crap out of it here in the Canadian escarpment - very rocky and technical area...

    In 3 years - I have hit the bottom of the bottom bracket shell ONCE.

    I do not really see the issue that you pointed out in your post, but if that is your opinion - by all means.... I respect it...

    Below is the pic of my Tallboy after winning the race "All Weather Challenge" - very rocky and rough course, with lots of pointy rocks...



    Quote Originally Posted by ambassadorhawg View Post
    I agree they are all awesome frames. Unfortunately, (most) rocks are pointy, not tabletop flat. You're bound to eventually/periodically "miss align" your bike's trek through as you pass over/around rocks like these. So do this: The next time you see someone on a Tallboy or a Niner (any), ask to see the underside of the front section of the rear triangle. Count the bash marks and report your findings back here.

    All I am saying here is that it is far cheaper to replace a chain ring than it is to replace a rear triangle. In truth, I'd happily own any one of these frames. I'd just have to be "a little more selective" when rolling through rocky terrain on the SC or the Niner. See, I get a kick out of rolling directly over big rocks. My 429 clears everything so far...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Pivot 429 Carbon or Santa Cruz Tallboy-tallboy.jpg  


  45. #45
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    Might also depend on the crank being used? I ran 2x10 setup on my Tallboy and my large chainring did a good job of protecting the bottom sus link. I didn't ever hit mine either.... Now maybe someone with a 1X10 setup might have more issues with it...
    I do all my own stunts, but never intentionally...

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    And for the last 3 seasons I have been riding the crap out of it here in the Canadian escarpment - very rocky and technical area...

    In 3 years - I have hit the bottom of the bottom bracket shell ONCE.

    I do not really see the issue that you pointed out in your post, but if that is your opinion - by all means.... I respect it...

    Below is the pic of my Tallboy after winning the race "All Weather Challenge" - very rocky and rough course, with lots of pointy rocks...
    No offense. I just recall shopping for a used frame when I had narrowed it down to Tallboy/Jet9/429. ALL of the SC and Niner frames were bashed up in the aforementioned area of the rear triangle. That was proof enough for me.. for ME. I do not speak for you or every one else but I am quite sure that I bring up a point to consider...

    Cleaning off a muddy bikes SUCKS!

    Congrats on the victory!

  47. #47
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    As I said - we are all blessed that we can pick and choose among these great bikes...

    Carbon Pivot looks intriguing... It may replace my Tallboy next season, not because it is better than Tallboy - but because life is short...



    Quote Originally Posted by ambassadorhawg View Post
    No offense. I just recall shopping for a used frame when I had narrowed it down to Tallboy/Jet9/429. ALL of the SC and Niner frames were bashed up in the aforementioned area of the rear triangle. That was proof enough for me.. for ME. I do not speak for you or every one else but I am quite sure that I bring up a point to consider...

    Cleaning off a muddy bikes SUCKS!

    Congrats on the victory!

  48. #48
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    No way...

    Quote Originally Posted by tws_andrew View Post
    I think they are both excellent. I spent a good amount of time on both (alum 429) before I bought my RDO. My take
    Pivot is stiffer
    Pivot suspension felt stiffer to me more racy
    Tallboy had feedback that was noticeable
    Tallboy was very fast for me on lap times
    Tallboy was better climbing and on downhill but I felt more confident everywhere on the Pivot. My lap times said otherwise as the TB was by far the fastest bike I had been on until I got my RDO.
    I would get a 120mm front fork on the TB if you go that route. Makes it a far more flexible bike
    You can't just throw out a statement like "....until I got my RDO", and let us hanging.

    Give us the full report on the RDO vs. the TB. Sorry if this leads to derailment, but a discussion about high end 4" travel carbon fiber 29ers cannot leave out the RDO.

    My next bike, in a year or two will likely be one of these beasts, especially if Niner makes a carbon RIP. Love their suspension. Probably the best I've riden, and I love rocky, technical climbing.

  49. #49
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    Exactly!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Miker J View Post
    You can't just throw out a statement like "....until I got my RDO", and let us hanging.

    Give us the full report on the RDO vs. the TB. Sorry if this leads to derailment, but a discussion about high end 4" travel carbon fiber 29ers cannot leave out the RDO.

    My next bike, in a year or two will likely be one of these beasts, especially if Niner makes a carbon RIP. Love their suspension. Probably the best I've riden, and I love rocky, technical climbing.
    I ended up buying a JET9 RDO. Leaving this bike out is a HUGE mistake. The JET9 RDO has the best suspension ride/feel and is the best all around IMHO. I'm 6'5" 205 and can laterally flex the snot out of bikes. I can out of the saddle hammer it just like riding my SS still. The RDO feels so good out of the saddle and through the rough stuff at speed - it's amazing.

    OP - Both the Tallboy and 429 ride so different if you are keeping your decision at these two models. The 429 DW (3 hour lbs owner demo) has a better racing platform. Stiffer, tighter and crisp out of the saddle climber than the tallboy demo. 4" rear end that felt more like 80mm. The Superfly 100 also is a good racing platform close to the 429 but 2 pounds lighter!

    TB VPP way more active, squishy, sits in the middle to 2/3's of the travel feeling, bobs more climbing. More active feeling descender than 429, very active and plush - more bottomless feeling. Low bottom bracket hits roots in the southeast, but can probably learn to time once you get it. It was an issue though and a work around for me. Got to ride both. I have a hard time believing the new carbon 429 is only 110 grams lighter than alloy version, that has to be wrong info or pre production weight frames. 100mm travel, same price as a Tallboy but 1+ pound heavier frame weight (???) is going to be a tougher sell.

    My two pesos.

    peace, PF
    Last edited by PanFry; 08-02-2012 at 09:56 PM.

    EXCUSES ARE THE NAILS IN THE COFFIN OF FAILURE.

  50. #50
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    I found the RDO far superior to these bikes as well. I am 6'5" and 225 and also flex everything and it drives me crazy. I have am a bike whore and have owned the following 29ers (Rumblefish, Lynskey Pro29 SL, Rip9 X2 and Jet9 RDO). I also currently own 2 Knolly AM, FR bikes and usually buy and sell 2-3 bikes a year. I rode the TB and 429 for a week before I bought the Rip9 (RDO was not out then) and I found the Rip far superior and the RDO is another step up.
    All these bikes are great but
    Niner suspension has the best of both worlds. Extremely plush feeling on the down while I find zero bob in and out of the saddle up. I found the TB to bob heavily for me and the rear end flex was not appealing at all. The pivot didn't bob but just felt far too stiff and twitchy on the way down no matter how I played with the suspension. For me the RDO is able to work like a race bike AND a light fast Rip9 which was my favorite bike until I got the RDO. With a 120 fork the RDO will destroy most everything out there on the down until it get's tech. On most of my trails it is honestly faster than my Rip. TB is fast up but RDO is faster due to lateral stiffness for me. Hard to describe but for me the RDO is the ultimate bike until they make a Carbon Rip 9. Whereas the TB had the fastest laps for me on my 45 min loop until I rode the RDO the RDO is yet another 15% faster. I can race the RDO with light tires or set it up with medium tires and a dropper post and ride everything and even work over some some bigger bikes unless it is very tech. I am itching to ride a TB LTc or await a carbon 140mm Niner. For me the Niner stiffness and suspension is to the 29er what Knolly suspension and suspension is to 26er. It doesn't flex, it doesn't bob, it gets the traction needed without feeling harsh and it allows you to be very very confident in your riding. TB was fast but I never felt confident

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