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  1. #1
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    And Now for Something Completely Different









    It feels big, heavy and squishy.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  2. #2
    Schipperkes are cool.
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    Pull the travel spacers in the fork to get 140mm!
    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee
    Better suited to non-aggressive 125# gals named Russell.
    I ride so slow, your Garmin will shut off.

  3. #3
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    Bring back the ByStickel into the rotation!

  4. #4
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    How about a pro review?

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMcG View Post
    Bring back the ByStickel into the rotation!
    Highly unlikely.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by banks View Post
    Pull the travel spacers in the fork to get 140mm!
    I done did that 130 rear, 140 front.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  7. #7
    Missouri sucks...
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    Looks flexy...

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    It feels big, heavy and squishy.
    Like a diaper that's been on too long?

    Serious, I think I like. Imagined doing the same with my FSR.
    Sometimes, you need to go fast enough that the trail is a blur to find clarity. -- Wild Bill

  9. #9
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    Your bike has a muffin top.


  10. #10
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    A nod is as good as a wink to a blind horse. MP
    A Fatback'd Lefty for who life IS a Beach

  11. #11
    workin' it Administrator
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    I'm confused...what is this?
    Try this: HTFU

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Feelygood ! View Post
    A nod is as good as a wink to a blind horse. MP
    Faces 3rd.

  13. #13
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    Ha, Bontrager rubber on a Stumpy.
    maladroitus extraordinairus

  14. #14
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    Ride observations:

    This is my first ever frame from the Great Satan, or "Them Who Shall Not Be Named."

    I kind of got it by accident. I was hunting around for something with decent geometry for a single speed full suspension bike, and sort of settled on Specialized or a Tall Boy. This old/new 2010 frame came up at a price I could not pass up, so here we are.

    I converted it with a Rohloff tensioner that only needed a little tweak to clear the largish 22 cog.

    Overall, the frame is very well thought out. Easy to build, but requires an immensely long rear brake cable due to under DT routing and all the excess required due to the monkey motion. I used a Reba 140 for the fork.

    On the trail, the bike feels big. Absolutely not as poppy as a Milk Money, but it has practically double the travel and weighs a couple pounds more (29 lbs). The freakiest thing to me is the way the rear suspension simply has no interaction with chain tension. I have never had a significant amount of time on an FSR type frame/bike set up for me. The rear truly is independent of the chain tension. The difference is subtle, but I do notice it. At times I was expecting a little rear traction loss on up type moves in ledgy terrain, the rear was just silent, dead and full of traction. I thought I could brake a little deeper with the rear in the loose stuff, but that was an even more subtle effect, could be my imagination.

    The Brain Shock: What a completely stupid idea. Especially on a bike with 130mm travel. I tried it on and off, and it became clear I preferred it all the way off almost immediately. Here you have a fantastic suspension design that honestly hardly bobs, even ridden as a single speed standing, and you trash its function with a stupid excessively spikey compression damper. I dislike it a lot. This is a fix for a non-issue, attached to a bike for I what I presume must be marketing reasons. Rant off.

    For the way I ride, I really like the feel of the suspension. I for the life of my can't see riding any bike where the rear stiffens up under power, especially in ledgy terrain or loose climbs. The pedal feedback would drive me nuts in ledges, and I want/need that traction when it is steep and loose.

    Most of my prior ride time has been spent on low linkage actived single pivot frames. The differences are minimal, but real.



    Personally, I prefer a really active suspension to one that resists bob. I just could care less about it and I don't really notice it.

    Anyhow, there is my FSR newby rant. It's a beautiful design burdened down by a stupid, unnecessary damping system.


    I did notice (and dislike) the extra 8-9mm of chainstay length on the Stumpjumper over the Lenz, but it is not a dealbreaker......so far. I seem to be able to get it to do what I want/need, but I haven't hit the real puckery stuff yet.


    The chassis is absolutely overkill for a pure rock bike. I realized that this A.M. It is just too much travel for slow tech. It is a lot of bike and even with the wuss 32X22 gearing it hard to push up steep inclines, and hard to sprint to gain momentum when I need it most. I found myself stalling a lot on ups I usually clean. The low BB can suck or be good depending on situation.

    The rear travel is very linear and sort of blows through travel, but I don't detect bottom out. My pedal strike issues and blow through improves somewhat as I added air. This frame seems to like sag somewhere between 20-25%. That is higher than I am used to with a 130mm rear travel bike. Air pressures also seem high, around 200-210 psi. I am used to setting 30-35% sag and about 160psi on the Lenz and letting the linkage deal with the bottom out. Maybe I'm just getting fat.

    It's a pretty amazing ride when pointed down though. I think it gives a Moth/Box a very strong run for their money in the trail bike category. It handles wonderfully on single track. It is a frame that will keep you out of trouble. Or get you in to it depending on your perspective.

    At this point I would absolutely recommend the Specialized to anyone in the market for an all trail type 29" FS bike. Just buy one without a Brain.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by skitchy View Post
    Ha, Bontrager rubber on a Stumpy.
    - 5 points

  16. #16
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    Looks way too complicated to me, to be a SS.
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  17. #17
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    I thought you had a Milk Money?


  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jncarpenter View Post
    I thought you had a Milk Money?

    Zee Milk Money, she ees dead. Thus the placeholder.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  19. #19
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    moving backwards

    Gave up a ByStickel for this?

  20. #20
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    It;ll be like your Niner RIP, up for sale shortly.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandyBoy View Post
    It;ll be like your Niner RIP, up for sale shortly.
    Possibly. I would take this bike 10 out of 10 times over that first gen RIP though.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  22. #22
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    lol it's like an identity crisis on wheels, i like!

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4x4runner View Post
    lol it's like an identity crisis on wheels, i like!
    My thinking too. It's like the wrong tool for every job
    Sometimes, you need to go fast enough that the trail is a blur to find clarity. -- Wild Bill

  24. #24
    A Surly Maverick
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    What happened to the Milk Money please ?
    A Fatback'd Lefty for who life IS a Beach

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by dr feelygood ! View Post
    what happened to the milk money please ?
    ^ this


  26. #26
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    That boy just aint right!

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Feelygood ! View Post
    What happened to the Milk Money please ?
    Yes, what happened to the milkmoney?

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by jncarpenter View Post
    ^ this
    I broke the Milk Money in half just behind the downtube weld. I heard it creaking during a ride and saw it 1/2 broken. I tried to get it back to the trailhead, and tried a "move" about a minute from the trailhead which finished the main frame off.

    The frame was just over four years old and lived a hard life for an XC racing weight frame. I certainly did things on it regularly that should not have been done on a frame that light. Anyway, I got my money out of it and have zero regrets. I had plenty of warning before complete failure.

    I owned it 3.5 years and that is the longest I have ever owned any frame. I have discussed with Devin having him build up a new front triangle with a heavy duty downtube, 30.9 seat tube, and tapered head tube. I will probably proceed in this direction eventually, but as with most one man show type frame builders, these things take time.

    In the mean time I wanted to explore the "Moth Money" 5 inch travel single speed concept, thus this bike.

    My current feeling after only a very short time is that the Camber at 110mm travel or Tallboy would be better candidates for SS conversion, at least in the rocks. I can't wait to get the Stumpy on to some higher speed trail tomorrow am because I think it is going to rip it up.

    I think this move was the final straw as it was the ride just before I noticed the crack:
    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/33842711?title=0&byline=0&portrait=0" webkitallowfullscreen="" mozallowfullscreen="" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="853" width="640"></iframe>

    STIL.

    A moment of silence for a beloved frame and one of my favorite ever bikes She was Milk Money serial number 01. The first of her kind.





    She may be born anew and improved like the Six Million Dollar Man, but until then I will 'speriment.

    E
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  29. #29
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    I saw a guy around my parts with a tallboy converted to single speed. I don't remember what tensioner was on it though, or when I saw it.

    I think that's a pretty good setup there, although a Cane Creek double barrel would really light up your life in terms of traction and shock performance.

  30. #30
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    30 second review:

    On open trail this thing is simply amazing. I believe it is the best handling bike I have ever ridden at higher speeds.

    Eating Crow about big brand bikes right now.....cough, cough...
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  31. #31
    THE CAPTAIN
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    Nice!

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    Possibly. I would take this bike 10 out of 10 times over that first gen RIP though.
    Interesting, that was at the time, their all time best seller... I rode mine for 2 years, never a peep, a creak, nothing, out of it, then sold it, (the frame) on Craigslist for $700 shipped to a triathelete in Indiana. I seem to recall you pieced yours out for components and made money on it too? Sounds more like an investment to me.

    My observation riding around the San Gabes is that round tubed aluminum in frames and rear triangles flexes like the dickens on granite spines locally, causing a lot of over correction at the handlebars. I also noticed the same thing on the rear end of a Santa Cruz Tallboy in carbon too.

    Glad the speshy is working out for you, but have to admit, a brain sounds retarded, for a shock.

  33. #33
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    1st drop. No trouble getting front up at all.

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/34757360?title=0&amp;byline=0&amp;portrait=0" width="640" height="472" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe>
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  34. #34
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    I have a few more rides on the Stumpjumper and have to say I like it. I basically have zero nits to pick. It rides great and does everything I ask of it.

    I am still banging pedals a bit, but it is more an issue of my unfamiliarity with the frame.

    The 5"X5" SS deal has grown on me, and I hardly notice all the squish any more. I do notice that my feet and elbows don't hurt as bad the day after a ride. The squish is dangerously addictive and makes any down move pretty easy. There is nothing I can't ride on this bike that I couldn't ride on any of my others, so it is not limiting me in any way.

    The best thing I can say about any bike is that is does not irritate me in some way while I am riding it. The best bikes fade invisibly into the background so my OCD can concentrate on something else. The Stumpy does just that.

    One big positive in my eyes is my ability to track stand/trial correction hop this frame pretty much indefinitely. I don't lose my balance so much as I run out of endurance. There is zero pedal kick back as I am hopping and balancing, trying to get up a ledge or something and I really like that.

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/35254331?title=0&amp;byline=0&amp;portrait=0" width="640" height="480" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe>

    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/35254613?title=0&amp;byline=0&amp;portrait=0" width="640" height="480" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe>






    Anyway, I am impressed by this mass produced frame. I fear it is Taiwan for me from now on.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    Ride observations:


    The Brain Shock: What a completely stupid idea. Especially on a bike with 130mm travel. I tried it on and off, and it became clear I preferred it all the way off almost immediately. Here you have a fantastic suspension design that honestly hardly bobs, even ridden as a single speed standing, and you trash its function with a stupid excessively spikey compression damper. I dislike it a lot. This is a fix for a non-issue, attached to a bike for I what I presume must be marketing reasons. Rant off.

    For the way I ride, I really like the feel of the suspension. I for the life of my can't see riding any bike where the rear stiffens up under power, especially in ledgy terrain or loose climbs. The pedal feedback would drive me nuts in ledges, and I want/need that traction when it is steep and loose.

    Most of my prior ride time has been spent on low linkage actived single pivot frames. The differences are minimal, but real.

    Personally, I prefer a really active suspension to one that resists bob. I just could care less about it and I don't really notice it.

    Anyhow, there is my FSR newby rant. It's a beautiful design burdened down by a stupid, unnecessary damping system.


    At this point I would absolutely recommend the Specialized to anyone in the market for an all trail type 29" FS bike. Just buy one without a Brain.
    Is there a model that doesn't have one? It sucks that this frame you seem so happy with is burdened with the extra weight of the unnecessary "brain"...

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wish I Were Riding View Post
    Is there a model that doesn't have one?
    I think the RP23 from the 26" FSRs may be available as a service replacement but I don't know if the travel specs for the 29" v. 26" match up. The 29" Comp has the Triad II but many say it's not the best shock as it is not as tune-able or reliable as the 23.

    If I were going to do away with my Brain, I'd look into the older RP23 from the 26". It has the proprietary linkage yoke and is only a matter of travel compatibility. The 2012 Expert Evo FSR 29 also has a 23. It might bolt right on but it has the new Auto-Sag and would likely be a lot more $$.

    That being said, the Brain doesn't have lock out but full-on keeps the back quite calm on longer, smooth surface climbs and about 4 clicks from full-on give me a feel comparable to a pro pedal setting. I typically leave it about 4-5 clicks from full-on for about 90% of my riding.
    Sometimes, you need to go fast enough that the trail is a blur to find clarity. -- Wild Bill

  37. #37
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    [QUOTE=Enel;8891754]1st drop. No trouble getting front up at all.

    Great prices - some sweet vintage stuff: http://classifieds.mtbr.com/showprod...product=101010

  38. #38
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    I agree with Enel's assessment about the Brain, thats because after years of trying to perfect it, it still isn't a 100% intuitive system..and often down right glitchy.

    I built up a 2010 SJ Comp for my friend about a year ago. He scrapped the whole kit and went with XX and XO 1x10. Both the Brain and Triad are plagued with high maintenance. Brain warranties are continual (spend a lot of time in a Spesh shop because I ride with the Store Manager) and my friend's Triad that came on his comp.

    Although he has dumped quite a lot of money into his bike, he does love it. It does handle well, and has great confidence on the downs. It really does allow a lesser rider to ride more (not implying anything Enel), and thats a good thing...

    I just wish it was made by someone else,
    but I don't worry too much about that, I love my Tallboy for what it does.
    SC Tallboy C
    Intense Spider 29 C
    Cervelo S2
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    Spech Tricross Expert
    Raleigh RX 1.0

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    I basically have zero nits to pick.
    What about the chainstay length? You originally said you could notice them being longer and didn't like it. Has your opinion on that changed? The Camber does have slightly shorter CS than the SJ.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/35254331?title=0&amp;byline=0&amp;portrait=0" width="640" height="480" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe>
    Now that's how you mount hot granite.

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    Buttery schmoove

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by LncNuvue View Post
    Now that's how you mount hot granite.

    Name:  SeduceGranite.jpg
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    Buttery schmoove
    Nice!
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by 12snap View Post
    What about the chainstay length? You originally said you could notice them being longer and didn't like it. Has your opinion on that changed? The Camber does have slightly shorter CS than the SJ.
    I don't seem to notice it any more, and it doesn't seem to hold me back. I don't know if it is how the FSR sags into its travel as I lean back or what, but I have not nose darted badly yet.

    What I need to do is ride the Stumpy and the LunchBox back to back. Then I can compare the Loop 140 to the Reba as well.

    I agree though that a Camber is a better SS conversion. Less travel, no brain, and cheaper to boot, but I don't think it comes frame only.

    Are you still on the Jet 9 and/or Milk Money?
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    Are you still on the Jet 9 and/or Milk Money?
    The Jet has been gone for a long time now. I got a Milk Money 4.0 late this past summer and it's even better than the 3.0 version. The extra travel feels a little less efficient but it's so much more plush. Definitely a worthwhile trade off. I currently have a new Spider 29 as my geared bike. I've only got a few rides in on it right now but I'm having doubts about me keeping it for very long. It feels long and I'm not used to that. I need to give it some more time next spring on my local trails, though. I want to try out a Camber myself as I think that might be a good alternative. But you're right, it doesn't seem to be available frame only.

    How much time do you have on the Loop fork? What do you think of it? I'm considering getting one next summer.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by 12snap View Post
    How much time do you have on the Loop fork? What do you think of it? I'm considering getting one next summer.
    Too little time to intelligently comment, but it seems decent so far.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/35254331?title=0&amp;byline=0&amp;portrait=0" width="640" height="480" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe>
    WTF? Rip those cheaters out of there and do it proper.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    WTF? Rip those cheaters out of there and do it proper.
    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/28135776?title=0&amp;byline=0&amp;portrait=0" width="640" height="480" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe>
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    WTF? Rip those cheaters out of there and do it proper.
    Actually, this comment reminds me of this fab-tastistic move (also on a Speshy):



    (sequence by Mikesee, rider unknown to me)

    If you look carefully, you can see how close the BB comes to the rock as it compresses. Moves sort of like this (only a lot smaller) are where I am noticing the detrimental effects of the low BB the most. Many times I end up scraping the bottom of my pedal on top of the rock. I seem to recall the rider above doing that on another attempt, but can't find the pic.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  48. #48
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    BB's and basketball players:

    You can't teach height.

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    A few thoughts, Behemoth/WB Loop 140 vs SStumpy/140 Reba

    I had a fun chance to ride the above frame/fork combos back to back today and here are a few thoughts:

    I rode them both on a very familiar to me, reasonably techy/chunky loop. Predominantly slow speed over chunk and granite with occasional bursts on to rocks and occasional "oh crap" steep, fast, short chutes & rollers mixed with a couple small drops to pretty much flat.

    The Loop fork is a loaner to me and I only have a few hours on it. I think it is not quite tweaked to the correct air pressure for me.

    Comparing back to back with the Reba, the Loop is stiffer for sure. The difference minor, but it is there. I prefer the Reba damper, especially the low speed compression tunability. I don't think the Reba dives as much under braking.

    The Loop is very linear. I was really blowing through its travel for the first part of the ride. I had been pretty happy with the air pressure I had in it for trail riding, but in the chunk it was just too divey. I upped the air spring pressure to 80 PSI and was happier. I think I could go higher, but am afraid of losing the small hit suppleness on the trail. Like I say, I am still getting it dialed in. It is not quite as linear as my old Manitou, but it is close.

    I would say the Loop is a viable competitor to a Reba for someone who likes a more linear fork. I may swap it to the SStumpjumper because the rear on that bike also tends to blow linearly through travel and it would match nicely.

    It was interesting riding SStumpy and Moth back to back. I would give the edge overall to the SStumpy, but it is very close and they both have their super powers. The minor differences, might even become less so with a differently tuned and/or maintained damper on the Moth (it is three years old and could use some love). The current one is a Fox RP23 with a highish compression tune, and it feels spikey at speed in rough stuff.

    This ride only has about 200 yards where I can get any speed, and at speed in the chunky stuff, the SStumpy is superior. There are only a couple medium speed smooth corners, but it was clear the SStumpy corners better also. The Moth is stiffer frame, and overall a little more nimble in the slow stuff. The SStumpy feels better on scary steep chutes and rollers. The Moth is a touch better for chunky climbs.

    I want to emphasize that all these differences are minor and I only notice them relative to each other, riding them back to back. If I rode either for a couple days I would adapt to the bike. My ability to clean any particular obstacle or not was more a matter of line choice, how I felt at the moment, and luck than it was affected by the frame/fork combo.

    Overall, I would be hard pressed to pick a winner. In the current config, I enjoyed riding the SStumpy more. It just felt better to me, a bit more comfortable and a bit more confidence inspiring. I think I will swap the Loop onto the SStumpy for a bit and see how that goes.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  50. #50
    Really I am that slow
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