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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockcrusher View Post
    I find the Jones is the perfect All Mountain rigid bike. Check out some of Aqua and Enel's posts for examples but on just ride I easily lofted it off a 2' to flat steep I didn't see and it just kept rolling along, I did an insane technical descent having never seen it and the only place I dabbed was in 2 of the multitudinous switchbacks and that was mostly because the trail was so raw that it was hard to see them and I would stall as I tried to set up a nose wheelie or ratchet turn in the few seconds I had before I ran off the trail. I am looking forward to hitting a few more trails I know so I can give it a baseline.
    I'm enjoying this thread. I'd say my Jones is easily the best bike I've ever had for low speed, steep technical riding, because it is so maneuverable and doesn't have the extra height that a FS bike has. That said I'm still glad I have my long travel bike for the days I want to go fast.

    Quote Originally Posted by rockcrusher View Post
    A lot of people will build up the Jones with a set of dirt wheels and a set of wheels with some touring style tires. You can get a frame pack from Jones for the Diamond and he is prototyping a frame pack for the space frames as well. The Jones loop bars are really comfortable and have ample room underneath to strap on all kinds of stuff. The more upright position is comfortable on long roads and dirt roads which I experienced at least 20 miles this past weekend. The Larry is really well suited to loose rock and still having a really nice roll on pavement and fast surfaces. I am sure the Nate would be killer but the thought of dragging that tire over smooth surfaces scares me. Not sure how the Husker Du would fair.
    I'm thinking about getting a normal 29" wheel for touring, but that's on a longer term list of stuff to do. Certainly the Jones is comfortable enough to be a great touring bike, but right now I'm very happy using it as a technical trail bike. I guess that shows what a versatile bike it is. The Nate is an awesome tyre for loose surfaces, mud, sand etc. (I found the Larry to be a bit floaty in slushy mud) I don't like using mine on pavement as I hate hearing the edges being ripped off an expensive tyre

  2. #27
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    so you went from MTX33 to Flow...
    do you miss something (width, stiffness,..)?

  3. #28
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    due to work and lack of daylight, i only get out once a week on my jones for the moment. i cant wait for lighter evenings and warmer weather. it's totally amazing though and every ride becomes a total adventure.

    now i've got over the initial excitement of getting it and focussing on riding, its quality and amount of thought jeff's put into its really shows through. its a far better bike than im a rider but its so confidence inspiring.

    last sunday, after pedalling/pushing up, i blasted down from the summit cairn of black hill (in the photo, in the pentlands, scotland) to the road in 9 minutes of pure exhilaration and grinning. its not even that technical but big enough to give a real sense of the mountains. and it was not nearly as clean by the time i got to the bottom.

    i know all my posts just go on about how great these bikes are but i'm really serious about how totally amazing i'm finding it. and i had'nt even seen one in the flesh, never mind having a spin on one before ordering it. it's everything and heaps more than i ever hoped for.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails My one bike (Jones Diamond/Truss Fork Review)-black_hill.jpg  


  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by wedge View Post
    so you went from MTX33 to Flow...
    do you miss something (width, stiffness,..)?
    For me the ability to easily use tubeless vs the problems I had getting the MTX rim to seat up was paramount. I appreciated the Sun Rim as it was a very strong one but the stans seems easily comparable in stiffness and is lighter plus it sets up tubeless so much easier. I must have spent hours trying to get tires up on the MTX. I live in the AZ desert so pinch flats, cactus and compliance rate high.
    Try this: HTFU

  5. #30
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    Thanks!

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockcrusher View Post
    You know i really wanted to try a fat bike but I feel that the evolution of the fat bike isn't done yet and in the next few years we are going to see it really take off as a do it all kinda bike. I am still doubtful that I would need a fat rear tire, especially in the AZ desert where I prefer my tires faster and harder and the q-factor thing scares me a bit too.

    Am fairly certain that the Jones and the Jones-esque design of a bike designed to be rigid and have a lot of rake and little trail is a well sorted design and it won't be evolving any more so I will have this bike a long time, at least until the rockcrawler do everything fat bikes show up. Then we'll see I guess.

    If you come down to Tucson way you are free to take it out and ride it to your hearts content.
    Nice build.

    I haven't ridden a rigid fat bike yet but the long travel FS Fat Bike that I built seems to roll over stuff better than anything in terms of less rolling resistance. I found that I was up a gear or 2 on the same trails compared to a non fat bike and seemed to be using less energy to get the same thing done when it wasn't too steep. When it is steep the extra weight of the bike is the only drawback and when it's really steep it seems like I'm cheating and getting up stuff that I never cleaned with any other bike. Going down fast steep you don't have quite the precision as with a skinny tired bike but inmost cases that doesn't matter because you just float over everything. If it's really twisty the big tires are perhaps a detriment.

    So... having a fat rear tire might be good for you too. Unfortunately you don't have that option with a Jones, at this point. He is also in the process of putting a 50mm rim into production so that rim with a Dissent tire might be a good middle ground for your rear.

    I too want to ride a Jones at some point. Blacksheep is doing some cool similar stuff too at least in terms of passive suspension and truss forks. I don't know how their geometry compares. You do also have the option of full fat with BS. I wish Jeff would offer it. The only thing you loose is a little heavier rear hub because it's best to run a 170mm, but you gain a lot of strength just like the 135 in the front and you don't have as much choice of cranksets needing to fit a 100mm bb shell. You can still run 29er wheels no problem, you just end up with tons of mud clearance.

    Btw my first nice MTB was also a Mantis. A 1984 (or 85?) XCR. My first MTB was a Spesh Stumpjumper Sport at the end of 1981. Except for the longish chain stays it's funny how modern bikes are coming back to the slacker HTAngles of that bike after getting sidetracked with roadish geometry for so long.
    Last edited by modifier; 02-15-2012 at 09:40 AM.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Houndog45 View Post
    Super cool bike....How well do you reckon a slow old guy who rides plain ol singletrack
    with very short climbs, intermediate rooty trails,would like this bike ??

    I ride a rigid bike and know I like that aspect....
    I don't own a Jones, but have been looking at one for some months now. I answer just because I'm in a similar situation to you: oldish, short steep climbs, rooty technical climbing & descending, slow pace and I generally only have about 2 hours at a time to ride. From what I've read, and as another poster mentioned above on this thread, the Jones sounds pretty ideal for slow speed technical riding. Though I'm not a great rider, I do like to beat techy sections. I'm a clyde, and often feel like my front suspension is more trouble than it's worth. Anyways, use the search function for "jones" and you'll find a number of informative threads on the bike. If there's a drawback to this bike, it's the added expense of building specialty wheels. Even if you bought the cheapest version--diamond frame with bladed fork--you're still looking at close to a grand extra if you want to have both a fat and a regular front wheel. Back wheel not included.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluestatevirgin View Post
    I don't own a Jones, but have been looking at one for some months now. I answer just because I'm in a similar situation to you: oldish, short steep climbs, rooty technical climbing & descending, slow pace and I generally only have about 2 hours at a time to ride. From what I've read, and as another poster mentioned above on this thread, the Jones sounds pretty ideal for slow speed technical riding. Though I'm not a great rider, I do like to beat techy sections. I'm a clyde, and often feel like my front suspension is more trouble than it's worth. Anyways, use the search function for "jones" and you'll find a number of informative threads on the bike. If there's a drawback to this bike, it's the added expense of building specialty wheels. Even if you bought the cheapest version--diamond frame with bladed fork--you're still looking at close to a grand extra if you want to have both a fat and a regular front wheel. Back wheel not included.
    You are totally right about the wheel however if you want to learn to build up a wheel by yourself this is the wheel to do so. The symmetrical nature of the 135mm front wheel makes building it up yourself pretty easy. Get the jones or paul hub for $160, DT comp spokes/alloy nipples in one length for each wheel for $160 and rims: P35 $70 and large marge $140 (or Vicious Graceful Fat Sheba $38 Vicious Graceful Fat Sheba Rim 26" 32h Symmetrical Spoke Holes) save the $60 or so for building and you are at $690. If you go through your LBS I'm sure they would swing you a deal of some percentage. Use the DT comps with brass nipples and save 40 bucks.

    Use the savings to get a cheap wheel building jig (Spin Doctor Truing Stand II - Terrifying Tool Deals this is what I use, a dozen wheels built on it) but this makes all the difference: Park Tool Co. TM-1 : Spoke Tension Meter : Wheel & Spoke

    Then you get 2 awesome self built wheels and you are Jones ready to go plus you learned something.
    Try this: HTFU

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockcrusher View Post
    You are totally right about the wheel however if you want to learn to build up a wheel by yourself this is the wheel to do so. The symmetrical nature of the 135mm front wheel makes building it up yourself pretty easy. Get the jones or paul hub for $160, DT comp spokes/alloy nipples in one length for each wheel for $160 and rims: P35 $70 and large marge $140 (or Vicious Graceful Fat Sheba $38 Vicious Graceful Fat Sheba Rim 26" 32h Symmetrical Spoke Holes) save the $60 or so for building and you are at $690. If you go through your LBS I'm sure they would swing you a deal of some percentage. Use the DT comps with brass nipples and save 40 bucks.

    Use the savings to get a cheap wheel building jig (Spin Doctor Truing Stand II - Terrifying Tool Deals this is what I use, a dozen wheels built on it) but this makes all the difference: Park Tool Co. TM-1 : Spoke Tension Meter : Wheel & Spoke

    Then you get 2 awesome self built wheels and you are Jones ready to go plus you learned something.
    Or you can use my line of reasoning which is the extra cost for wheels is offset by the savings you get avoiding a suspension fork.

  10. #35
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    what's the deal with the caution notes about Surly tires not working with those Vicious rims???

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluestatevirgin View Post
    Or you can use my line of reasoning which is the extra cost for wheels is offset by the savings you get avoiding a suspension fork.
    Well, the truss fork does cost as much or more than a suspension fork ($600). But the logics of getting one more bike is always more sound than reasons not to get a bike, so there's your trump card.

  12. #37
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    whats most impressive is that having a busy moderator schedule you found the time to write such a novella.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    For those reasons my By:Stickel hit the road in favor of the Jones.
    Please stop trying to re-ignite your argument at every turn

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoShizzle View Post
    whats most impressive is that having a busy moderator schedule you found the time to write such a novella.
    I am honored that you found time in your pro-reviewer schedule to post in one of my threads! It has been awhile since I garnered your attention. I feel like the luckiest gal at the ball!



    Try this: HTFU

  15. #40
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    ^ she looks like Jack Nicholson's wife toward the end of the Shining.. : )

    Jeff's vision gains more fans, it's great to see. After about 6 months my Jones is giving back more than I thought a bike would, it demands input but rewards it so well, you try something on instinct and the bike helps you get it right more often, it's so natural to ride and it's addictive. I've not had a bike quite like it.

    imo the best candidate for an all-round one-bike available by a long way - if you can 'go with it' enough, simply because it is so different. It's very different to the nimble, weight-back-a-bit, ti-framed, h-barred, fat tyred rigid ss I had before it, and much more capable technically. There's not much, if any, bikes or kit that I've been so impressed by before.

  16. #41
    fresh fish in stock...... SuperModerator
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    how did i miss this?...oh yah - monitoring rep threads in general...blah.

    dood - hell sexy build! **Mod high-5!** YAH!



    [facepalm]
    did i just e-high5?
    [/facepalm]
    Visit these 2 places to help advance trail access:
    http://www.sharingthepct.org/
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  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by CHUM View Post
    how did i miss this?...oh yah - monitoring rep threads in general...blah.

    dood - hell sexy build! **Mod high-5!** YAH!



    [facepalm]
    did i just e-high5?
    [/facepalm]
    I won't leave you hanging: **Mod high-5!** back at yah!


    and
    Try this: HTFU

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMcG View Post
    what's the deal with the caution notes about Surly tires not working with those Vicious rims???
    The fat crew over the the FB forum wondered the same thing. Kinda makes the process of getting tires for 80mm rims a little difficult if you eliminate the currently only supply of +3.7" tires.

    Many fat dudes mentioned that they have had no problems running surly tires on the GFS by the way.
    Try this: HTFU

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by p nut View Post
    Well, the truss fork does cost as much or more than a suspension fork ($600). But the logics of getting one more bike is always more sound than reasons not to get a bike, so there's your trump card.
    Ok, ok, but I was thinking of the regular bladed fork. Also, I like to add my other favorite argument in favor of a Jones: if the steel diamond and truss Jones is $1100, and, say, another similar steel Taiwan frame with a Reba or a Fox is $1300, then the cost doesn't seem so bad.

    Btw, for all the lurkers, just because the truss fork and spaceframe look cooler it doesn't mean the ride is leaps and bounds better than the diamond Jones and the regular fork.
    Last edited by Slow Danger; 02-16-2012 at 08:48 AM.

  20. #45
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    Update #2

    So I was able to go out today and ride a trail I have ridden before. Not tons before but I know it pretty well. The reason I chose this ride is that it is a super fun mix of technical climbing, descending, swoopy forest singletrack and exposed desert gnar descents. An all arounder if you will.

    To start with I had 6miles of earn your down to ride up in the name of Mt. Lemmon road. What amazes me is how transparent the larry tires is on this. It didn't seem like a huge tire and actually felt less obtrusive than a rampage or dissent like tire.

    I hit the first long dirt climb with enthusiasm but that enthusiasm soon waned with my scant fitness. I walked most of it. I did stop however to ride my bike in the snow!

    Frickin' snow

    Awesome. I took a breather at the top of the climb with the international press day excursion for Kona Bikes guys. 30 of the worlds poorest journalists riding the new Kona 29ers duallies.

    The view was choice.

    Climbing

    The descent immediately after this was a fall line drop, rock drops, wood stair steps and loose gravel. What I immediately noticed was how precise the bike is. I started just placing that fat tire where I needed it and it would stay. On my previous bike there was always a little trepidation with "would the wheel actually stay there?" and every so often I would hit something just the right way and the way I though the bike would go wouldn't be the way it would go. This time the bike went where i wanted it. I changed orientation in the air, with the rear brake, with the fork and bars and with body positioning.

    The middle section of this trail is a swoopy fun singletrack through pine forest. The bike steers well from the hips and carves turns like a slalom ski. The larry no doubt helps here. Through the mottled undergrowth I flew running on memory of trail I haven't ridden that much and into a huge dip I went. I reacted the minute my wheel dropped in and managed to hold on through the other side. Once again the shear stiffness of the fork amazed me. Usually on my previous bike there would be an associated "twang" of disc rotor touching the caliper and the wheel oscillating in the frame. This time nothing.

    The final descent is a ripping high exposure, technical descent. Lots of rocks, lots of drops and lots of speed. I pointed the bike where it needed to go, using the rear brake to steer a lot of time, lofting the front wheel off a lot of drops (at least ones where I could see the landing, no sense braking a wheel on a case), hitting all the little bumps that jumped through transitions, and picking some steep ass drop in lines to test my endo ability. Ultimately I found myself literally saying while i descended and railed around this one berm "this bike is amazing!" I rarely exclaim spontaneously while riding but it happened all the time on this ride.

    So the next ride I need to do is my local "I have a 10000miles on this course" loop and my other local "I have been riding this collection of rocks, cactus and gnar for the last 16years now and it still bites me" other loop. The bar is set there for me and I suspect I shall easily pass that bar on this bike.

    Try this: HTFU

  21. #46
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    Wait til you try it without the boat anchor wheel and tire!
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel View Post
    Wait til you try it without the boat anchor wheel and tire!
    I have a proper 29er front wheel but I put a tire with a patched sidewall on it and it is set up tubeless and I am pretty sure that patch will fail and I will be tubing it up anyway. I am lazy that way. Once I hit more local bench mark loops I will be trying the 29er wheel, but I really do like the Larry. It is totally competent on the rocky, hard stuff and in the loose stuff. The only negative I have found is, besides the weight, is it really overworks my front brake.
    Try this: HTFU

  23. #48
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    Rockcrusher, you still rocking the fat tire on the front of your Jones, or have you gone to a regular 29 inch front? Or do you switch a bunch and have preference? Lastly, you ever hear of anyone running a wide 26 inch rim on the back of a jones with a big old dh tire?

  24. #49
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    Im pretty near to pushing the button on a fat front. A year down the line on my jones and im just about there. Most folk on mtbr seem to agree its the way to go (or a worthwhile option).

    Some descents are too brutal with a 29 up front (or just much slower than id llike - i know its rigid). Toyed with the 29+ vibe but knards are gonna be terrible on what i ride i reckon.

    A bit more cush and the extra traction sounds great, and nate for a winter load of scottish muck.

  25. #50
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    I currently ride fat front, but mostly because I don't have a 29er wheel set up yet. I'm deciding whether to bother, though I'll be watching to hear about the rabbit hole/knard on a Jones.

    Right now I have a Jones 50mm rim. Husker Du and Q tubes superlight. I kinda love it. I don't know that I could get much lighter up front with a fat:
    Jones rim: 666 grams
    Tube: around 200 grams, I think
    Husker Du: 1150 grams

    I like the fat front so much, I'm trying to see how creative I can get out back. I kind of know the 29er rim/tire limits, but I'm wondering if a 26 inch rim would make any difference as far as large tire clearance is concerned. There seems to be some hinting that a 26x3.0 Knard is on the way.
    Last edited by Slow Danger; 10-03-2012 at 03:44 PM.

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