Page 29 of 29 FirstFirst ... 192526272829
Results 2,801 to 2,833 of 2833
  1. #2801
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,257
    BTW Mrdirtherder thank you for that last post. Very interesting.

  2. #2802
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    Quote Originally Posted by iowamtb View Post
    The ETT length on my B side is actually longer than the ETT on my Wolvie (600/604 compared to 587). So I don't think drops would be an issue at all. The one big difference is the BB drop is huge between the 2 bikes (70 for the Wolvie and 46/39 for the B side).
    the longer top tube on your b-side is the reason why putting drop bars on it will be hard. drop bars lengthen the reach of your bike by quite a bit, which is why a bike that fits you with drop bars is much shorter than a bike that fits you with flat bars.

    put another way, if you put flat bars on your Wolverine, it would feel much shorter, probably too short.

    you might be able to mitigate this with a short length, high-rise stem.

    I don't know if these will work for the way your bike fits, but have you looked into Soma Gator bars?
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  3. #2803
    wanna ride bikes?
    Reputation: *OneSpeed*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    4,170
    Quote Originally Posted by MrDirtHerder View Post
    Wow. New to this forum...
    Wow, great story and excellent links. I've just spent the last few hours reading all the stories in your links (not finished yet). Fascinating. I love the history and passion in these stories!!

    It makes me want to go for a 200 mile adventure on my SS cross bike, then come home and melt a credit card buying a ton of new frame building equipment. (One of those will happen for sure...)

    Thank you for your perspective, and for the info/history. Good stuff!
    Rigid SS 29er
    Fat Lefty
    SS MonsterCross
    SS cyclocross
    all steel

    Stop asking how much it weighs and just go ride it.

  4. #2804
    wanna ride bikes?
    Reputation: *OneSpeed*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    4,170
    Quote Originally Posted by iowamtb View Post
    Sorry to hijack this thread but this is on the subject of turning my Soma B side into a monstercross so here goes.....
    So I recently did this with one of my XC hardtails. It was a little too small with a suspension fork and a flat handlebar. I forget exactly but roughly a 100mm ish stem, wasn't enough. I then put on a rigid fork and On One Midge handlebars with TRP Spyre brakes, 2.1's, and a short riser stem (70mm +25 degree, so it reaches up as much as out). I also had to use a large number of spacers under the stem to get the handlebars up high enough. The goal there was to make the primary riding position in the drops. I never got the handlebars that high and ended up with my hands on top of the hoods most of the time.

    Bottom line: it worked, kind of. The frame I used was an old school SS XC race frame with a really low stack height. A Jamis Dragon One SS. I can't quite get the handlebars high enough or close enough to me. Well, I probably could with a longer fork and another new stem, but I got what I wanted out of it... proof of concept. I really like it but I'd rather not invest a couple hundred bucks on a non-ideal setup I'm not sure I'll be happy with long term. I've got a few hundred miles on it and have enjoyed the setup. My plan is to sell the frame and buy a Soma Wolverine. Funny huh.

    As it turns out that frame is just a bit to small to be a perfect HT MTB, and just a bit too big to be a perfect Monstercross bike. Take as many measurements as you can before attempting a conversion. It may or may not work for you.
    Rigid SS 29er
    Fat Lefty
    SS MonsterCross
    SS cyclocross
    all steel

    Stop asking how much it weighs and just go ride it.

  5. #2805
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,257
    Thank you for the advice. Honestly as itís set up now with the jones bars, i always said if big boom happened, it would be the bike of my choice. Like a mad max can do anything and pack anything machine. Itís just tough with all this eye candy floating around. It just makes me wish I owned a ton of inventory and could go out and change at will ďjust becauseĒ. My Wolvie rocks. My b side as it is now is my mad max firewood gathering machine lol!!!! I donít even have the money now anyways just window shopping but I am sure this is going to pass soon.
    Last edited by iowamtb; 11-08-2017 at 05:21 AM.

  6. #2806
    mtbr member
    Reputation: ciquta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Posts
    81
    thanks @MrDirtHerder for the story!

  7. #2807
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,257
    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    the longer top tube on your b-side is the reason why putting drop bars on it will be hard. drop bars lengthen the reach of your bike by quite a bit, which is why a bike that fits you with drop bars is much shorter than a bike that fits you with flat bars.

    put another way, if you put flat bars on your Wolverine, it would feel much shorter, probably too short.

    you might be able to mitigate this with a short length, high-rise stem.

    I don't know if these will work for the way your bike fits, but have you looked into Soma Gator bars?
    What u say makes sense but we are talking 587 to 600. 13 mm? Thats not enough to sneeze at is it? In general though I understand what u r saying. With my jones bars this bike has a 90 mm 30 degree Ritchey stem so the Jones bars are right at seat height.

  8. #2808
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by MrDirtHerder View Post
    Anyway, sorry for the long rant. New to getting on this forum (or any) because of other injuries my local shop/friends can't answer and stumbled upon some monster cross threads. Seems like a lot of anger towards purists which is surprising, so thought I'd share some history.
    No worries really, thanks for all those details and the links, super interesting to read all that

    Quote Originally Posted by MrDirtHerder View Post
    He really was fascinated with the idea of such a bike because any short comings the bike had, a rider who honed their strength/skills could make up for.
    All is said!

  9. #2809
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    Quote Originally Posted by iowamtb View Post
    What u say makes sense but we are talking 587 to 600. 13 mm? Thats not enough to sneeze at is it? In general though I understand what u r saying. With my jones bars this bike has a 90 mm 30 degree Ritchey stem so the Jones bars are right at seat height.
    That might work. You will have to experiment.

    The ETT on every flat bar hardtail that fits me is in the neighborhood of 600-615mm. Drop bar bikes I have owned are all 540-550mm. Personally, I could never make a bike that fits with a flat bar work with a drop bar unless a ran the stem backwards!
    Last edited by mack_turtle; 11-08-2017 at 01:15 PM.
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  10. #2810
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,257
    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    That might work. You will have to experiment.

    The ETT on every flat bar hardtail that fits me is in the neighborhood of 600-615mm. Drop bar bikes I have owned are all 540-550mm. Personally, I could never make a bike that fits with a flat bar work with a drop bar unless a ran the stem backwards!

    That explains it. We are different. My drop bar bikes have ETT lengths not a whole lot shorter than my mtb

  11. #2811
    wanna ride bikes?
    Reputation: *OneSpeed*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    4,170
    Quote Originally Posted by iowamtb View Post
    That explains it. We are different. My drop bar bikes have ETT lengths not a whole lot shorter than my mtb
    Just FYI it will be more accurate to compare the Reach number as opposed to ETT. I agree that the ability to use the same frame for both flat and drop handlebars is highly specific to the bike, the individual, and the intended setup.
    Rigid SS 29er
    Fat Lefty
    SS MonsterCross
    SS cyclocross
    all steel

    Stop asking how much it weighs and just go ride it.

  12. #2812
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    Quote Originally Posted by *OneSpeed* View Post
    Just FYI it will be more accurate to compare the Reach number as opposed to ETT.
    True. however, not to derail the thread, but, reach and stack are related in such a way that one is almost meaningless without the other. you can't isolate reach.

    If the drop bar postion on your Wolverine feels just right, it would be worth plugging the numbers from your B-side and your Wolverine into bikegeo.net and see what it would take to make the effective S+R close enough.

    what length fork is on your B-side? Soma lists two numbers on their geometry to signify how two different length forks affect the geometry.
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  13. #2813
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    Quote Originally Posted by iowamtb View Post
    That explains it. We are different. My drop bar bikes have ETT lengths not a whole lot shorter than my mtb
    everyone is different, but I just juxtaposed two bikes that fit me, one with drop bars and the other with flat bars. I used to ride a Soma Double Cross Disc cyclocross bike. it had Salsa Cowbell bars and a 90mm stem pointed up with 25mm or so of spacers under it. that's the green bike. my Jabberwocky has wide, flat bars and a 70mm stem pointed down with 15mm or so of spacers on it.

    I Beg You, More MONSTERCROSS-dcd-jabber.jpg

    I find that the calculations on Bikegeo.net are pretty accurate. it shows that the stack on my Jabber is about 10mm higher, but the reach on the DCD was 50mm shorter. 5 centimeters or about 2 inches. that's a lot! those extra two inches are there because of the extra length of a drop bar.

    you might fit differently. maybe your frame is a little shorter on your than mine is for me, but generally, if a flat bar bike fits you well, that is why it's going to be hard to fit it with drop bars.
    Last edited by mack_turtle; 11-11-2017 at 07:59 PM.
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  14. #2814
    mtbr member
    Reputation: pedalmunky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    248
    Thanks for the oral history Mr DirtH. Made for a facinating read. Loved the passion for simplification. Except for the Powerstrap mention, but oh well.

  15. #2815
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,257
    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    everyone is different, but I just juxtaposed two bikes that fit me, one with drop bars and the other with flat bars. I used to ride a Soma Double Cross Disc cyclocross bike. it had Salsa Cowbell bars and a 90mm stem pointed up with 25mm or so of spacers under it. that's the green bike. my Jabberwocky has wide, flat bars and a 70mm stem pointed down with 15mm or so of spacers on it.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DCD-jabber.jpg 
Views:	79 
Size:	43.5 KB 
ID:	1166937

    I find that the calculations on Bikegeo.net are pretty accurate. it shows that the stack on my Jabber is about 10mm higher, but the reach on the DCD was 50mm shorter. 5 centimeters or about 2 inches. that's a lot! those extra two inches are there because of the extra length of a drop bar.

    you might fit differently. maybe your frame is a little shorter on your than mine is for me, but generally, if a flat bar bike fits you well, that is why it's going to be hard to fit it with drop bars.

    After a lengthy discussion with Jeff Jones I ordered some new 710 2.5 rise bars, new chunky grips and a shorter stem. So I ended my mental want for dirt drops on this bike. Canít wait to see how this bike rides once itís done!

  16. #2816
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    69
    Fall single track. Thereís a new flow trail nearby. The berms and jumps on the monster cross is the most fun Iíve had on a bike in quite a while.





    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  17. #2817
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    13
    Thanks. Glad you found it helpful and enjoyable to read. Kinda find it odd that we're on these forums to learn, yet people are being so negative about those telling the true story. It's like, sorry but aren't you on here to learn? Or just to post pics of your bike you don't ride?

    Likewise, when people get upset about facts we have a problem. Also interesting how in this thread, people say "what does it matter?" yet in another thread in another forum on here they'll argue over 2mm of rim width or a degree of handlebar sweep or that a top tube is 10mm too short. All valid arguments, but seems like when they get in the monstercross thread the logic goes to hell.

    I'm with you. History is fascinating and I've been drawn in more to the history of monstrcross over time thanks to the Monstercross News page on FB. It's really pretty fascinating when you delve into it, because it is the perfect do it all and "just ride" bike in it's original form. Plus when you get into Matt Chester's head reading his post on his blog you really develop an appreciation for what he was going after and why the narrow definition mattered because you can see it in his writings on unrelated topics.

    Here's to knowing our history. Thanks for the kind words.

  18. #2818
    wanna ride bikes?
    Reputation: *OneSpeed*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    4,170
    ^ My new Monstercross frame will be here in a few days! Found a good deal and couldn't resist after all the stoke from this thread. Looking forward to new adventures, might even have to try some Power Grips.
    Rigid SS 29er
    Fat Lefty
    SS MonsterCross
    SS cyclocross
    all steel

    Stop asking how much it weighs and just go ride it.

  19. #2819
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Posts
    1
    Hi!
    I am new to the forum and would like to share my recent build (cyclocross ? montercross? not sure of which label) : "La Mule" is its name
    I found an old 1999 Trek 720 MultiTrack that I rebuilt into an all-rounder bike (gravel, groceries/errands, touring, cross...)
    Today's ride was the perfect test with a 20-mile route combining gravel, trails and road.I Beg You, More MONSTERCROSS-img_2477.jpgI Beg You, More MONSTERCROSS-img_2479.jpg

  20. #2820
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,257
    Quote Originally Posted by VelomaneCO View Post
    Hi!
    I am new to the forum and would like to share my recent build (cyclocross ? montercross? not sure of which label) : "La Mule" is its name
    I found an old 1999 Trek 720 MultiTrack that I rebuilt into an all-rounder bike (gravel, groceries/errands, touring, cross...)
    Today's ride was the perfect test with a 20-mile route combining gravel, trails and road.Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG_2477.jpg 
Views:	84 
Size:	210.1 KB 
ID:	1170404Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG_2479.jpg 
Views:	78 
Size:	198.7 KB 
ID:	1170405
    Nice!!

  21. #2821
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Posts
    8
    Mack-turtle, i loved the stack adn reach calculator site, thanks man. so, I have a Karate Monkey who has done kanza and a few land runs dropped with a soma gator bar, a litle extra stack and a short stem with a bit of rise and she has been slammable. Anyway, i work at a specialized shop and need to ride a specialized bike as my collection of Surly's n all city bikes is apparently... Anyway, thinkin of drop barring an epic hard tail. SO i have compared the geometry to a monkey and a few other touring rigs, and the take home seems to be this is a duper long bike. other than that no duper red flags. Seems it wouldnt be too terrible to put a stumpy stem on there and make her a drop bar beauty?! Spose my question is can anyone see why this would be a spectacularly bad idea or si there anything i am missing? My boss says it will ruin teh bike adn it is a terrible idea, i love me some drop bars though. This would be my first non steel bike, as well as my first bike with gears. drinkin a lil bit of dat cool-aid.

  22. #2822
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    223
    Quote Originally Posted by SurlySingleSpeeder View Post
    Mack-turtle, i loved the stack adn reach calculator site, thanks man. so, I have a Karate Monkey who has done kanza and a few land runs dropped with a soma gator bar, a litle extra stack and a short stem with a bit of rise and she has been slammable. Anyway, i work at a specialized shop and need to ride a specialized bike as my collection of Surly's n all city bikes is apparently... Anyway, thinkin of drop barring an epic hard tail. SO i have compared the geometry to a monkey and a few other touring rigs, and the take home seems to be this is a duper long bike. other than that no duper red flags. Seems it wouldnt be too terrible to put a stumpy stem on there and make her a drop bar beauty?! Spose my question is can anyone see why this would be a spectacularly bad idea or si there anything i am missing? My boss says it will ruin teh bike adn it is a terrible idea, i love me some drop bars though. This would be my first non steel bike, as well as my first bike with gears. drinkin a lil bit of dat cool-aid.
    I'm with your boss... that frame is not at all suited to drop bars ... get a sequoia if you have to ride a speccy


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  23. #2823
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    I still don't have the monstercross bike I want but here are a few lame attempts I have made:

    Bianchi Boardwalk- too long with drop bars, had to rebuild it with flat bars.
    I Beg You, More MONSTERCROSS-boardwalk.jpg

    Karate Monkey with dirt drops. just awkward
    I Beg You, More MONSTERCROSS-km-mxc.jpg

    old Scott Laredo with musasche bars. even with a stubby stem, I always ended up riding it on the ends of the bars
    I Beg You, More MONSTERCROSS-loreda-mush1.jpg
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  24. #2824
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    I plan to build a monstercross-ish bike on the cheap by converting an old hybrid from the local co-op. I usually ride a road/cx bike with a 545-555mm effective top tube or a mountain bike with a 600-615mm top tube.

    since I will be using an old bike for this and need to search to find the right one,* what should I be looking for in terms of size? it might be hard to get exact measurements on the frame as I search but I might be able to dig up geo charts on old bikes using my phone as I go.

    any particular frames that make good candidates? I am looking for steel, rigid, canti brakes, room for at least 40mm tires. I'd like to singlespeed it, which might require a tensioner.
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  25. #2825
    wanna ride bikes?
    Reputation: *OneSpeed*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    4,170
    ...
    Last edited by *OneSpeed*; 3 Weeks Ago at 06:29 PM.
    Rigid SS 29er
    Fat Lefty
    SS MonsterCross
    SS cyclocross
    all steel

    Stop asking how much it weighs and just go ride it.

  26. #2826
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    I have two candidates. Mid-90s steel

    Diamondback Ascent. 26er, so not strictly Monstercross. Needs a lot of work, tires, left crank arm. $50
    I Beg You, More MONSTERCROSS-fb_img_1513882526814.jpg

    Spec Crossroads Elite. Needs new tires to make it functional.

    I Beg You, More MONSTERCROSS-fb_img_1513882531854.jpg

    Which one will make a better gravel grinder with drop bars?
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  27. #2827
    wanna ride bikes?
    Reputation: *OneSpeed*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    4,170
    Does the crossroads use 700c wheels? You'll get the benefit of bigger hoops and more tire selection. Looks clean.

    The Diamondback looks pretty rough, rusty chain, missing parts. Probably been stored outside for a while.

    Of those two, I'd go Crossroads.
    Rigid SS 29er
    Fat Lefty
    SS MonsterCross
    SS cyclocross
    all steel

    Stop asking how much it weighs and just go ride it.

  28. #2828
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    I have two candidates. Mid-90s steel

    Diamondback Ascent. 26er, so not strictly Monstercross. Needs a lot of work, tires, left crank arm. $50
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	FB_IMG_1513882526814.jpg 
Views:	58 
Size:	190.0 KB 
ID:	1173465

    Spec Crossroads Elite. Needs new tires to make it functional.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	FB_IMG_1513882531854.jpg 
Views:	67 
Size:	180.2 KB 
ID:	1173466

    Which one will make a better gravel grinder with drop bars?


    Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk

  29. #2829
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by *OneSpeed* View Post
    Does the crossroads use 700c wheels? You'll get the benefit of bigger hoops and more tire selection. Looks clean.

    The Diamondback looks pretty rough, rusty chain, missing parts. Probably been stored outside for a while.

    Of those two, I'd go Crossroads.
    +1... And I'd use the DB cranks

    Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk

  30. #2830
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    I swapped the Ascent for the Crossroads. It has a long way to go, but it mostly needs bars, levers, and tires.
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  31. #2831
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    45
    Loving this !!!


    Quote Originally Posted by Smithhammer View Post
    Gospel troof.

  32. #2832
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    for those of you who have more budget than I do:
    Vassago Fisticuffs frame $400 instead of $600
    w/ fork and headset <$520

    Fisticuff Frame
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

  33. #2833
    mtbr member
    Reputation: mack_turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    7,090
    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    I swapped the Ascent for the Crossroads. It has a long way to go, but it mostly needs bars, levers, and tires.
    this project is seeming less and less optimistic. I spent two hours rummaging around the local co-op and came up empty. my goal was to find some functional tires, drop bars, brake levers, a stem, and a crankset that would hold a single ring (the cranks on the bike have a weird BCD for a hybrid triple). the Yellow Bike Co-op is huge and has TONS of old bike parts. I quickly learned that all the good stuff has been picked over and finding what you are looking for is like finding a needle in a hay stack. i have a new found respect for people who can successfully build interesting, functional Frankenbikes.

    my first order of business was to find a stem and handlebar that might work and it turns out that upright quill stems that fit around the bends on a drop bar are extremely rare. i finally found something but it was extremely short and I have no idea if that is going to result in a fit that works for me. success: 2/10

    I then started digging through the brake levers in seach of a pair of functional aero drop bar levers. most of the levers were right-side only, missing parts, or had rubber hoods that were rotting off. after about 30 minutes, I find a pair of Diacompe levers that matched! there were missing the inside cable ferrules. another ten minutes of searching allowed me to steal some ferrules that would work. the clamps were missing so I dug through a giant box of drop-bar lever clamps and tried about 20 of them. nadda. these Diacompe levers require some oddball clamp that I will probably never find. success: 0/10

    a friend gave me some old LX cranks with a BB and a 44t Surly ring. Awesome! success: 10/10.

    I found some 35mm wire bead hybrid tires. this was after I mostly gave up on the project. $5 each. success: 3/10.

    at this point I was 99% certain this is not worth the effort. I already added up the cost of buying the stuff I need new but cheap (stem adapter, modern drop bars, levers, etc), and the project was several hundred dollars, well on the way to buying a new bike that is rust-free, has decent double-walled wheels, knobby tires, disc brakes, etc. why bother tinkering with an old hybrid that is better off as a hybrid when I could wait a little while and buy something that works 100 times better?

    I am putting the bike back together with new/ old tires, new cables, and selling it for what I put into it.
    Thorn in your Sidewall
    Vassago Jabberwocky

Page 29 of 29 FirstFirst ... 192526272829

Members who have read this thread: 499

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •