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  1. #1
    jimfab
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    GEAX AKA TNT and Stans flow hoops?

    Anybody have any experience with the GEAX AKA TNT 29er tire and a Flow rim? Do they fit any better than the Saguaro TNT or is it the same ol story? I would like to try the AKA's but not if they fit ( or dont fit ) like a TNT Saguaro. I am sure the non-TNT fit just fine.

    Thanks- JF

  2. #2
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    I have heard that the TNT style tires from GEAX are the problem, not the specific model. If you have not gotten them yet go for the Folding as I have read they seal up just as nicely as the TNT do on other rims without problems like the TNT on the Flows.

  3. #3
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    Hey guys... what does TNT mean? Sorry for the dumb question.

    I use the Sagurao on Arch rims and they are the best set up I have ever used? whife uses one for the front on here Crest wheels..again 100% zero problems.
    Monte
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  4. #4
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    My American Classic 29 tubeless wheels have Geax Barro Race TNT tires mounted and they fit extremely well.
    Mount and fill them with no problems sealing.
    They aren,t as light as I,d like though at 675g and 687g.
    The TNT label is Geax version of UST, it refers to " Tubes No Tubes"

    Dave

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by DAVE LEVETT
    My American Classic 29 tubeless wheels have Geax Barro Race TNT tires mounted and they fit extremely well.
    Mount and fill them with no problems sealing.
    They aren,t as light as I,d like though at 675g and 687g.
    The TNT label is Geax version of UST, it refers to " Tubes No Tubes"

    Dave
    Roger that, thanks. Mine are the folding bead standard model.
    Monte
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  6. #6
    jimfab
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    TNT stands for Tubes. no tubes. The TNT are there tubeless version with a tougher sidewall. They are only TNT if they say somewhere on the side.

    I was hoping that the good folks at GEAX would have listened to the feedback on the TNT saguaro tires and fixed the problem with the new AKA Was hoping to find someone who has tried it first hand. there is always the chance they did......

    For those who have never had the pleasure, fitting a TNT 29er tire to Stans rims is almost like trying to fit a 26 onto a 29. No Joke, Most other rims work just fine. there is something with the stans design that dose not jive with the TNT. I have a picture somewhere i will try to find and share. Dont be mistaken, the non TNT tires fit just fine on stans rims.

    Thanks-JF

  7. #7
    jimfab
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    This is about as good as it gets with the TNT, broke 2 irons getting it past this point. Yes the bead is at the bottom of the rim.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails GEAX AKA TNT and Stans flow hoops?-geax2.jpg  


  8. #8
    Its got what plants crave
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    Most UST beads are too tight for Stan's from what I hear.
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  9. #9
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    jmfab - I bought some park steel tire levers which work but I ended up scratching rim. it was the hardest tire I've ever put on.

  10. #10
    jimfab
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    I ended up with the spin doctor steel core levers, I also scratched up my rim pretty good. I really like the GEAX TNT tires, but the fit is a deal breaker. I may try the Bontrager FR3 next. The team edition is said to fit the stans rims and is not much more weight than the TNT.

    Cheers- JF

  11. #11
    change is good
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    My TNT AKAs came in @740gm and my Team FR3s @900gm. The FR3s mount up well to Flows and lose very little air. The TNTs were a B to get on my Enve rims, but the AKAs were a little easier than the Sagauros. The AKAs are noticeably faster, because of weight are tread design.

  12. #12
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    Is it just a problem with the Stans hoops?

    It ended up being about a 20 minute wrestling match, to put a TnT Saguaro on my Bontrager Dusters, which wasn't too different from other tubeless tires I've mounted.
    Definitely worth it too.

    EDIT: I saw you answered my question in post #6.

  13. #13
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    I never had any problems mounting the Tnt saguaros to my flows, wasnt that impressed with the tires though, wore out too fast. the FR3s are good, the Specialized purgatorys are even better (2.2 version)

  14. #14
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    I ordered some TNTs and was shipped the regular tube-type version.
    I can tell you the casing seems identical to TNT... burly as hell. They aired up no problem, never weep, and don't lose pressure.
    I don't have stan's rims on the bike they're on, but as far as Geax tubetype tires and tubeless, it works great.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  15. #15
    jimfab
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    Thanks everybody for all the good info! I think i have decided to give the team FR3's a go around this time. I LOVE LOVE the GEAX tires, and 95% of the time the TNT's are bulletproof. However i have some remote trips planed that require that I be able to fix a flat on the trail. In 5 attempts to put a tube in a TNT on a stans rim i have failed and destroyed the tube. For local rides where the longest walk was 10 miles this is fine with me. But what i have planned walking is not an option. I considered using the non TNT, they are normally pretty tough, but I need more on this trip. I currently am running non TNT ( tubeless ) on both my bikes and i love em. I am glad to hear the AKA's are a bit better than the saguaros, I will give them a go on my next local set of tires.

    BTW... How come it is a common deal to order TNT's and get standard? That has also happened to me and a friend. I Am guessing it is because QBP last i checked does not have a separate PN# for the TNT????? It is also vague on most popular web sites..... That is my best guess.

    Thanks again- JF

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimfab
    Thanks everybody for all the good info! I think i have decided to give the team FR3's a go around this time. I LOVE LOVE the GEAX tires, and 95% of the time the TNT's are bulletproof. However i have some remote trips planed that require that I be able to fix a flat on the trail. In 5 attempts to put a tube in a TNT on a stans rim i have failed and destroyed the tube. For local rides where the longest walk was 10 miles this is fine with me. But what i have planned walking is not an option. I considered using the non TNT, they are normally pretty tough, but I need more on this trip. I currently am running non TNT ( tubeless ) on both my bikes and i love em. I am glad to hear the AKA's are a bit better than the saguaros, I will give them a go on my next local set of tires.

    BTW... How come it is a common deal to order TNT's and get standard? That has also happened to me and a friend. I Am guessing it is because QBP last i checked does not have a separate PN# for the TNT????? It is also vague on most popular web sites..... That is my best guess.

    Thanks again- JF
    I have had this same problem too on ordering TNT and getting the std ones. I chatted with one of their local reps at a swap meet and he said TNT version of tires are in real short supply right now. He wasn't sure what was going on though.

    I love the Geax TNT tires. Tough, respectable weight, and grippy compounds.

    For what it's worth, TNT tires are hard to put on my Mavic 819 rims, but not impossible. You have to make sure you get the bead all the way in the "UST channel" on the rim. Otherwise, it isn't happening...........
    Lead by my Lefty............... right down the trail, no brakes.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by ziscwg
    I have had this same problem too on ordering TNT and getting the std ones. I chatted with one of their local reps at a swap meet and he said TNT version of tires are in real short supply right now. He wasn't sure what was going on though.

    I love the Geax TNT tires. Tough, respectable weight, and grippy compounds.

    For what it's worth, TNT tires are hard to put on my Mavic 819 rims, but not impossible. You have to make sure you get the bead all the way in the "UST channel" on the rim. Otherwise, it isn't happening...........
    weird... sounding less like a coincidence.
    i didn't know about the QBP thing.
    so there is even variation among "standard" tires with ETRTO-spec (tubeless) beads, not surprising i guess.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by meltingfeather
    weird... sounding less like a coincidence.
    i didn't know about the QBP thing.
    so there is even variation among "standard" tires with ETRTO-spec (tubeless) beads, not surprising i guess.
    why would a standard tire have a tubeless bead?
    I dont know how much faith I put into any of the "tubeless standards" seems like UST is getting a bit vague , someone mentioned Bontrager rims being UST with the strips?? wouldnt that make any ghetto setup with a rim strip UST?
    some of the tires lately have been pushing the limits as well. Dont get me wrong, I prefer tubeless ready tires and a true UST rim , but especially for 29" there isnt much selection for UST

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan0
    why would a standard tire have a tubeless bead?
    it wouldn't... that's not what i meant, i meant the tubeless "standard" as in conforming to a standard specification, which is published by the European Tire and Rim Technical Organisation (ETRTO).
    Quote Originally Posted by dan0
    I dont know how much faith I put into any of the "tubeless standards" seems like UST is getting a bit vague , someone mentioned Bontrager rims being UST with the strips??
    it's not vague... it's a very specific quantitative description of the bead shape published by the ETRTO. there is no requirement that the rim not have holes or not use a strip or tape to seal it... never has been, Mavic has just been successful in creating that illusion, whether knowingly or not.
    Quote Originally Posted by dan0
    wouldnt that make any ghetto setup with a rim strip UST?
    no. the bead has to conform to certain dimensions, and for clarity, "UST" is just a trademarked logo, the actual specification of tubeless tires is published by the ETRTO. Mavic published the standard for free, but requires a licensing agreement if you want to use the UST logo.
    Quote Originally Posted by dan0
    some of the tires lately have been pushing the limits as well. Dont get me wrong, I prefer tubeless ready tires and a true UST rim , but especially for 29" there isnt much selection for UST
    the 29er UST selection is limited to two models from Maxxis and maaaybe some NOS Geax tires from ~2 years ago that are no longer in production.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by meltingfeather
    it wouldn't... that's not what i meant, i meant the tubeless "standard" as in conforming to a standard specification, which is published by the European Tire and Rim Technical Organisation (ETRTO).

    it's not vague... it's a very specific quantitative description of the bead shape published by the ETRTO. there is no requirement that the rim not have holes or not use a strip or tape to seal it... never has been, Mavic has just been successful in creating that illusion, whether knowingly or not.

    no. the bead has to conform to certain dimensions, and for clarity, "UST" is just a trademarked logo, the actual specification of tubeless tires is published by the ETRTO. Mavic published the standard for free, but requires a licensing agreement if you want to use the UST logo.

    the 29er UST selection is limited to two models from Maxxis and maaaybe some NOS Geax tires from ~2 years ago that are no longer in production.
    I wasnt commenting on the etrto standard, I was commenting on the Mavic UST standard
    if you have a copy I'd like to see it, so far no one has been able to provide one

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan0
    I wasnt commenting on the etrto standard, I was commenting on the Mavic UST standard
    if you have a copy I'd like to see it, so far no one has been able to provide one
    there is no "UST standard." UST is a trademarked logo, that's it. The standard that UST tires are constructed to is ETRTO.
    I don't have a copy of it. I've asked a few times if anyone was interested enough to throw in some cash to buy it, but haven't gotten enough bites. You can buy it here. If you can find enough people interested enough to throw in USD$20, I'm game.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by meltingfeather
    there is no "UST standard." UST is a trademarked logo, that's it. The standard that UST tires are constructed to is ETRTO.
    I don't have a copy of it. I've asked a few times if anyone was interested enough to throw in some cash to buy it, but haven't gotten enough bites. You can buy it here. If you can find enough people interested enough to throw in USD$20, I'm game.
    you and me , thats $40, shiggy?

    I do think there is more to it than just a logo, otherwise anyone could license the logo and call any wheel or tire UST

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan0
    I do think there is more to it than just a logo, otherwise anyone could license the logo and call any wheel or tire UST
    well... with a logo comes a license agreement that the licensor has to sign off on, and any imaginable condition could come with that, so you can't just license the logo if you want to... Mavic's got to agree to it.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by meltingfeather
    well... with a logo comes a license agreement that the licensor has to sign off on, and any imaginable condition could come with that, so you can't just license the logo if you want to... Mavic's got to agree to it.
    so , in order to use the UST logo you have to pay Mavic a fee and follow their standard for tubeless

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan0
    so , in order to use the UST logo you have to pay Mavic a fee and follow their standard for tubeless
    i guess if you want to confuse things by collectively calling a bunch of individual license agreements a "standard" without really knowing that they are a standard, since they are more than likely confidential, individually negotiated, and could therefore easily be different, sure.
    Mavic does a pretty good job of confusing standards on their own (e.g., ERD & hub spacing), but if you want to help in that... why not?
    my guess is that the UST licensing agreements reference the ETRTO standard, which is actually a standard and is not "theirs."
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

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