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  1. #1
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    Can you make a large frame fit when you normally ride a medium?

    Got a fantastic deal on a new 2018 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro...but it is a size large.

    I normally ride medium frames.

    Will I be able to compensate for the longer reach by changing the stem from 40 mm to 30 mm with a Salsa Bend 2 bars with 23 degree sweep?

    Gonna try it (waiting for bike to arrive)...if it doesn’t work...I will be selling it.

    Just wondering if anyone else has tried something similar.

    Thanks.
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
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  2. #2
    > /dev/null 2&>1
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    It totally depends. Are you borderline M/L? Or, right in the middle the recommended size for a Medium?

  3. #3
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    My legs are large, my torso is small
    my fat is small
    my 2 hardtails are med and large
    you need to grab a few milimiters many times
    first adjust your saddle height, you should know it, it keeps your knees painfree and healthy, generally if you can ride 4-5 hours painfree you are ok
    then slide your saddle all the way forward again you will test if your legs are still fine, a woman design saddle helps me so some testing might be required, also a neutral seatpost(no setback or reversing a setback when they have 2 screws), this plays with your cranklenght so again testing is needed,
    obviously a shorter stem is helpfull
    all things where you save 5-20mm add up to kind of shorten your bike frame in a way that you will be confortable
    since we have different arms lenght, legs lenght, etc...
    only you can find out for yourself
    at 59 or at 19 we are not exactly the same
    i would say never ride a bike if your knees hurt, and give your upper body some time to adjust to a bike after you do your best to fit it properly
    i just buy used bikes and resale them if i cannot be confortable so it is more a time investment than a money loss but it is worth the trouble
    good tire for your use
    good tire pressure for your weight
    a proper fit
    lots of smiles

  4. #4
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    Frame size, even among the same brand is such utter BS, hardly anyone makes the same size M as the other, especially these days. What bikes are you accustomed to riding and what is it's Reach? Also, what length stems are you accustomed to running on these "medium" bikes? Look at the Marin and see what it's Reach for the size Large is, if it's grossly different (more than I'd say 40mm), then I'm going to guess your answer is no. Reach is the number you need to be looking at when trying to compare 2 or more frames to try to guess sizing and as said, your normal stem length.

    Have you ever used those Salsa bars before on a true trail bike? If you haven't, no matter if they bring the grips back to where you want, how they handle riding aggressive trail might leave you floundering a bit, so may not work - some love those alt bars on aggressive trails, some hate em, there's not normally a middle ground with them.
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  5. #5
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    Use a fit calculator and set your contact points based on that. There is plenty of ability to overlap fit on different size frames.
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
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  6. #6
    > /dev/null 2&>1
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    Yea, agreed with both ^ . The main factor would be the effective top tube / reach on this bike compared to bikes that fit you well.

  7. #7
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    Also the wider the bar the worst in such a case try about 680mm in 2 weeks you might get used to that(just move in the levers) cut later when you decide.

  8. #8
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    23 degree sweep bars are going to affect your reach. So you may fit on a large with those bars and a shorter stem. But they also affect your riding balance on the bike. And how you can put weight on the front tire is pretty important in cornering and climbing. Think about how you ride your current bike. Can you use those bars OK?

  9. #9
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    There used to be an idea that you should always downsize, as larger frames had goofy long headtubes and crazy high stand over height. Since most modern bikes have addressed this long ago and are now coupled with generally lower bottom brackets and shorter stays, you don't take the huge handling hit these days that you used to by going up a half a size or one size. The older the bike though, the harder this is to achieve. Look at the reach as mentioned above, don't be afraid to try a short stem at 35-40mm.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  10. #10
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    I go by reach when sizing. I tend to stick to about 425-440mm reach and I run 40-50mm stems.

    Looks like the reach for a large Wolf Ridge is a whopping 462mm and it already has a 35mm stem. A 30mm stem is the shortest I've seen. Don't think they get any shorter than that. Honestly, there isn't really much room to adjust the fit of the large Wolf Ridge. If you are in between sizes M and L, you can probably make it work. But if you're right in the middle of an M or borderline S/M, you're screwed.

    But hey, it's your money and it's a badass bike. Heard lots of good things about it. I personally wouldn't get it if it's not the proper size for me.
    I no longer like to party. But I like the idea of it.

  11. #11
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    It all depends on your particular body, preferences, where you ride,,, maybe rising the bar might help you, good luck!

  12. #12
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    There is no way I would buy the bike if the place you are getting it from won't make
    it fit you right. Don't spend the money if it doesn't fit right.

  13. #13
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    Thanks for all of the replies.

    Supposedly got a “brand new” Large for $4500 + 150 shipping...buy it now price was $8599...no one else bid, so I won it with the minimum bid.

    I’m not sure if these sell for retail or whether dealers make good deals on them...normally larger discounts are given for older model years.

    An incredible price for a new 2018 top of the line bike, also tax free.

    It will be delivered tomorrow.

    My logic was that if it is way too large and I don’t like it...I can sell it easily for what I paid for it and I will know whether I want to get a medium...Best case would be that I love it and also enjoy riding a large.

    I’ve only seen one for sale used $7500 on PinkBike now (but he upgraded fork, seatpost, etc.)..I’m watching to see how much it sells for.

    I suppose I might also find someone who gets a medium and wished they had gotten a large...not sure if anyone makes trades like that nowadays.

    I knew it would be a gamble when I bid on it, I really did not expect to win it...I thought for sure someone else would bid on it.

    I haven’t even figured out yet how I’m going to pay for it (PayPal 6 months interest free)...haha...one of the joys of being single...
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
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  14. #14
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    The difference between a large and a medium is only an inch or so. Yeah, it makes a difference but the point is that it's not that much so there are things you can do. Shorter stem, different bars, moving the saddle on the rails. It'll probably be fine.

  15. #15
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    OP, glad you came back and joined the conversation, sort of, but WTF kind of answer is that, you didn't address anything to do with the sizing, which is why you started this thread and why people bothered to respond. What is your current frame, it's reach stem length and bar width you're using etc??

    If you're comparing bikes from the same brand or more realistically, design year/time frame, if the OP has a bike designed 5 years ago when a Mediums reach was closer to 400mm, then he'll be SOL unless he's riding a bike that's way too small for him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Pig View Post
    The difference between a large and a medium is only an inch or so. Yeah, it makes a difference but the point is that it's not that much so there are things you can do. Shorter stem, different bars, moving the saddle on the rails. It'll probably be fine.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  16. #16
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    I have found this bike stem calculator tool to be useful in trying to find a stem that will aid in getting your hand contact points where you want them relative to stock, taking the variable of length and angle into account.

    Stem Comparison Tool | yojimg.net

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    OP, glad you came back and joined the conversation, sort of, but WTF kind of answer is that, you didn't address anything to do with the sizing, which is why you started this thread and why people bothered to respond. What is your current frame, it's reach stem length and bar width you're using etc??

    If you're comparing bikes from the same brand or more realistically, design year/time frame, if the OP has a bike designed 5 years ago when a Mediums reach was closer to 400mm, then he'll be SOL unless he's riding a bike that's way too small for him.
    LyNx,

    Can you see the bikes listed in the signature of my posts that include year? These are the bikes I ride (except PBJ, Dorado fork needs a rebuild).

    My most ridden bike is the ‘17 S-Works Enduro 29.

    I think the stem is 40 mm, bars are azonic flow 2 inch rise 750 mm with a 7 degree sweep.

    Just curious, can you ride a bike with the stem flipped backwards 180 degrees?

    I wonder how this might affect handling...might be fun to try...
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuyuna View Post
    I have found this bike stem calculator tool to be useful in trying to find a stem that will aid in getting your hand contact points where you want them relative to stock, taking the variable of length and angle into account.

    Stem Comparison Tool | yojimg.net
    Damn, that is cool, wished it included handlebars (with their sweep, rise and length).
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
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    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  19. #19
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    Like many have said, finding proper fit on newer geometry is different now. But in my opinion, all too often too much focus is applied to reach without discussing other factors.

    Going back several years everyone used to talk about Effective or Horizontal Top Tube length as THE crucial measurement for fit. Now reach is touted as the most crucial measurement. While I agree that reach should be part of fitting a new frame, I don't think that means the other frame measurements can be disregarded. Seat tube angle, bottom bracket drop, stack and top tube measurements will all affect the feel of a bike.

    I fell into this with my current frame. I have typically fallen between a small and a medium. The reach on my size small Riot is a lot longer than on my size small Satori that I had before. The STA is also a lot steeper, which I wanted, but this created an unforeseen problem for me. The top tube length on the Riot is actually much shorter than the Satori was. I disregarded TT length instead focused on the now popular reach measurement. This makes the cockpit feel very cramped to me and has resulted in myself making a lot of changes and adjustments throughout this season to now finally get to a point where I have come to the determination that I'm still not as comfortable on it as I want to be. The small Riot is just a bit too small despite it being the longest reach bike I have ever owned. The top tube length turned out to be a major player in fit and now I'm looking getting into a different frame despite the fact that I love everything else about the bike.

    Based on this experience, I believe that reach alone can't be the only dimension that is focused on when trying to determine fit.

    That's why some of the other contributors are asking you, the OP, what your other bikes are, what size bar and stem you usually run and so on. Because it all plays a part.
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  20. #20
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    Dang it, disregard my last two sentences.

    I started writing out my previous reply before you had posted this and then walked away and came back and finished the reply after and didn't see this post.

    However, are all of those bikes in your signature a size medium?



    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    LyNx,


    My most ridden bike is the ‘17 S-Works Enduro 29.

    I think the stem is 40 mm, bars are azonic flow 2 inch rise 750 mm with a 7 degree sweep.

    Just curious, can you ride a bike with the stem flipped backwards 180 degrees?

    I wonder how this might affect handling...might be fun to try...
    2016 Canfield Riot

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    LyNx,

    Just curious, can you ride a bike with the stem flipped backwards 180 degrees?

    I wonder how this might affect handling...might be fun to try...
    It might make braking less safe if with less weight on the front tire you end up with less grip, lets say i am not voluntering for that project.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by 33red View Post
    It might make braking less safe if with less weight on the front tire you end up with less grip, lets say i am not voluntering for that project.
    I agree with you. This might bring danger.

  23. #23
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    Those bars do nothing to change reach, like most alt bars they sweep forward then back so you don't need a new stem.

    I have the Answer and Niner versions of these bars and both do the same thing.

    Straight from Salsa's webpage:

    Bar sweeps forward, then back, to preserve stem length
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by StumpyandhisBike View Post
    Like many have said, finding proper fit on newer geometry is different now. But in my opinion, all too often too much focus is applied to reach without discussing other factors.

    Going back several years everyone used to talk about Effective or Horizontal Top Tube length as THE crucial measurement for fit. Now reach is touted as the most crucial measurement. While I agree that reach should be part of fitting a new frame, I don't think that means the other frame measurements can be disregarded. Seat tube angle, bottom bracket drop, stack and top tube measurements will all affect the feel of a bike.

    I fell into this with my current frame. I have typically fallen between a small and a medium. The reach on my size small Riot is a lot longer than on my size small Satori that I had before. The STA is also a lot steeper, which I wanted, but this created an unforeseen problem for me. The top tube length on the Riot is actually much shorter than the Satori was. I disregarded TT length instead focused on the now popular reach measurement. This makes the cockpit feel very cramped to me and has resulted in myself making a lot of changes and adjustments throughout this season to now finally get to a point where I have come to the determination that I'm still not as comfortable on it as I want to be. The small Riot is just a bit too small despite it being the longest reach bike I have ever owned. The top tube length turned out to be a major player in fit and now I'm looking getting into a different frame despite the fact that I love everything else about the bike.

    Based on this experience, I believe that reach alone can't be the only dimension that is focused on when trying to determine fit.

    That's why some of the other contributors are asking you, the OP, what your other bikes are, what size bar and stem you usually run and so on. Because it all plays a part.
    My Riot is a small, would have preferred a medium, but at the time I got it, only could find a used size small (and they were out of new mediums).

    Still great fun to ride the small, it is my Fox bike...has a Float X2, Fox 36 Talas, and a 150 Transfer post...seems more “flickable” than my other mediums...even though it might even be heavier.
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoTone View Post
    Those bars do nothing to change reach, like most alt bars they sweep forward then back so you don't need a new stem.

    I have the Answer and Niner versions of these bars and both do the same thing.

    Straight from Salsa's webpage:

    Bar sweeps forward, then back, to preserve stem length
    Thanks for the info...I wonder if the same is true of a Soma Osprey bar.
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
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    '15 Canfield Riot
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  26. #26
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    Major bummer - small parts box was lost in shipping and missing from box...missing front SRAM guide ultimate brake, Lev lefty seatpost lever, end caps for front wheel...not sure what else comes in the small parts box.

    Damn, I wanted to ride this weekend...took Friday off...
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    Thanks for the info...I wonder if the same is true of a Soma Osprey bar.
    Sorry about the misinfo on the bars. Looks to be the same forward then back for the Osprey. I haven't used these but it appears like your grip position will be farther back then a 9* sweep bar. Plus your arm/elbow is at a different angle. That may add reach on either alt sweep bars.
    400g. 710mm width. Width does affect reach. Wider brings you forward like a longer stem.
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  28. #28
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    That’s ridiculous. Your bike is clearly the wrong size. There isn’t much you can do to make it fit you. The stem on it is already 35mm. You can slide the seat forward an inch. Those bars look like they belong on a beach cruiser. I understand that they’re for comfort for people with joint problems. But they shouldn’t be used to try to fit in to a bike too big.

    Sell the bike. Make a profit. Get the proper size.
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  29. #29
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    JB, again you and your playing with frames trying to make them work. Looking at the geo of those bikes, that's a lot of extra reach you'll be gaining with the Large WR, 37mm over the Enduro, that's a crap load if you're already running the Enduro with a 40mm stem. You have 10mm in stem length, that's it unless you get one of the zero length stems that one manufacturer made when it was introducing "forward" geometry.
    Besides the reach, you've also got saddle position to think about and how/where you run yours relative to the bikes ESTA. If you are running your saddle dead centre on the rails on the Enduro with a 75* ESTA, then you'll need to slam the one on the Wolf Ridge forward to get it to the same position.

    I remember when you were trying to get the Prime and another bike dialed, that was a lot of trial and error and I'm not even sure what happened after that. Personally, I think that you'll find you can't make this frame work and will end up selling it.

    To Stumpy, while yes, you do need to take other measurements/angles into account for sizing, for something this dramatic, going by reach will give you a damn good idea of if it will or won't. Honestly the only other number I look at is Stack and BB drop as those 2 can affect effective reach, but that's normally only a quick glance as it's easy to see the differences there. As to ETT, that is irrelevent, as is ESTA basically, because quite frankly, you put your saddle where you put your saddle, the angle of the seatpost is irrelevant except to determine if maybe you won't be able to get your saddle where you want it with a straight or offset post.
    I'll be straight up honest, once I started going by reach and totally disregarded ETT, I got a lot better at figuring out fit and how/what to change to make a frame work or replicate another fit.
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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    JB, again you and your playing with frames trying to make them work. Looking at the geo of those bikes, that's a lot of extra reach you'll be gaining with the Large WR, 37mm over the Enduro, that's a crap load if you're already running the Enduro with a 40mm stem. You have 10mm in stem length, that's it unless you get one of the zero length stems that one manufacturer made when it was introducing "forward" geometry.
    Besides the reach, you've also got saddle position to think about and how/where you run yours relative to the bikes ESTA. If you are running your saddle dead centre on the rails on the Enduro with a 75* ESTA, then you'll need to slam the one on the Wolf Ridge forward to get it to the same position.

    I remember when you were trying to get the Prime and another bike dialed, that was a lot of trial and error and I'm not even sure what happened after that. Personally, I think that you'll find you can't make this frame work and will end up selling it.

    To Stumpy, while yes, you do need to take other measurements/angles into account for sizing, for something this dramatic, going by reach will give you a damn good idea of if it will or won't. Honestly the only other number I look at is Stack and BB drop as those 2 can affect effective reach, but that's normally only a quick glance as it's easy to see the differences there. As to ETT, that is irrelevent, as is ESTA basically, because quite frankly, you put your saddle where you put your saddle, the angle of the seatpost is irrelevant except to determine if maybe you won't be able to get your saddle where you want it with a straight or offset post.
    I'll be straight up honest, once I started going by reach and totally disregarded ETT, I got a lot better at figuring out fit and how/what to change to make a frame work or replicate another fit.
    I think you've made a huge mistake to get a"good deal". The Marin has a long reach for a large at 460ish.


    A high end frame will max out at 2500, pike 800, carbon wheels 800. Other bits 300, xt drive train and brakes 400. If you search you can get a frame for 2000, pike 500 and now you are in the same range as your deal with no compromises

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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by almazing View Post
    That’s ridiculous. Your bike is clearly the wrong size. There isn’t much you can do to make it fit you. The stem on it is already 35mm. You can slide the seat forward an inch. Those bars look like they belong on a beach cruiser. I understand that they’re for comfort for people with joint problems. But they shouldn’t be used to try to fit in to a bike too big.

    Sell the bike. Make a profit. Get the proper size.
    He doesn't have the bike together yet, and we don't how tall he is, how can you know it won't fit.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  32. #32
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    The Wolf Ridge isn't a very long Large size. If the OP is really too short, the seat tube will be the fly in the ointment. Not much point having a bike like this if you can't fit a 150mm dropper. There are 30mm stems out there, but I would pair them with "regular bars". 460mm is an extreme reach on a large these days.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    He doesn't have the bike together yet, and we don't how tall he is, how can you know it won't fit.
    If he’s flirting with the idea of getting extremely swept bars to try to fit the bike, I can assume that he’s probably too short for the bike.
    I no longer like to party. But I like the idea of it.

  34. #34
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    This will be interesting...frame looks gorgeous...

    The 150 dropper can be slammed all the way down, so it should be ok for my short legs.

    Don’t think I’ve ridden any large frames.

    The LBS guy that started putting it together told me he thinks I will be OK on it with the stock stem and bars on the large...he said some guys size up/down as a personal preference.

    If I really like it, will put 165 mm cranks on it.

    Might try the Osprey just for fun...will also try a 30 mm stem.

    There was an Mtbr.com article about a 25 mm stem/carbon bar combo last year...Pacenti PDent, which might be worth trying, but it is expensive and looks like it is currently sold out.

    The guy I got it from told me that small parts box was in the box when he shipped it...I won’t know till next week what else might be missing...still a good deal if I have to spend more money to get the missing parts.

    Since I bought it using PayPal 6 months interest free...I should be able to sell it before I have to pay for it...but if I love it, you will have to pry it from my cold dead hands...

    This bike’s new rear suspension system, the fantastic price, and the great reviews of this bike are all reasons why I took the gamble getting a large...I wouldn’t bother trying this with any other model bike.

    Based on initial reviews...I believe this bike will be bike of the year for MTBR and Pinkbike...
    Last edited by jbsocal; 10-28-2017 at 12:31 PM.

  35. #35
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    To have a pain free position(knees) the shorter cranks will push you away from the bar, your sadle will not be able go be moved forward as much.

  36. #36
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    ^^ this you'll raise the seat 5-10mm and probably have to slide it back.

  37. #37
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    Well, I scrounged up some used parts to get the bike built.

    The main thing that will allow me to ride this large is that the standover is fairly low and the dropper can be slammed all of the way down...with the seatpost at full height, my legs are almost fully extended.

    It does have a custom Lev with an offset...but I want to avoid changing it to one without an offset.

    Cranks are 175 mm...I think I will probably change them to 165.

    The stem already appears to be as short as it can get...LBS said he measured a 30 mm stem I bought but said the stock stem seemed shorter than the one I bought.

    Kirk Pacenti emailed me that he has a patent and the 25 mm stem PDent bars are now in production and will be available in early 2018.

    Not sure I will like the Soma bars so it has the stock Diety carbon bar....I like wide bars...might try the Soma Osprey and another riser and tilt it back a bit...after I ride the stock bars (never ridden carbon bars).

    I can feel the longer wheelbase, but I won’t know how I like it till I get on the trail, maybe this weekend.

    I didn’t put the stock tires on it...put a DHR II 2.4 WT in the back and a DHF 2.5 WT in the front...looks like a 2.5 might fit in the rear but not as much clearance.

    Will take pictures of it when I get a matching Guide Ultimate front brake (it temporarily has a Shimano SLX with an Icetec rotor in the front).

    I think I lucked out with standover and the dropper insertion depth....
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

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    You are going to be like $5k+ all in on a bike that doesn't fit and it's a Marin? That's too bad, you could've built up a Ripley or a YT with carbon wheels that fits you perfectly for that much $,probably less.

  39. #39
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    If you want some swept bars that don't go forward first, then take a look at the SQ Labs bars. Good review of them here https://nsmb.com/articles/defying-co...BA-sweep-bars/

    Thinking you're going to have to run a straight post to get your saddle where you need it, although I guess you might get lucky with getting it far enough forward by slamming it to the limits of the rails, but kind of doubt it.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    Got a fantastic deal on a new 2018 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro...but it is a size large.

    I normally ride medium frames.

    Will I be able to compensate for the longer reach by changing the stem from 40 mm to 30 mm with a Salsa Bend 2 bars with 23 degree sweep?
    .
    yes you can, but the nature of the bike can change.

    I am 5'7" and ride a medium Santa Cruz Highball with a 23" ETT. Found a good deal on a large Santa Cruz 5010. That bike had 24" top tube. Too long really. However I swaped from the 80MM stem down to a 50mm stem and it works great. The Highball I run a 90mm stem on that so both bikes feel similar in distance from seat and pedals to the bars. With the current trend of longer top tubes and shorter stems I am pretty much going in the right direction. Plus the Highball is my XC bike and the 5010 is more of my gravity, gnar bike so short stem and long TT fit right in. Plus in the 2nd generation 5010 SC increased the top tube lengths on all bikes.


    So you can do this, but it will have an impact as the 5010 does not feel as nimble as the Highball. Part of that simple geometry, but some is also do the longer top tube. However I am not looking for that bike to be super nimble. I want downhill stability to hit bigger lines than I would on my Highball. So for me it works.
    Joe
    '12 Santa Cruz Highball 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5",Vassago Verhauen SS 29" XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  41. #41
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    Use this- Stack and reach calculator

    Plug in the stats for your current bike, or a setup that you know fits you. Then plug in the geo of the new bike and see what it would take to get the effective stack and reach to be about the same.
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  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoePAz View Post
    yes you can, but the nature of the bike can change.

    I am 5'7" and ride a medium Santa Cruz Highball with a 23" ETT. Found a good deal on a large Santa Cruz 5010. That bike had 24" top tube. Too long really. However I swaped from the 80MM stem down to a 50mm stem and it works great. The Highball I run a 90mm stem on that so both bikes feel similar in distance from seat and pedals to the bars. With the current trend of longer top tubes and shorter stems I am pretty much going in the right direction. Plus the Highball is my XC bike and the 5010 is more of my gravity, gnar bike so short stem and long TT fit right in. Plus in the 2nd generation 5010 SC increased the top tube lengths on all bikes.


    So you can do this, but it will have an impact as the 5010 does not feel as nimble as the Highball. Part of that simple geometry, but some is also do the longer top tube. However I am not looking for that bike to be super nimble. I want downhill stability to hit bigger lines than I would on my Highball. So for me it works.
    Your situation was much different- you had a lot of length in the stem to lose. 30mm is 1.2 inches. The bike he bought already comes with a 40mm stem.
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  43. #43
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    Resale values of the parts alone is north of $3000. I'm sure OP can offload the bike without taking a bath if it doesn't fit.

  44. #44
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    ^ yes, but spend $5000 on a bike that may or may not fit. Then have to spend more
    to get the parts that may or may not make it fit?

  45. #45
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    I know I probably should not have gotten a large and could have spent the money on a different bike...that is not the subject of this thread.

    I measured my Enduro 29 from middle of seat to middle of stem - 24 in.

    Measured Wolf Ridge Pro - 24.5 in. (Seat is forward to rear max line).

    I expected the reach difference to be longer.

    On my Enduro 29’s, I ran droppers without an offset (reverb and transfer)...switched to a Fall Line with the offset (dropper has a replaceable head that can be either offset or not)...I really liked the offset a lot more on the Enduro 29...but that is a shorter medium frame.

    The Enduro 29 and Wolf Ridge both come with offset droppers.

    I expect it to feel too big...I’m really looking forward to riding it on the trail this weekend.

    An option I also have is to swap the Fall Line with the no offset head to the Wolf Ridge and put the custom Lev with offset on my E29...no new parts needed (might need a longer cable)...I want to ride the offset first.
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  46. #46
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    Hope it works out for you and I'm guessing it will.

    Not true of all bike these days but I'll bet some don't have big dimension changes going M or L , also that fact that many of us fit somewhere in between.
    Then of-course even if "the perfect fit" , most of still like to tailor things slightly as well.

    I'm just over 5'10" and rode two bikes for a week to figure out if I liked the fit of a L or M on a Marin h/t. Neither would have been wrong IMO. They were simply too close in size or I was smack in the middle. Somebody mentioned here already, New school geo seems to be going up size if in doubt rather than down. I heard that too and you can see it in the frame angles these days. Once you get around that, I'll bet the newer bikes prove the new rule of thumb.

    Did you look up frame dimension of both sizes to see the difference?
    In the Middle Ages, the biggest mistake was not putting on your armor because you were 'just going down to the corner.'

  47. #47
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    how much to you plan to sit and pedal this bike in a straight line versus standing and rangling the bike over the terrain? don't base your fit entirely on the distance from the saddle to the handlebar because that's mostly what that measurement is good for. by that measurement, a five foot tall rider could make a XXL frame fit by putting the stem and offset seatpost both on backwards.

    what you want to know is where your feet and hands are relative to one another, regardless of where the saddle is because that relationship is what matters when you're standing. this is the effective stack and reach. you can get a pretty good idea of this if you plug in your numbers to the link I posted above. bikegeo.net

    from what a gather the frames' S+R are:
    Marin
    stack 635.8
    reach 462.2

    Specialized
    stack 632
    reach 425

    the stack height on these two bikes is close enough that you can compare the reach directly. The Marin 37mm or 1 1/2" more reach. that would be a deal breaker for me, unless I was alreay riding a bike that was much too short and needed a longer stem than I wanted on it to make it fit.
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  48. #48
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    I’m 5’7”, with a 27-28” inseam.

    This bike should not fit me.

    Went for a short 40 minute ride.

    Swapped 34 for a wolf tooth 28 elliptical...changed chain line slightly so I couldn’t use the two largest rings...(or maybe it just wasn’t adjusted correctly...probably just needs an adjustment).

    Forgot my shock pump...had too much air in the fork, only used about 60 percent travel.

    I really like this bike...that rear end is different...felt really stable, but when I looked I had used 80 percent of the travel...it did not feel like it.

    On the climbs, I noticed less bob (I sit and spin and don’t use the climb switches...there is no switch on its X2).

    There was a short downhill with a bump at the bottom that I always feel (it blew the air out of the rear tire of my 3.0 DHF at 14 psi on my Prime...had Procore so no issue)...out of my ‘17 s-works Enduro 29 and my Riot (has Float X2)...this bike’s X2 felt the best going over it.

    That E*thirteen rear hub is noisy...but I dig it.

    This bike is a keeper.

    I really notice the longer wheelbase...and I’m slightly higher on this bike than my other bikes...not a show stopper.

    I would probably like a medium even more...but now I want to put riser bars on it and 165 mm cranks...might try a sqlab 30x aluminum 40 mm with 12 degree sweep...(thanks Lynx).

    The Deity carbon bars with 9 degree sweep felt pretty good...but there is more weight on my hands...I suspect the bars are lower than my Enduro 29.

    Can’t wait to ride it more...the LBS guy was right...no problem riding it.

    Great bike...great deal...I’m so stoked.

    Rode a new bike...watched my UFC favorites win...saw Thor Ragnarok...what a great day!
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  49. #49
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    I tried a Sqlab 30X aluminum with a 16 degree bend...but I still wanted the bars a tad higher and a bit closer...the seat was already forward at the max line.

    I put Deity Highside bars with a 80mm rise tilted back a bit...still need to see how it feels on the trail.

    Turns out the overall seat and bar height now on the large Pro are about the same as my medium S-works, as well as the distance from the middle of the seat to the middle of the grips.

    The large frame’s wheel base definitely feels longer.

    I’m surprised that I could get the large cockpit so close without swapping out the offset dropper.

    I still would like to ride a medium Wolf Ridge Pro on the trail to feel the differences.

    I will post some pics this weekend...the bike has that unique looking rear end.
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    I tried a Sqlab 30X aluminum with a 16 degree bend...but I still wanted the bars a tad higher and a bit closer...the seat was already forward at the max line.

    I put Deity Highside bars with a 80mm rise tilted back a bit...still need to see how it feels on the trail.

    Turns out the overall seat and bar height now on the large Pro are about the same as my medium S-works, as well as the distance from the middle of the seat to the middle of the grips.

    The large frame’s wheel base definitely feels longer.

    I’m surprised that I could get the large cockpit so close without swapping out the offset dropper.

    I still would like to ride a medium Wolf Ridge Pro on the trail to feel the differences.

    I will post some pics this weekend...the bike has that unique looking rear end.
    I do not know about your dropper but if it has 2 screws maybe you could reverse it ?
    Try pulling in your brakes and transmission levers inside like if you cut your bar about 700 or 680, this will improve your posture if you can get used to it within 3 weeks, it might feel strange at first but i slowly moved from a 740 to finding my 680 on the wide side. You just need to make many small gains
    - saddle position, a woman design is sometimes shorter and helpfull
    - higher bar
    - narrower bar
    keep your knees pain free and let your upper body sometime to adjust riding 60 min, 75, 90, 3-4 times weekly, hopefully you will have a good match

  51. #51
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    How I picture you and your bike.
    I no longer like to party. But I like the idea of it.

  52. #52
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    WORST advice I think I've ever read!

    Quote Originally Posted by 33red View Post
    I do not know about your dropper but if it has 2 screws maybe you could reverse it ?
    Try pulling in your brakes and transmission levers inside like if you cut your bar about 700 or 680, this will improve your posture if you can get used to it within 3 weeks, it might feel strange at first but i slowly moved from a 740 to finding my 680 on the wide side. You just need to make many small gains
    - saddle position, a woman design is sometimes shorter and helpfull
    - higher bar
    - narrower bar
    keep your knees pain free and let your upper body sometime to adjust riding 60 min, 75, 90, 3-4 times weekly, hopefully you will have a good match
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by 33red View Post
    I do not know about your dropper but if it has 2 screws maybe you could reverse it ?
    Try pulling in your brakes and transmission levers inside like if you cut your bar about 700 or 680, this will improve your posture if you can get used to it within 3 weeks, it might feel strange at first but i slowly moved from a 740 to finding my 680 on the wide side. You just need to make many small gains
    - saddle position, a woman design is sometimes shorter and helpfull
    - higher bar
    - narrower bar
    keep your knees pain free and let your upper body sometime to adjust riding 60 min, 75, 90, 3-4 times weekly, hopefully you will have a good match
    At this point, I don’t think I need anymore adjustments.

    I do need to change the seat...my a$$ was sore from the last longer ride...I couldn’t see how to easily remove the stock seat from the custom offset Lev (don’t want to break it)...it is much different from my other Lev’s.

    I’m not sure about how the seat tube angle might affect my knees yet...they felt “different”...but I would not call it pain.

    It seems like I have different muscles sore after riding, depending on which bike I rode.
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by almazing View Post


    How I picture you and your bike.
    I love that pic...but I am not going to try to duplicate it!
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    I love that pic...but I am not going to try to duplicate it!
    Seems to me like you've already have with the changes you've made to it. Face it. The bike doesn't fit you.

    Sell it and get one in the proper size. Or another bike.

    OR

    Put the stock parts back and ONLY ride it in bike parks. You can get away with riding an oversized bike in bike parks. It's still not ideal, but you'll be standing up pretty much the whole time with minimal pedaling. You don't have to worry about how it fits when you're sitting down because you're not going to be while riding in a bike park. The extra length will give you more stability when you're screaming down the hill at 30+ MPH and you'll have more room to move around.
    I no longer like to party. But I like the idea of it.

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by almazing View Post
    Seems to me like you've already have with the changes you've made to it. Face it. The bike doesn't fit you.

    Sell it and get one in the proper size. Or another bike.

    OR

    Put the stock parts back and ONLY ride it in bike parks. You can get away with riding an oversized bike in bike parks. It's still not ideal, but you'll be standing up pretty much the whole time with minimal pedaling. You don't have to worry about how it fits when you're sitting down because you're not going to be while riding in a bike park. The extra length will give you more stability when you're screaming down the hill at 30+ MPH and you'll have more room to move around.
    Haha...I meant try to duplicate the picture...I like the analogy.

    I’m still deciding on whether I will keep it (leaning heavily towards keeping it).

    It wouldn’t make sense to put the stock parts back on it if I’m going to keep it for bike parks or anything else. They make the bike more enjoyable to ride.

    The stock parts only go back on if I decide to sell it.

    The only parts I swapped so far are the bars, grips, front chain ring, and tires...and soon the seat...stuff that I customize on every bike I’ve bought...maybe 165 mm cranks later if I keep it.
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    Just curious, can you ride a bike with the stem flipped backwards 180 degrees?

    I wonder how this might affect handling...might be fun to try...
    Combined with this, I think it could be done. And even more fun!


  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    WORST advice I think I've ever read!
    Read some of his other posts. If your eyes don't cross at least twice you're doing well.

  59. #59
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    The large Wolf Ridge Pro next to my medium S-Works Enduro 29



    The handlebar and seat heights are pretty close, as well as the distance from the seat to the grips.

    My knees feel “different” after riding the Pro...not sure if that is related to the slacker seat tube angle.

    Definitely would feel better with 165 mm cranks (I have them on the S-Works).

    I normally prefer to buy used in great condition...I took the chance because at the time there were no used bikes available and it was a fantastic deal.
    ‘18 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro
    '17 Specialized E29 S-Works
    '15 Canfield Riot
    '13 Banshee Prime (29+)
    '12 LenzSport PBJ

  60. #60
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    Right now you're wasting your time unless you put a post with a straight/normal head on there to get the saddle into the exact same position relative to the BB as your other bikes and give it a go. You've spent that much $$ on the bike, could as well just pull the dropper and install a normal straight post before committing to a new dropper, but at least yu'd know.
    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    The large Wolf Ridge Pro next to my medium S-Works Enduro 29

    The handlebar and seat heights are pretty close, as well as the distance from the seat to the grips. My knees feel “different” after riding the Pro...not sure if that is related to the slacker seat tube angle. Definitely would feel better with 165 mm cranks (I have them on the S-Works).

    I normally prefer to buy used in great condition...I took the chance because at the time there were no used bikes available and it was a fantastic deal.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbsocal View Post
    Got a fantastic deal on a new 2018 Marin Wolf Ridge Pro...but it is a size large.

    I normally ride medium frames.

    Will I be able to compensate for the longer reach by changing the stem from 40 mm to 30 mm with a Salsa Bend 2 bars with 23 degree sweep?

    Gonna try it (waiting for bike to arrive)...if it doesn’t work...I will be selling it.

    Just wondering if anyone else has tried something similar.

    Thanks.
    Really depends on how much you're able to compensate for. There are a couple of measurements that you cannot effectively compensate for (top tube height, distance between the pedal when it's at the forward most point and the back of the front tire...) but the rest of the measurements are really a triangle from your seat to the pedals to the handlebars to the seat. Will using a shorter (or longer) stem impact your steering? Sure, but minor adjustments (like 10mm) shouldn't be unmanageable. Take measurements of what you're doing now and apply them to the new bike then check the riding position and handling. You'll gain a little wheel base and that may change your center of gravity but it's likely not that big a deal. I measure between a 57 and 59cm road bike and can fit either so for true road use I ride the larger size, but my gravel bike is the smaller size because it climbs better on minimum maintenance roads.
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