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  1. #1
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    Buyer Beware - Giant Trance X 29er 0 marketing trick

    Just picked up my Giant Trance X 29er 0 from my LBS and I was disappointed to see that the rear shock does NOT have the Kashima coating even though the Giant catalog and their marketing materials all show it with the coating (see photo below from Giant's website). My LBS called his Giant sales rep to see what the mix-up was. The Giant rep said "the catalog photo is wrong". He did note that the specs for the shock in the marketing materials do not say that it has Kashima coating.

    My LBS was very cool about it and offered me a nice shock pump and quick chain link to cover the difference which I felt like was fair. However, I feel like Giant pulled a bait and switch. Maybe I wouldn't even notice the difference in the ride but when you plunk down that kind of $$ on a bike you expect to get what was advertised. Buyer beware.

    Now, I'm going to erase that memory and go out and enjoy the bike. Out of the four 29'rs I rode the Trance X was the only one that felt right to me. I'll list them below in my order of preference:

    #1 Giant Trance X 29er 0
    #2 Kona Satori (too hard to maneuver, felt longer and less responsive than the Trance)
    #3 Trek Superfly 100 FS (maneuverable but rode too rough for my taste)
    #4 Giant Anthem 29'r (felt very similar to the Superfly 100)

    I'm coming from a 2010 Fezzari Nebo Peak 26'r that I loved (other than busting rear spokes all the time). My Nebo died a gruesome death on my buddies bike rack at the hands of a Dodge Ram (literally and figuratively) pickup truck's front bumper and grill. The truck rear ended us in traffic after skidding 45 feet. I would have been content with the Nebo for years to come but the Dodge Ram forced me to rethink options. The guys insurance company paid me full price.

    I probably would have bought another Nebo but I didn't like that they don't offer a through-axle in the rear. Ironically, the Trance doesn't either. However, the Trance doesn't have pivot bearings near the wheel, so, it doesn't need a through axle to remain stiff. My guess is that customer perception will drive Giant into adding a rear through axle eventually whether its needed or not.

    I like a plush ride, don't mind the extra weight, and most of my fun comes from downhills (mostly of the XCish variety) and small jumps so the Trance is a good fit.

    I wanted to try out a Rumblefish and a Tallboy LT but was unable to get a demo to ride. After being very surprised how differently the bikes I rode felt, I'll be leery of buying a bike without riding it in the future. Its hard to say. I bought the Fezzari without riding it and it was an excellent fit and feel. I'll post a comparison review between the Nebo and the Trance after I get some miles on it.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Buyer Beware - Giant Trance X 29er 0 marketing trick-trance_x_29er_0.jpg  


  2. #2
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    Dont those catalogs usually have a fine print that says "Photograph may differ from actual product."?
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  3. #3
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    I wouldn't call it a marketing trick. The promotional materials are printed up long before the production frames are built. It's pretty common for some part specs to change between the press photos and the production release.

  4. #4
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    Every manufacturer has a line or two at the bottom of each model's page about how the spec might change throughout the model year.

    This is pretty common knowledge.
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    It's foolish to assume what your getting by looking at a picture. For the fox ctd rear shock kashima coat is an option/upgrade. I don't see anywhere in the specs on the Trance X 29er 0 that specifies kashima coat so I wouldn't expect to see it on the actual bike.

  6. #6
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    Ouch For the $$ they want for that model I'd EXPECT both the shock and fork to have Kashima, seriously, it's a $4k> bike.
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  7. #7
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    This is the case with the santa cruz tallboy LTc also...
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  8. #8
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    you still got a deal.

  9. #9
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    Still waiting to throw a leg over one for a test ride. Don't know if I'm going to buy full suspension this year or ride the SS exclusively for a while longer.

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    I wonder if you would even notice the difference in a blind test. But it does suck especially since your LBS was surprised as well but they sound like good people and glad they took care of you.

    Not happy to hear your impression of the Satori since it is one of four bikes that I have narrowed it down to. The Trance does look like a really nice bike. Let us know how it rides.

  11. #11
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    Yeah, I think I'd expect it on a bike that cost that much as well. Hey, at least you got $4 worth of accessories though ;-)
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  12. #12
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    Aroundoz... Don't rule the Satori out. Bikes that my friends love, and I hated. I highly recommend riding a model before you buy. I guess I got lucky with my first bike, the Fezzari, since it felt great. I was surprised how different the different models actually feel..

    About showing Kashima then delivering standard, let's just say it's probably safe to say it RARELY, if ever happens the other direction. The website should either use a different picture or they should note the discrepancy. Its dishonest to keep a bait and switch on the site.

    And yes, my LBS took the hit for Giant's error. Big props to Clarksville Schwinn near Louisville KY.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tshulthise View Post
    Aroundoz... Don't rule the Satori out. Bikes that my friends love, and I hated. I highly recommend riding a model before you buy. I guess I got lucky with my first bike, the Fezzari, since it felt great. I was surprised how different the different models actually feel..

    About showing Kashima then delivering standard, let's just say it's probably safe to say it RARELY, if ever happens the other direction. The website should either use a different picture or they should note the discrepancy. Its dishonest to keep a bait and switch on the site.

    And yes, my LBS took the hit for Giant's error. Big props to Clarksville Schwinn near Louisville KY.
    It is not an error. The catalogs come out or need to produced well before the product comes out. So should Giant re-do the catalog when the correct shock comes out then pass the extra cost onto the Buyer? It has been like this ever since bike companies made catalogs. Bet you can find a problem in every single brand of bikes catalog. The descriptions are added last at the rear of the catalog and even then they can substitute parts as needed or available.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spinning Lizard View Post
    It is not an error. The catalogs come out or need to produced well before the product comes out. So should Giant re-do the catalog when the correct shock comes out then pass the extra cost onto the Buyer?
    yeah, but, it would have taken about 10 minutes to photoshop the shock to look like the one he actually got and upload it to the online catalog. why not be accurate?

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    Struggling to understand why you think that say 4 square inches of Kashima coating is so important.

  16. #16
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    I don't think they should have advertised it on the website like that either, but didn't you look at the bike on the showroom floor/test ride it. The best way to tell what kind of bike and parts you are getting is to look between your legs when you are test riding it.
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    Did they just switch the picture on there website? No kashima online anymore.

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    Honestly, I'm surprised you still even bought the bike given that you cared about Kash coat. I guess a nice shock pump and a chain link is all it takes to buy some people off. I'm glad you managed to somehow put it in the past.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasnavy05 View Post
    I don't think they should have advertised it on the website like that either, but didn't you look at the bike on the showroom floor/test ride it. The best way to tell what kind of bike and parts you are getting is to look between your legs when you are test riding it.
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  20. #20
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    I rode an x1 version before I ordered the X0. The X1 pictures do not show the Kashima coating. The sales guy touted the Kashima coating on the X0. He was fooled by the picture too.

  21. #21
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    Think I agree with most here that looking at the photo and assuming that is what is on the bike is pretty naive. I read the specs on everything to ensure that I know what I am paying for, but very cool that the LBS was on your side and helped you out. That is the making of a good shop right there and good CS.

  22. #22
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    I have seen this with many bikes.
    They print the promotional materials prior to production and sometimes the components are slightly different. You need to read the what the specs are prior to purchase, not just look at the pictures.

  23. #23
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    It was nice of your lbs to "throw" in the shock pump that already comes with the bike...

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by vizsladog View Post
    It was nice of your lbs to "throw" in the shock pump that already comes with the bike...
    x2

    Every Giant bike used to come with a shockpump if needed for the suspension.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tshulthise View Post
    I rode an x1 version before I ordered the X0. The X1 pictures do not show the Kashima coating. The sales guy touted the Kashima coating on the X0. He was fooled by the picture too.
    Sounds like the saels guy at the shop dropped the ball if he touted the Kashima coating. Might be why the LBS "upgraded" him to the Kashima coated shock. If the sales guy "fell" for it as well I'd place the blame on the LBS for not making sure their sales staff knew what they were talking about. Bad LBS!
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  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by someone who does not understand the point of discussion boards and so left this as negative rep
    struggling with why you think it shouldn't be.
    Struggling to understand why you did not just ask this in the thread.
    You are the type of client Fox and all the other bike companies love. I have had Kashima coated and normal coated Foxes. The Kashima coating did absolutely nothing to improve my forks.
    But I will give you the gold colour looks pretty.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by tshulthise View Post
    The sales guy touted the Kashima coating on the X0.

    This is unacceptable. If the sales guy said it was on there (probably part of his sales pitch) then IMO the bike should have it. Or, you should be given a discount of some sort.

    BTW the shock pump should come with the bike to begin with.

    I think it would be pretty naive to assume that the picture is the correct spec of the bike, but if you asked the sales guy about it and he said it came with Kashima coating, then he should be held accountable.

    I mean if you can't ask the bike shop about the bike you are buying from them.....then who do you ask?
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  28. #28
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    its all about tha gold man

  29. #29
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    Good thing it didn't because I personally couldn't ride a Non-Kashima fork with a Kashima shock. Oh the horror.
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  30. #30
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    So Kashima coating... the LBS salesman touted it as a selling point (fooled him too, yeah right), it's pictured, but in reality it doesn't have it, and to make up for it, they gave you a shock pump that should have come with the bike in the first place? Hmm...

    Some of you people on here astound me with what you will just blow off... if something like this had happened to you when buying a car, you'd be pissed (who cares if it doesn't really have leather like in the ad picture, cloth feels the same thru your clothes). But since it's 'just' a $4k bike, most of you are on here making excuses for Giant and the LBS.

    Yeah I get it, sometimes the HW spec changes from mkting pic to sales floor... but we aren't talking about grips here - we are talking about a major component. Who cares if you can tell a diff between the kashima or not? Fox apparently thinks it makes a diff - they upcharge for it as a higher-spec'ed part.

    Where do you draw the line? "Who cares if it's X5 or X7 instead of X9 or X0? Who cares if the brakes are BB7s instead of hydros, they still stop you... Who cares if the wheels are a slightly lower spec than what's in the marking pic.. Who cares if it's a Rock Shox instead of a Fox Fork... You can't tell a difference anyway..."

    The whole thing just seems just a little bit sleazy to me, from Giants excuses (well, it doesn't actually SAY Kashima coated, in spite of the fact that we used that version to market it) to how the LBS basically hoped this guy wouldn't notice, and when he did, gave him something to which he should have gotten in the first place to make up for it.

    Just my opinion. For $4k I'd expect a little more. We arent talking $500 entry-level bike here.
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  31. #31
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    Its the fault of the store, its their job to know their product.

    its always a good idea to read the spec list carefully, but if it was used in the sales pitch the store should and (sounds like) did do something. I have never herd about this free shock pump thing though, **** if thats the case my LBS owes me 2... lol

    It is really too bad though, i work in sales and it happens from time to time. product specs change and no one tells you, and if something has been ordered for stock your trying to sell it before it comes in and you can catch the change.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobinGB View Post
    I have never herd about this free shock pump thing though, **** if thats the case my LBS owes me 2... lol.
    I've seen this at many different types of stores where they take parts that are supposed to come with a product and sell it to you as an extra!
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoisonDartFrog View Post
    So Kashima coating... the LBS salesman touted it as a selling point (fooled him too, yeah right), it's pictured, but in reality it doesn't have it, and to make up for it, they gave you a shock pump that should have come with the bike in the first place? Hmm...

    Some of you people on here astound me with what you will just blow off... if something like this had happened to you when buying a car, you'd be pissed (who cares if it doesn't really have leather like in the ad picture, cloth feels the same thru your clothes). But since it's 'just' a $4k bike, most of you are on here making excuses for Giant and the LBS.

    Yeah I get it, sometimes the HW spec changes from mkting pic to sales floor... but we aren't talking about grips here - we are talking about a major component. Who cares if you can tell a diff between the kashima or not? Fox apparently thinks it makes a diff - they upcharge for it as a higher-spec'ed part.

    Where do you draw the line? "Who cares if it's X5 or X7 instead of X9 or X0? Who cares if the brakes are BB7s instead of hydros, they still stop you... Who cares if the wheels are a slightly lower spec than what's in the marking pic.. Who cares if it's a Rock Shox instead of a Fox Fork... You can't tell a difference anyway..."

    The whole thing just seems just a little bit sleazy to me, from Giants excuses (well, it doesn't actually SAY Kashima coated, in spite of the fact that we used that version to market it) to how the LBS basically hoped this guy wouldn't notice, and when he did, gave him something to which he should have gotten in the first place to make up for it.

    Just my opinion. For $4k I'd expect a little more. We arent talking $500 entry-level bike here.
    Well if the Spec said it was to have all of that then yes, but reading above and the spec does not say that.
    They also probably have pics of people doing big jumps and people racing World Cup in their catalogue. Based on your comment suggesting that the pics should be what you get maybe we should all ***** at Giant next time we ride because our ride does not reflect what was pictured??

    Get a grip, it is a coating that has been sold to you guys as a must have; better than the old coating; cant do without it thing. Well it is not. It is a marketing gimmick and from my experience does nothing to improve my ride in any way, shape or form. I dont even recall the price going up when that coating was introduced, so what exactly do you think you should be reimbursed for?

  34. #34
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    God damn those Trance 29ers are ugly....
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sideknob View Post
    God damn those Trance 29ers are ugly....



    True, but they just feel "right".

  36. #36
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    See the highlight part.
    You think that is bad. Santa Cruz with the rolling changes, you really don't know what you're gonna get. I will say at least it's usually an improvement with them.

    I'd really like to know which bikes are coming with shock pumps? Fox stopped including them with aftermarket forks & shocks. Neither my Specialized or Santa Cruz came with one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tshulthise View Post
    Aroundoz... Don't rule the Satori out. Bikes that my friends love, and I hated. I highly recommend riding a model before you buy. I guess I got lucky with my first bike, the Fezzari, since it felt great. I was surprised how different the different models actually feel..

    About showing Kashima then delivering standard, let's just say it's probably safe to say it RARELY, if ever happens the other direction. The website should either use a different picture or they should note the discrepancy. Its dishonest to keep a bait and switch on the site.

    And yes, my LBS took the hit for Giant's error. Big props to Clarksville Schwinn near Louisville KY.
    We are neighbors.

    I have heard a lot of good stuff about the guys that run C'ville schwinn, but after the brown county demo I absolutely hated the Trance X. ended up ordering a rumblefish from the guys down the street.

  38. #38
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    Buy a rigid singlespeed next time.....no need for a shock pump and no Kashima coating to worry about....and more money left over for upgrades ( or beer )

  39. #39
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    I have been riding a rigid SS 29er for a long time... What the hell is Kashima coating???
    Sit and spin my ass...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zion Rasta View Post
    I have been riding a rigid SS 29er for a long time... What the hell is Kashima coating???

  41. #41
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    Kinda messed up, but it's just bling. Nice of your LBS to take the hit, especially because the salesman was touting the coating.

  42. #42
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    I got a x1. Only difference between the bikes is color and full xt.
    I already blew the front fork. I aske fox if the could upgraded to kashima. They don't have a 1.5"-1.25" kashima yet. Boo. I'm getting upgraded to the factory hopefully with remote.
    Still a better climber than my hard tail. Ps. If you can ride a rigid ss then u don't work hard enough in real life.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoisonDartFrog View Post
    So Kashima coating... the LBS salesman touted it as a selling point (fooled him too, yeah right), it's pictured, but in reality it doesn't have it, and to make up for it, they gave you a shock pump that should have come with the bike in the first place? Hmm...

    Some of you people on here astound me with what you will just blow off... if something like this had happened to you when buying a car, you'd be pissed (who cares if it doesn't really have leather like in the ad picture, cloth feels the same thru your clothes). But since it's 'just' a $4k bike, most of you are on here making excuses for Giant and the LBS.

    Yeah I get it, sometimes the HW spec changes from mkting pic to sales floor... but we aren't talking about grips here - we are talking about a major component. Who cares if you can tell a diff between the kashima or not? Fox apparently thinks it makes a diff - they upcharge for it as a higher-spec'ed part.

    Where do you draw the line? "Who cares if it's X5 or X7 instead of X9 or X0? Who cares if the brakes are BB7s instead of hydros, they still stop you... Who cares if the wheels are a slightly lower spec than what's in the marking pic.. Who cares if it's a Rock Shox instead of a Fox Fork... You can't tell a difference anyway..."

    The whole thing just seems just a little bit sleazy to me, from Giants excuses (well, it doesn't actually SAY Kashima coated, in spite of the fact that we used that version to market it) to how the LBS basically hoped this guy wouldn't notice, and when he did, gave him something to which he should have gotten in the first place to make up for it.

    Just my opinion. For $4k I'd expect a little more. We arent talking $500 entry-level bike here.
    fox got you, hook line and sinker.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spazdad View Post
    I got a x1. Only difference between the bikes is color and full xt.
    I already blew the front fork. I aske fox if the could upgraded to kashima. They don't have a 1.5"-1.25" kashima yet. Boo. I'm getting upgraded to the factory hopefully with remote.
    Still a better climber than my hard tail. Ps. If you can ride a rigid ss then u don't work hard enough in real life.
    In response to the "PS".....Work smarter not harder ....And by the way, after you tire of all of the big marketing BS and get a few years of riding experience under your belt you may discover rigid single speeds....... then you will no longer give a f**k about Kashima coating........I promise you

    And you won't need to worry about blowing the front fork either!

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoTone View Post
    See the highlight part.
    You think that is bad. Santa Cruz with the rolling changes, you really don't know what you're gonna get. I will say at least it's usually an improvement with them.

    I'd really like to know which bikes are coming with shock pumps? Fox stopped including them with aftermarket forks & shocks. Neither my Specialized or Santa Cruz came with one.

    My Trek Fuel EX 8 came with a pump. It even states that in the specs on Trek's website.


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    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    In response to the "PS".....Work smarter not harder ....And by the way, after you tire of all of the big marketing BS and get a few years of riding experience under your belt you may discover rigid single speeds....... then you will no longer give a f**k about Kashima coating........I promise you

    And you won't need to worry about blowing the front fork either!
    Agreed.
    My fully rigid SS is my go to bike.
    Even when I had a blinged out SC Tallboy.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by TR View Post
    Well if the Spec said it was to have all of that then yes, but reading above and the spec does not say that.
    They also probably have pics of people doing big jumps and people racing World Cup in their catalogue. Based on your comment suggesting that the pics should be what you get maybe we should all ***** at Giant next time we ride because our ride does not reflect what was pictured??

    Get a grip, it is a coating that has been sold to you guys as a must have; better than the old coating; cant do without it thing.

    If the spec says it doesn't have it so you ask the lbs if it does and they say yes, then I'm going to assume it does. And, it doesn't really matter if YOU think it is a useless product or marketing hype. The point is he paid for something that he didn't get.
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasnavy05 View Post
    If the spec says it doesn't have it so you ask the lbs if it does and they say yes, then I'm going to assume it does. And, it doesn't really matter if YOU think it is a useless product or marketing hype. The point is he paid for something that he didn't get.
    Kashima is not an upgrade and I paid no more for my Kashima coated Fox than I did for my non. He paid no more for it so he IS paying for what he got.
    And just because the store is staffed by monkey's who do not know the spec of the bikes they are selling does not mean that Giant should adjust their spec accordingly.

  49. #49
    TR
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    This thread should be re-titled "My LBS is staffed by morons who do not even know the spec of the very bikes that they are selling".

  50. #50
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    I dont understand what the big deal is. Your gonna bash giant because your local shop gave you false Information? Didnt you actually look at the bike before purchasing it? Unbeleivable. We are talking about a new coating on the shock which is 99.9% cosmetic, and 0.01% functional. Let me guess...your one of those people who only leave negative reviews online because you failed to use common sense.

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