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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemke View Post
    Quite the opposite... the front wheel stays planted! That's why I'm thinking I need to shift my whole body position rearward.
    Could be the head tube angle, which is listed at 70 degrees, causing this. Seventy is more cross country than all mountain. You can get an adjustable head tube adapter if you want to slack it out more and lower that angle.
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  2. #102
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    The bike just feels "heavy" at the typical Texas trail speeds. It starts to come to life when I'm carrying more speed though. I've been measuring everything... and one critical dimension I found, compared to my HT 29er, is the seat tube line to pedal spindle is about an inch further forward on the Breezer. That's why my first "round" of positioning is to get my body position more rearward. Even though the Breezer is only 3 pounds heavier than my HT, it just feels "heavy" and not as responsive. More to figure out and dial in. I'll keep everyone posted.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemke View Post
    The bike just feels "heavy" at the typical Texas trail speeds. It starts to come to life when I'm carrying more speed though. I've been measuring everything... and one critical dimension I found, compared to my HT 29er, is the seat tube line to pedal spindle is about an inch further forward on the Breezer. That's why my first "round" of positioning is to get my body position more rearward. Even though the Breezer is only 3 pounds heavier than my HT, it just feels "heavy" and not as responsive. More to figure out and dial in. I'll keep everyone posted.
    Good luck, hope you can dial it in. Did you try moving the saddle all the way back? How about a different stem? Maybe bars with more rise so your hands are higher up?

    I also have the problem on all my bikes where I am heavy over my hands and it makes lifting the front wheel hard. I think it is because I have a long torso.

    Maybe your LBS could help out. Small adjustments can go a long way.
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  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemke View Post
    Quite the opposite... the front wheel stays planted! That's why I'm thinking I need to shift my whole body position rearward.
    Either speed up the rebound on the fork, or slow it down on the rear shock. Report back with the good news ;-)

  5. #105
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    I have a number of rides on mine now, I'll try to give some further impressions.

    I'd estimate that my rides on this bike so far have averaged roughly 12 miles and 1500+ feet of climbing, and I've got 100 miles or so on it. Unfortunately I've only been able to get out about once a week. Most of my rides have been around Shaver Lake, CA at 5-6000 feet, it's just too damn hot lately to hit lower elevation trails unless I'm on the bike near sunrise. I added a KS Lev DX dropper post a few rides ago and it's an outstanding addition to this bike! (thanks Jeffj)

    I think the handling is superb, it's very quick and flickable on the tight single tracks, stable and tracks straight while climbing at very slow speed, (something I do quite a lot...) and really works well downhill too. The bike is very stiff, I haven't noticed any flex from the rear. I don't think the bike feels heavy at all, quite the contrary actualy. Lifting the front for a manual is something I'm trying to learn to do better, it's no different for me on this bike. Bunny-hopping over a tree limb or other trail obstacle comes very easily though. It also seems to be the most predictable bike I've ridden in recent memory while jumping.

    Mine is the expert, and while the X-fusion suspension works well some additional adjustability would be nice. I'm right at 30% sag as Jeffj recommended and it's doing great. The rear suspension does not seem to be very progressive as it seems to use most of it's travel quickly, but it is very plush and I can't say I've really felt it bottom, even when the o-ring is indicating that I'm using all of it.

    I obviously very satisfied with it, especially for the price I paid I have NO regrets.


  6. #106
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    1x10 conversion

    So I did my 1x10 swap today. I'll start out by saying, I'm a dumbass. Not enough research, or measuring, or just assuming things would fit. I ordered a Raceface 32t narrow wide chainring, and a BBG bash guard. Expecting no issues, I pulled the cranks, unbolted the OE chainrings, and set the bash guard in place.

    Take note: If you are looking to convert to 1x10 with your SC Expert, the Deore cranks are 96BCD, not 104 like every other common crank. I'm not sure if this is also the case on the SLX or XT cranks (I've read mixed info since discovering I was a dumbass) but measure to be sure if you are converting your Pro or Team Supercell.

    Now that we got that out of the way, I was not going to be denied on my swap today. I ended up robbing my SS of it's FSA Afterburner cranks to complete the swap. Thankfully they had the same BB measurements and fit right in place of the Deore cranks. Other than the unexpected crank swap, it was straightforward.

    If you want to swap to 1x10 with the Deore cranks, I have found some 30t nw chainrings with 96BCD (they are more expensive than the 104s I found), and BBG does make a 30t 96BCD bash guard. Just make sure you get the right parts to fit your cranks and it's a really simple job. Coming off of only riding SS for the last 8 years, 10 gears feels like more than enough to me.

    Once I got the drivetrain done I rode a few quick laps around the yard trying to dial in the fit. As others mentioned, the seat feels a bit forward to me. I moved it back as far as the seatpost allowed but I still wanted a bit more. I'm going to try my post from the SS as it's offset a bit more. If that feels right I'll pick up a new post. Other than the seat position I feel good on the bike. I also stuck some ergo grips on, which I've been running for a few years. This is my first FS bike so I don't have anything to compare with. I tried a few quick stand up pedal assaults and didn't notice any significant bob or bounce. The frame feels really tight and solid. I'm going to try running some singletrack trails tomorrow and I'll report back.

    Breezer Supercell -Any thoughts?-2015-07-07-20.02.36.jpg

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffj View Post
    Either speed up the rebound on the fork, or slow it down on the rear shock. Report back with the good news ;-)
    Or a combination of speeding up the fork, and slowing down the rear shock.

    Like any FS, you have to get the front and rear suspension working together. In the case of having the bike be more or less neutral in the air, rebound speed is a better way to get there rather than moving your weight too far back or forward from your natural jumping form. That's one of the first things I check when riding a new bike on the trail, is to find some smaller things to boost off of and see if the front and rear are synch'd before I hit anything hard.
    ========================================
    Another thought about this bike; I'm not sure I would automatically be compelled to go to a shorter stem like I might with many other bikes. Unless you have some other stems laying about, I would give the stock stem some time and see how it goes, maybe try some different stem heights while you're fiddling with it.

  8. #108
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    FYI, the SLX crankset on the Pro is 104/64 BCD.

  9. #109
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    Thanks jeffj... all input is welcome, and will be put to the test.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemke View Post
    FYI, the SLX crankset on the Pro is 104/64 BCD.
    Thanks. I read that the current XTR was 96 BCD so I guess they did the top and bottom line in that size.

  11. #111
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    A couple of shots (screen grabs from cell phone video) of my son enjoying some air time on the Supercell. You see the front wheel is up a little as he comes off the lip, and then rotated on over as he landed. He overshot the landing a little, but the bike landed just right.

    And, as you can see, he used every millimeter of travel as well as really putting the tires to the test

    Breezer Supercell -Any thoughts?-tbsct_01.jpgBreezer Supercell -Any thoughts?-tbsct_02.jpg

  12. #112
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    Nice Jeff.
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  13. #113
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    I took my first ride this afternoon. Other than being out of shape, and picking the hottest part of the day to ride, I thoroughly enjoyed it. As expected, the ride was infinitely smoother than I'm used to. I kept finding myself looking down to see if my tires were losing air when I would hit a root and not feel it [/hardtailguy].

    The trail today was a single track loop between the river and canal here in Augusta. Not a lot of elevation, just twisty flowing trails. There are a fare amount of roots and the trail is often tight. I felt very comfortable on the bike as far as handling. It takes more effort than I'm used to pulling the front off the ground, but I got the feel for it quickly. Overall I'm completely satisfied with the purchase. It feels very solid and predictable which I wasn't sure about with this being my first FS. I'm sure as I get it dialed in I'll continue to enjoy it.

    Speaking of dialing in, I need to hook up with a local who is familiar with suspension setup. I probably don't have enough air in the rear shock based on the amount of travel the o-ring indicates I used considering the trail I was on. I'll take some better sag measurements to start and go from there. I definitely need a different seat post with more offset. I was consistently sitting on the very back of the saddle. I'll wait until I get that sorted to decide how I feel about the seat. At the moment I don't like it, but it wasn't in the right location so I'll reserve judgement for now. Other than the seat position the cockpit felt really natural to me. I might throw a riser bar on to get a little more upright, but the stem length feels fine.

  14. #114
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    @bgredjeep... you experienced some of the exact things I was. Hard to pull the front up, and I can't get my butt far enough back. I installed a 90mm stem, and put the big spacer on the top. I also shortened my bars 15mm each side. That really helped speed up the steering for me. I have a "bent" seat post on the way. Hopefully that will lighten up the front by shifting my weight back a bit.

  15. #115
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    Thanks for the updates guys. I just got a new Hardtail so I won't be getting the Breezer soon. The inability to lift the front wheel concerns me because I already have trouble with that on my other bikes.
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  16. #116
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    That's too bad soarftb... after installing the seat post, and adjusting the shock settings some more, my buddy took my bike and proceeded to ride a wheelie halfway down the trail. He said, "It's perfect, now quit dicking with it, and go ride!"

  17. #117
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    That's good to hear. I was just looking at seat posts. I was going to try one from another bike but it was the wrong size. Before I order one I'm going to check the lbs for any take off posts that will work.

    Got my maxxis ikons today and installed those. I haven't weighed the bike since, but per the spec I lost 1.2lbs. They don't really look any wider than the Bronsons that came with the bike, but the tread on the bronson is a lot taller so that probably makes the difference. Most of the trails around me close if they are really wet so I don't have much need for the deep tread. I'll try the new tires in a few days.

  18. #118
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    I don't get the "hard / inability to lift the front" statements??? This has not been my experience at all. Now, it is much easier with the dropper post installed of course, but floating the front over roots and rocks while seated, or lifting it standing has not been an issue. This is not something I'm strong at, I'm simply comparing directly to other bikes.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug_J View Post
    I don't get the "hard / inability to lift the front" statements??? This has not been my experience at all. Now, it is much easier with the dropper post installed of course, but floating the front over roots and rocks while seated, or lifting it standing has not been an issue. This is not something I'm strong at, I'm simply comparing directly to other bikes.
    I did 40 miles this week on mine as well, right out of the box, mine is the pro....no issues whatsoever, seems pretty easy to bounce the front up and over stuff, very nice bunny hopping bike too.

  20. #120
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    Well one thing I was doing was adjusting the fork rebound in the wrong direction, doh! But I did seem to put a little too much weight forward... shorter stem, narrowing the bar, and the setback seat post solved that. This bike flipping rules now!

  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug_J View Post
    I don't get the "hard / inability to lift the front" statements???
    Compared to what I've been riding, it's harder (takes more effort) to pop a wheelie. Does that clarify? It's not a problem, just an observation of how the bike feels vs what I've ridden.

    I got the feel for it during my first ride.

  22. #122
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    Well. I believe my large stature caused the first failure today. Rest easy it wasn't anything to do with the frame/shock/forks. It was the freehub.
    On a short but steep climb I felt like the chain broke, looked down to see the rear dérailleur pulled all the way forward and the chain trying to come off the front chainring. Weird, thinks I. Well I make sure it's all still attached and pedal on. A few feet later I try to coast and off comes the chain again. Turns out the freehub had become a fixie. So I rode, legs a going, for a mile and a half back to my truck. Drove home and pulled the back wheel. Yup the cassette was firmly locked. Couldn't turn it by hand at all. Put a chainwhip on it and with a pretty good amount of force it clicked loose then locked, over and over.
    Did some research on the webernet and found this is not an uncommon problem with shimano freehubs.
    Ordered a new one on eBay for $25 so will be replacing it when I get back from work on Saturday.
    Again NOT THE BIKE, the bike still rocks. I'm down 25lbs since April and the Supercell is why.
    Let me know if any of y'all have any freehub issues.
    Cheers!

  23. #123
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    I can't say I have many miles on the stock wheels... the first thing I put on my Supercell was a DT Swiss/ Frequency i23 wheelset.

  24. #124
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    I was on the fence between Expert and Pro but when I tried to add them to my cart the Pro was sold out, so that made it an easy decision and I ordered an Expert (which I am not) in medium.

    I know it's not recommended to buy a bike without riding it first but that's one of the upsides, IMO, to not having tons of experience. All I have to compare it to is my Giant Talon HT and I'm confident it'll be an upgrade over that.

  25. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mungusaurus View Post
    Well. I believe my large stature caused the first failure today. Rest easy it wasn't anything to do with the frame/shock/forks. It was the freehub.
    On a short but steep climb I felt like the chain broke, looked down to see the rear dérailleur pulled all the way forward and the chain trying to come off the front chainring. Weird, thinks I. Well I make sure it's all still attached and pedal on. A few feet later I try to coast and off comes the chain again. Turns out the freehub had become a fixie. So I rode, legs a going, for a mile and a half back to my truck. Drove home and pulled the back wheel. Yup the cassette was firmly locked. Couldn't turn it by hand at all. Put a chainwhip on it and with a pretty good amount of force it clicked loose then locked, over and over.
    Did some research on the webernet and found this is not an uncommon problem with shimano freehubs.
    Ordered a new one on eBay for $25 so will be replacing it when I get back from work on Saturday.
    Again NOT THE BIKE, the bike still rocks. I'm down 25lbs since April and the Supercell is why.
    Let me know if any of y'all have any freehub issues.
    Cheers!
    As long as you are comfortable with dealing with cone bearings and axles, replacing shimano freehubs is not terribly difficult. I have not worked on any of them with the 12mm through axle, and those may need some different size cone wrenches than the regular QR axle type (which usually require a 15mm and a 17mm cone wrench). A metal pencil with a small magnet where an eraser would normally resides can make the job easier. Make sure to torque down the fixing bolt that holds the freehub to the hub shell pretty good. Same thing with the cone and jam nut on the freehub side as they are notorious for coming loose if you don't.

    You and I live in the same neighborhood with regard to size. I have, over the years, toasted several Shimano freehubs because of that. Usually, it is the short but super steep climbs that seem to be the place this happens. In your case, I would look onto getting a DT Swiss 350 rear hub, and have it laced into your current rim. Not a cheap upgrade, but one that will pay dividends over years of trouble free service, and they are super easy to maintain.

    OTOH, and IME, if you can get your weight down to 220 lbs or less, the Shimano freehubs will be less likely to detonate due to rider size.
    Last edited by jeffj; 07-14-2015 at 05:04 PM.

  26. #126
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    So, what's assembly going to be like? Any special tools I should go get ahead of time?

  27. #127
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    Just an allen wrench set to put your stem/ handle bars on. Everything else is good to go! The initial adjustments I made were adjusting the brake/shifter levers and re-centering the calipers.

    It will take you longer to get everything out of the box and unwrap the parts.

  28. #128
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    Sweet! Supposed to be delivered Saturday (as long as I'm here, I assume I'll have to sign for it), then hopefully take it out Sunday and be totally lost on adjusting a fork and shock together!

  29. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by brandon_ View Post
    So, what's assembly going to be like? Any special tools I should go get ahead of time?
    Mine went together very easy. I checked tightness on everything and the only thing I needed to tighten up were the lock on grips, and one of the crank bolts was not tight enough. Shifting was spot on right out of the box. Pull the axles and put a light coating of grease on them, lube the chain up, make sure you cable routing is good, and ditch the crappy chain stay protector and ride. You will obviously need a shock pump to adjust suspension, I went with what I found on the shock and fork from the FOX website. The manuals are junk for the bike, very basic manufactures crap, nothing specific is provided for assembly or set up. Enjoy, I have ridden mine almost every day since I got it, loving the bike. To me it feels more like and agressive trail bike. I am 6'3" and 220 and I use all the suspension for sure, but it still soaks up what I ask and more. Still trying to figure out how to climb the best on a FS bike, but that is rider issue, not the bike, I just have to improve my riding.
    Good luck and enjoy!

  30. #130
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    Any of you bigger guys adjusted the rebound? I have both front and rear shocks on the highest "fast" setting. Is that what you are setting it at?

  31. #131
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    @Slyham... I'm about 3/4 of the way of highest setting, and I try to dial in the rear shock to be slightly "slower" than the fork. What pressures are you running? The last time out I was 100 front, 210 rear.

  32. #132
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    If you bought the Supercell Expert

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Jorgensen View Post
    The manuals are junk for the bike, very basic manufactures crap, nothing specific is provided for assembly or set up.
    X-Fusion's website has adequate info on setting up the fork and shock on the Expert:

    X Fusion Shox - Home
    http://www.xfusionshox.com/images/pd...ers-Manual.pdf
    http://www.xfusionshox.com/images/pd...Setupguide.pdf

    I left town for two weeks the day after mine arrived, so it is still sitting in the box. Looking forward to getting home and getting it together and, what its all about, riding it!

  33. #133
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    I just stopped by the lbs to see about a different seat post. I took the seat and post with me. The guy at the shop saw my current seat and suggested measuring my sit bone. Turns out I need a much wider saddle. The OE is 143, and based on my measurements I need a 168. Going to get that sorted before changing the post. I don't want to change too many things at once so I can tell the effect of each.

  34. #134
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    Your saddle is important to keep your butt happy so you can concentrate on the things that matter. I bought several saddles off Ebay and the bargain bin at my LBS. One seat I have that was bought under recommendation, is the WTB Speed V, fits great! I've also seen several other guys at the trails with the same one.

    One other thing I learned... if you haven't ridden in a while, any seat is going to hurt for the first couple weeks. So don't go "chasing your tail" until you've got a few miles under your butt!

  35. #135
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    Agreed. I've got a wtb saddle on my SS which I liked. I've also used specialized seats with good results. For now I picked up a specialized toupe 155 to try. It is significantly wider than the original seat. If it doesn't work out the shop will take it back and I'll probably pony up for a specialized Power seat.

  36. #136
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    I've heard good things about the Specialized seats... I just haven't found any used to try out.

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    Thanks lemke for the reply. I had 180 and 80. I've bumped up the pressure and turned down the rebound. I'll be riding this weekend so I'll see how it feels.

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    I'm about 210 pounds. My initial pressures were 220/110, and it was a little harsh. But then again, I'm not a fast or aggressive rider nor are there local trails that have any long descents. I also found that setting the rear shock sag on the "plushier" 30% rule made the bike really sluggish. So once I got the rear where it felt good, about 20-25% sag, I started messing with the front. I like my fork to be a little "snappier" than the rear. It just works for me...

  39. #139
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    I was also trying to follow the originally suggested 30% sag rule. This is my first time setting up a full suspension bike so I appreciate all the help I can get.

  40. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slyham View Post
    I was also trying to follow the originally suggested 30% sag rule. This is my first time setting up a full suspension bike so I appreciate all the help I can get.
    Yep, dont worry about exact air pressure as much as getting your sag correct. Rebound adjustment is going to be preference and varry for different riders and condition. The pro has the three postion CTD and it works great, basically three different settings with the flip of a lever. I leave mine in trail most of the time, sometime I will put the front in Climb and leave the back in trail. THe Mlink does a great job of not bobbing (if you have the front firmed up).

  41. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemke View Post
    Your saddle is important to keep your butt happy so you can concentrate on the things that matter. I bought several saddles off Ebay and the bargain bin at my LBS. One seat I have that was bought under recommendation, is the WTB Speed V, fits great! I've also seen several other guys at the trails with the same one.

    One other thing I learned... if you haven't ridden in a while, any seat is going to hurt for the first couple weeks. So don't go "chasing your tail" until you've got a few miles under your butt!
    The stock seat ain't bad, but my last bike I ran a rocket V team, that thing was sweet. The stock seat has chromo rails and a crappy cover though, I am not expecting it to last long. A quality upgrade is in store

  42. #142
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    I have a Rocket V on my HT... slightly narrower than the Speed V. I like the Rocket because it allows me to move around just a tad easier.

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    Mine arrived today and as @lemke said, it took longer to get it unpacked than to assemble.

    It should also be noted that most I work I ever did to my Talon was change brake pads and tubes so I never had handlebars off, mounted calipers, any of that stuff....but with a set of allen wrenches and a touch of common sense it was easy.

    I have an alley across from my house that has a bunch of potholes. Initially set the suspension to 100f/200r and immediately noticed the "hard to pop the front end up" that was mentioned. Should I be adjusting the air pressure in the shock or the rebound to help this (as well as adding to the fork), or is it a combination of all 3?

  44. #144
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    Is Breezer the company going out of business ? I'm curious why this bike sells at such a low price compared to other FS bikes.

  45. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug_J View Post
    I don't get the "hard / inability to lift the front" statements??? This has not been my experience at all. Now, it is much easier with the dropper post installed of course, but floating the front over roots and rocks while seated, or lifting it standing has not been an issue. This is not something I'm strong at, I'm simply comparing directly to other bikes.
    I agree, I read this and was shocked. This thing is super neutral maybe even slightly front end light, you can float the front end over anything. The first time I took it for a ride I was shocked how easy it was to just put some power into the pedals and easily carry the front end.

    I also don't get the complaining about the weight, I don't feel it at all, maybe I'm riding faster than others and carrying more speed but I don't notice it at all, even on climbs.

    I've probably got 150 miles on my bike on mostly technical new england single track and love it every ride. I've picked up so much speed and confidence over my old Cannondale Prophet that my legs are shaking through some of the really sketchy stuff but the bike just goes through it like nothing. The faster I go the better it works but if you are just casually pedalling and not really working it I can see where some of these comments may come from. Get on the gas, it'll take care of you.

  46. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by NEET View Post
    Is Breezer the company going out of business ? I'm curious why this bike sells at such a low price compared to other FS bikes.
    They don't have the renown in the [current] mountainbiking world to sell their bikes for a premium, with an un-proven suspension design even more so.

    However, for the price you can get them for they're a great deal. Especially the x-fusion equipped ones. If I had the spare cash and room I'd be ordering a Breezer!

    WTB an Ibis Ripley frame, small or medium.
    NORWAY

  47. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by NEET View Post
    Is Breezer the company going out of business ? I'm curious why this bike sells at such a low price compared to other FS bikes.
    These are 2014 closeouts. There are great deals out there if you don't mind riding "last year's" model. I know I don't

  48. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoMountainsBiker View Post
    These are 2014 closeouts. There are great deals out there if you don't mind riding "last year's" model. I know I don't
    Especially since the 14 and 15 are virtually identical. Not many changes at all. I personally like the low volume of the bike. I know when I hit the trail there are going to be a ton of Trek's, Giants, Cannodales, etc, you wont run into many Breezers. The group they are part of has many companies including, Fuji, Kestrel, and SE bikes under there banner. And the design team that Joe Breeze tasked to come up with something slightly different, even if it is not as radical as say a complex iDrive system, really knows what they are doing and has designed plenty of FS designs. Sum it up......Breezer brings the lineage and bloodlines to the company, but he got help from big corporations, and designers to come with a legit product.

  49. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffj View Post
    As long as you are comfortable with dealing with cone bearings and axles, replacing shimano freehubs is not terribly difficult. I have not worked on any of them with the 12mm through axle, and those may need some different size cone wrenches than the regular QR axle type (which usually require a 15mm and a 17mm cone wrench). A metal pencil with a small magnet where an eraser would normally resides can make the job easier. Make sure to torque down the fixing bolt that holds the freehub to the hub shell pretty good. Same thing with the cone and jam nut on the freehub side as they are notorious for coming loose if you don't.

    You and I live in the same neighborhood with regard to size. I have, over the years, toasted several Shimano freehubs because of that. Usually, it is the short but super steep climbs that seem to be the place this happens. In your case, I would look onto getting a DT Swiss 350 rear hub, and have it laced into your current rim. Not a cheap upgrade, but one that will pay dividends over years of trouble free service, and they are super easy to maintain.

    OTOH, and IME, if you can get your weight down to 220 lbs or less, the Shimano freehubs will be less likely to detonate due to rider size.
    Thanks Jeffj, Yeah I've been riding at 240 or above for 20 years and have never had a freehub fail like that. The LBS didn't have a 15mm allen so I'm still waiting for them to pull the hub off.
    I will look into the DT350, heard great things about it. In the mean time I ordered a spare back wheel so I will have one if this ever happens again.
    Still loving the bike, just wish I could get on it today!!!

  50. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by brandon_ View Post
    Mine arrived today and as @lemke said, it took longer to get it unpacked than to assemble.

    It should also be noted that most I work I ever did to my Talon was change brake pads and tubes so I never had handlebars off, mounted calipers, any of that stuff....but with a set of allen wrenches and a touch of common sense it was easy.

    I have an alley across from my house that has a bunch of potholes. Initially set the suspension to 100f/200r and immediately noticed the "hard to pop the front end up" that was mentioned. Should I be adjusting the air pressure in the shock or the rebound to help this (as well as adding to the fork), or is it a combination of all 3?
    I moved my riding position rearward... 90mm stem and bent seat post. That helped a lot for me. Once you have the right amount of "sag" dialed in your shocks, start adding rebound. I prefer a fork that pops a little quicker than the rear shock.

  51. #151
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    Maybe a silly question, but what are you guys doing about a chainstay protector?

  52. #152
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    My Repack came with one on it ( I believe the Supercell has the same one)but the adhesive on it isn't holding that great on the edges so I added a few tie wraps to make sure it stayed in place. I will be doing something more permanent eventually.

  53. #153
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    I added a lizard skinz wrap to the chainstay.

  54. #154
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    I put a wrap of electrical tape around each end of the stock protector, figuring I would do something more permanent later on. I have touched it since...

  55. #155
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    I was just curious because of the pivot location.

  56. #156
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    The dusty local trails have beat the adhesive on mine. I currently have it zip tied on, but I'll wind up wrapping an old piece of inner tube around it with a couple of zip ties. I don't think it will affect the link.

  57. #157
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    The jumbo size lizard skin wrap didn't have any effect on the suspension on mine. You can see the pic on pg5.

  58. #158
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    Perception of Weight

    I think some of the perception of this as a heavy bike comes from the "D-Fusion" tubes. They are much larger cross-section than a lot of bikes out there. But, as an engineer, I can tell you that this is a sign of advanced engineering. This cross-section, especially when combined with butting and hydroforming, gives you a greater strength to weight ratio. Its all relative, but if you compare this bike to a standard tubular frame of the same strength (strength itself is not a simple subject, but lets pretend we can compare apples to apples) this frame will be significantly lighter.

    That said, clearly Breeze erred on the side of strength. This is not a light bike. But it is not a heavy bike either. But those super fat, vaguely d-shaped tubes, are not nearly as thick as as skinnier, round or other dimensional tubes. Even though they have a larger cross section, you would find the volume of aluminum to be similar to all other aluminum frames (of the same alloy). But with greater strength.

    Just got back from trip yesterday and unpacked it. Can't wait to get it assembled and on the trail.

  59. #159
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    Getting back into the mtb scene and after spending the spring until now on my old Gary Fisher HT with a crappy shock I started looking for bikes. Was going the used route but could find anything that seemed worth it for the money. Stumbled across the Breezer and then this thread. Pulled the trigger and it should show up tomorrow..

    This will be my first FS bike and first new bike in 7-8 years. I was really hoping to find a used bike with a full XT build for a reasonable price but that wasn't seeming to workout unless it was 5-6 years old. Anyway, this bike is an upgrade in every aspect compared to my GF (except maybe weight). Excited to give it a ride.

  60. #160
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    Awesome man! After getting mine "dialed in" I'm thoroughly impressed. But then again, this is my first FS coming from a GT hardtail... it's all good. Keep us posted!

  61. #161
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    I am pretty stoked. I didn't mind the hard tail on the climbs but the downhills just seem a lot harder on me than when I was in my 20's.I was finding myself slowing down, not because I couldn't control it but because my body couldn't take the beating.

    Any tips on setup? Seems like getting sag and rebound dialed in is what makes the difference? Does the bike come with a guide for setup at all? I haven't worked with suspension on bikes but have experience with atv's, motorcycles, and jeeps so it isn't totally foreign.

  62. #162
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    There are several people (including me) on this thread that have shared their setups. I have found that setting up sag a little less than the 30% "plush" rule works for me... about 25%.

    I also had to play around with body position on the bike by employing a shorter stem and setback seat post. I'm not sure if it was due to riding style, poor posture, or I'm just old and seek comfort. Ha!

    I can totally relate to your "body couldn't take the beating" comment... which is what prompted me to get a full suspension bike, LOL.

  63. #163
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    I will start around the 25-30% range. Probably be a good idea to take the shock pump with me the first few rides to try making changes as I go. Luckily, I am still in pretty poor shape so I have plenty of breaks to think about making adjustments.

    I read that some have had trouble getting the front end up, I have that problem with my Fisher. Really interested in how this one feels. I was hesitant to buy a bike without riding it but then again I have never bought a bike I had demo'd so what difference would I know.

  64. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemke View Post
    There are several people (including me) on this thread that have shared their setups. I have found that setting up sag a little less than the 30% "plush" rule works for me... about 25%.

    I also had to play around with body position on the bike by employing a shorter stem and setback seat post. I'm not sure if it was due to riding style, poor posture, or I'm just old and seek comfort. Ha!

    I can totally relate to your "body couldn't take the beating" comment... which is what prompted me to get a full suspension bike, LOL.
    Also look around on BikeRumor.com as they had a full series of articles that they did on proper setup of your bike's suspension. Pretty good stuff but yeah as everyone else said, best to start with about 30% sag and then move from there depending on feel for you and the terrain. Get yourself a nice engineering ruler or seamstress tape measure so that you can accurately measure everything. Or if you just want a "cool toy" you can get the SAGGLE! I like mine, yeah I spent the money on one, and have lent it out to buddies for setup of their bikes. Pretty nifty but ultimately you can do the same with a ruler.

    As for the "old man back" issues, I am right there with you guys and that is exactly why I built my FS trail bike. Figured I was starting to like more aggressive terrain and riding and the 100mm XC Steel HT (On-One Inbred 29er) was just not cutting it unless there were fast flowy sections. Couldn't pass the deal up on the Thumper frame so it began there.

  65. #165
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    Welcome duneslider. Keep us posted. I continue to love the Supercell. I've been riding once or twice a week since I got it.

    Anyone attach a bottle cage to theirs? Looks like there is a spot under the down tube but I only see one bolt.

  66. #166
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    Mine has 2, but I ride with a camelbak so I haven't tried to mount anything. Maybe one of the cable clamps is using your other bolt hole.

    I'm expecting my riser bar and stem to be here tomorrow so I can get my riding position where I want. I'm just not comfortable leaning over as far with my back trouble. Other than that I've been living the bike. I also initially ordered the wrong brake adapter so the correct mount will be here tomorrow so I can mount the 203mm rotor.

  67. #167
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    Camelbak for me. I have no idea what that lone bolt is for, but a water bottle wouldn't last one ride down there.

  68. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregnash View Post
    Also look around on BikeRumor.com as they had a full series of articles that they did on proper setup of your bike's suspension.
    Here is a link to a pdf download of that suspension guide. Lots of good stuff, unless you really know your stuff it will take some work getting it setup properly. Or you just get lucky...

    http://brimages.bikeboardmedia.netdn...etup-Guide.pdf

  69. #169
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    I found the articles on bikerumor, they even have them all combined into one downloadable pdf, tried making a link for it but it appears the site doesn't like me doing that so it didn't work. There is a lot of good info in it.

    That saggle is pretty cool and 12.99 isn't horrible.

  70. #170
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    Loving the supercell!!! Had it for about a month. Got it at pricepoint like quite a few of us!

    So far put shorter stem, 60mm, went tubeless(so easy with the stock rims already taped), and put on some parts bin 1" riser bar, but may go flat again.

    Took the family to Mulberry Gap this past week. Great place, I'm from Florida so the mountains are so cool!

    I did manage to fold the front wheel....my fault.....going down a steep off-camber switchback. Being from florida I tend to ride with my tire pressure pretty low, 20-22psi due to the sand.

    I inflated the tires on all the bikes(5) before we left thinking we would be in a rush to ride right when we got in the parking lot. So I set mine to 22psi, by the time the pump came off it was probably 20-21psi.

    We rode some that day. The next morning I was riding some trail on the property and that's when it happened.

    I burped the front tire, tire goes limp, rim gets a lot of weight, turns in to a potato chip shaped object. I tumble, bike chased me, bike catches me or the chainring did, I see the Stan's seeping out stopping the leak.

    I can't be sure, but I think a lot of small factors caused this to happen. Since the weather was a good bit cooler in the morning the tire psi was probably down to 18psi, the steep tight angle of the turn plus downhill had me put a lot of pressure on the front tire, and I probably could have scooted my butt back even more past the seat to take some pressure off the tire.

    I do love the Bronson tires and I thought I would hate the squarish profile. Just the opposite. I put some mountain kings on another bike...hate'em, thought for sure I would like'em.

    I see a few of you have upgraded wheels...anyone selling a front or both?

    The past few days I've been riding my hardtail....man did I get spoiled by the breezer!

    I did have my hardtail with me at Mulberry Gap. So I rode that a bit, but I also used it's front wheel on the breezer. It's a surly rabbit hole 26" with a dirt wizard.....talk about steep head angle, but it was no problem.

    I also tried a set of 27.5's when I got home on the bike for the heck of it....with the mountain kings I hate.....bike felt soooo slow.

    Long post sorry....

  71. #171
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    Just got done with 9.5 miles of rocks, roots and logs. I am still adjusting the suspension a little at a time. I have no idea how it's supposed to feel so I'm still going by the o-rings and "yeah i think i like that" or "no, not so much".

    I'll say it. It climbs better than my hardtail. Not a high end HT at all, but still. It's got a little bob to it when really grinding it out but I like it. It still goes forward when I pedal and it saves my body that little bit of abuse. More efficient? Probably not. Better? I think so. I also felt much better and less beat up at the end of my ride.

    The 9.5 miles I just finished was at my fastest pace ever according to my phone. Not bad for a bike I got 4 days ago.

    I'm going to keep riding it before I change anything. My initial thought was "whoa, this is way different than my Talon" and immediately I started thinking "shorter stem, riser bars, etc....". But I figured it's probably different for a reason, so lets give it a shot. I definitely have more weight forward and came close to going OTB twice. Just something I need to keep in mind when going down steep, rocky descents.

    ETA: Someone said it earlier in this thread and I find it to be true too, the faster you go the better it rides. Just go and hang on, it won't let you down.



  72. #172
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    Assembled and Quick Ride This Morning

    Just fire road with a little single track a few blocks from my house, but I want to get it somewhat dialed in before Sunday when a friend and I are going to do some trail riding.

    First impression is GREAT. Such a smooth, stable bike. I went with about 25% sag which I like quite a bit. Dropping off curbs at moderate speed is almost unnoticeable. I am going to try 30% tomorrow. Need to play around with rebound on the front which feels a little too quick.

    Brakes definitely need adjusted (bled?). The levers give me too little grip at first, and then suddenly clamp down really hard in the last bit of travel.

    Only other thing I need to tweak is fit. I bought the xl and I am 6'2". Seat all the way down pedal reach is just about perfect for flatland. Maybe a tad too high to slide back behind the seat for downhill, but didn't get a chance to try it this am. Any reason not to cut a cm off the post just to give additional range to play with? I'm never going to extend the post far enough to have issues with over extension.

    Also, I really feel what some have said in that it is very hard to get the front wheel off the ground (on flat). I definitely feel forward on my hands. Which would you try first:
    1. stem extender
    2. higher rise angle stem
    3. adjustable angle stem
    4. shorter stem
    5. riser bars

    I'd like to stay away from replacing the bars unless that is just the best approach. Adjustable stems I've had before on road bikes, but worries me for a mt bike? The stem dropping several, or even a few degrees, because of an impact sounds pretty scary. Or is this not an issue? Never happened to me on the road bike.

    Finally, can anybody advise me on securing the front brake cable? The hardware was in the bag with the brake manual. But the screw just doesn't seem to fit the seat on the fork (photo). What am I missing?
    Breezer Supercell -Any thoughts?-img_20150721_212420.jpg

  73. #173
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    Mine fit fine there once I found the clamp and screw. I can't recall where it was, but I missed it during initial assembly.

    As for which options are best for adjustment, it's hard to say. I've been tweaking after each ride. I just installed a 90mm stem and 40mm riser bar this afternoon. I'm slowly getting it dialed in.

  74. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by bgredjeep View Post
    Mine fit fine there once I found the clamp and screw. I can't recall where it was, but I missed it during initial assembly.

    As for which options are best for adjustment, it's hard to say. I've been tweaking after each ride. I just installed a 90mm stem and 40mm riser bar this afternoon. I'm slowly getting it dialed in.
    I'll go through my things again. Any chance you can post a pic? I bet we are talking about the same thing. I'll try again tonight in better light. For now it is zip-tied .

    If I remember right, you are similar size to me (6.2) and on an xl also?

  75. #175
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    I have a Supercell Team and love it. I ride it the 4miles to and from work and love hitting the local trails. I just lastnight put a 80mm stem on it as I was finding it a bit tough to get the front end up at times with the stock stem.

    Depending on how that rides on the trails this weekend I will consider a low rise bar.

    This is my first bike after a long time of not riding and it is great. Part of me wishes I had the Repack for a bit more travel, but this thing is fantastic anyway. With some small changes to the cockpit I think she will be right on par.

  76. #176
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    I appreciate all the thoughts shared on this thread. I ended up going with the 650B Repack instead, but definitely appreciate this thread.

  77. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by linvillegorge View Post
    I appreciate all the thoughts shared on this thread. I ended up going with the 650B Repack instead, but definitely appreciate this thread.
    Congrats on the Repack. I love mine. I got the XL Team model for a steal from price point. I felt the stem was a little long at 90mm and put a 40mm Hussefelt stem on it and like that a lot better. It lets me get my weight a little further back. It really rides nice. Coming from a hardtail Airborne Goblin Evo I think I will be spoiled by the FS Repack.

  78. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by afterburn View Post
    I'll go through my things again. Any chance you can post a pic? I bet we are talking about the same thing. I'll try again tonight in better light. For now it is zip-tied .

    If I remember right, you are similar size to me (6.2) and on an xl also?
    6'4", so pretty close.

    Here's the pic of the clamp. It went on for me with no trouble. I seem to recall finding another bolt that I thought was for the clamp which was not the right one. Its been a few weeks so I'm not 100% sure on that.

    Breezer Supercell -Any thoughts?-20150722_215450.jpg

  79. #179
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    No need for a new thread

    Quote Originally Posted by linvillegorge View Post
    I appreciate all the thoughts shared on this thread. I ended up going with the 650B Repack instead, but definitely appreciate this thread.
    I rode the repack too. In a lot of ways I was tempted by the repack, which has so many similarities to the supercell. It may be an oversimplification, but aside from head and seat tube angle, these are practically the same bike. I ultimately chose the Supercell for 29" wheels for general trail riding.

    I say share your experience here. This can at least be a Breezer FS thread.

  80. #180
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    Aha! I do not have that in my box. Was beginning to think I was crazy. The zip tie works until I can pick one up.

  81. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by afterburn View Post
    Aha! I do not have that in my box. Was beginning to think I was crazy. The zip tie works until I can pick one up.
    I put mine together last night, it was in a small little bag just the screw and the plastic piece. It would be pretty easy to loose, or not see. Especially with all the packing materials you would be taking off.

  82. #182
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    I have a Supercell Team and love it, but was looking to get a 6" bike to go with it and am thinking about having a Repack along with it.

    Does any have experience with both that can attest to having two somewhat similar bikes? The M-link is fantastic at climbing and descending from my experience and I love it, so I figured getting the beefier version would be a sweet idea.

  83. #183
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    Hey guys, I have some questions on suspension setup and how it "should" feel.

    I have pretty much started with x-fusions charts. I weigh 200 and probably close to 210 with my gear and camelback. So, I set the front to about 105psi and it seems pretty good but maybe on the soft side? Sag seems about where it should be.

    The back has me more confused. I used the online thing that spits out a number for you. It gives several options for which shock I have. I selected the 200x51, is that the correct one? I assumed that was a measurement for the length and the shock width and that seemed pretty close to what my measuring instrument said it was?

    This spit me out a number of about 170psi for my setup. This psi seemed pretty stiff to me and doing the sag test it only seemed to move the o-ring a small amount. This brings me to the next question. How do you measure the sag on the rear suspension? I don't know what the length of compression is of the rear shock so I can measure how much the 0-ring moves but it doesn't mean much without the other number. I can't seem to find info saying how much travel the shock itself has.

    Setup this way though feels pretty good doing the neighborhood and jumping down some curbs, I seem to blow through at least 50-70% of the rear travel just riding my neighborhood, I have no clue if this is normal or not. The back does feel significantly stiffer than the front but that may be normal too.

    First ride(without even checking shock/fork pressure) I did find it nearly impossible to lift the front end and going off the curb made the nose dive. I then adjusted the pressures to 105F/170R and did the same curb jump and again nose dive and near impossible to lift front end. I then adjusted the rear rebound, slowed it down two clicks back from full slow then did the same curb and it flew straight and level, no diving off the "jump" and I was more easily able to loft the front end but it still wasn't super easy to lift it but I wouldn't say it was harder than my hard tail either. It just feels like a very planted bike.

    Any help on how to measure the rear sag on this would be awesome. I am going on a ride saturday morning and would like to try to get this close to where I feel like it should be. I know it will take some time to fine.

  84. #184
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    Sag

    I set my front same as you (I am same weight). I still think I have rebound too fast, but I like the sag.

    Rear I set at 155 (210 lbs x .75) and I still think it is a little too stiff. So I am not surprised yours is too stiff. Somebody on here recommended 30% which I am going to try tomorrow. I also need to play around with rebound on the back.

    Total travel is 120mm. It is progressive. And dropping a suburban curb is actually a moderate hit. So 50-70% travel is not surprising.

  85. #185
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    Thanks, sounds like I am probably too stiff in the rear. I did have it at about 150 and it was super plush and I just assumed there was no way riding a bike could feel like floating on clouds.

    Anyway, how are you measuring the rear sag? The rear shock doesn't compress 120mm, I am not certain what the actual travel of the rear shock is. If the shock is the 200x51 then the travel is 51mm or 2 inches which seems about right based on my measuring stick so sag would be 13-15mm measured on the shock.

  86. #186
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    Its a great question. It is a 120mm travel by spec, but I don't know if that includes any extension, or any "theoretical" travel. I think the 200x51 is the dimensions of the shock. I haven't measured sag yet. The numbers I am giving are calculation based.

  87. #187
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    120mm is the wheel travel. If the shock is a 200x51 then it is 7.875"long(200mm) with 2" of travel (51mm). The shock travel vs the wheel travel isn't the same because of the lever/angles. So, if the shock travels 51mm the wheel travels 120mm. I am just curious how others are measuring the rear sag? Online videos the guys just seem to eye ball it and say "yep, that's 25% sag."

  88. #188
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    I just sit on my bike, hop up and down a little, then lean forward and dismount. It's easier if you have a toolbox or something to step off on either side of the bike. The distance the o-ring moves from the seal is the "sag" dimension. Divide that by 51mm, and that is your percentage "sag".

  89. #189
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    That is what I needed, I wasn't positive we had the 200x51. I couldn't find it printed anywhere official but measuring seemed to indicate that was the size. I think I have the rear too stiff. I am going to try to do a ride tomorrow morning.

  90. #190
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    I've been following the last couple posts with great interest. I am also having the "this HAS GOT to be too soft" thoughts even though the sag says 30%. I set front and rear then played with shock rebound until the front would easily pop up and keep it level going off curbs/potholes.

    Is it possible for those o-rings to move while riding, especially on the shock indicating more travel than was actually used? I am assuming yes.

    Rookie question, but it is what it is.

  91. #191
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    I think the o-ring on my rear shock slides a little too easily. A small zip tie should do the trick.

  92. #192
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    I dropped the pressure down to 150-155 and it feels pretty good. I sped up the front rebound a fair amount more and it is feeling pretty nice. I am going out for a quick morning ride and will see how it feels.

    I had to give the bike a tune up tonight, the gears weren't even close to setup correct.

    Took it for a quick 1.5 mile spin through the fields/construction sites by my house. All I can say is I should have gone FS a long time ago.

  93. #193
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    I took the Supercell to a trail system yesterday that is 8.6 miles if you do it all. It's all singletrack, not very technical but littered throughout with roots and probably 15-20 log-overs average 6"dia.

    I did 2 laps, 1 lap in each direction totaling 17.3 miles, for the first time ever. I always wanted to do 2 laps but the constant stuttering over the bumps on the HT just left me too beaten. The legs would have done it but not the rest of me.

    In archery we say "it's not the bow, it's the Indian" but I can't help but give all the credit to the bike in this case.

  94. #194
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    Fitting Better

    My new stem didn't arrive as scheduled. So I moved the seat forward and rolled the bar upward (rather, down, so the grips came up) and found a much better fit already. Pedalling wheelies pretty easy now. Manuals are still eluding me, but I only have backyard speed to play with . . . until tomorrow morning, that is.

  95. #195
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    Is anybody having trouble turning the rebound knobs on both the fork and shock? X-fusion on the Expert.

  96. #196
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    The shock is much harder to turn than the fork but I still wouldn't call it 'hard'.

    To your other post, I still can't get a set of riser bars out of my mind.

  97. #197
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    Well, I was able to put some seat time in the last couple of days. The biggest issue I am having is actually the seat. I just don't think this one is working for me. I will probably take the one off my old bike and try it to see if it makes me happier.

    I rode two trails, one Friday and one today. Both are regulars for me and I have a few passes on them with strava so I can sort of compare. The bike was no magic bullet, my times are "faster". Some sections are faster and I have been able to make it up things I couldn't before but some sections have been slightly slower. The one area that has been consistently faster is the down hill sections. I am enjoying them now, so that is a good thing and that was what I was hoping for most of all.

    I have been slowly backing off the pressure in the fork and shock. I am making it through about 3/4 of the travel in the rear shock and maybe 2/3 of the travel in the front fork. To me that means I probably have it too stiff. I need to measure sag again and see where these last changes put me.

    In the last 2 days I have put in 13.1 miles and just about 2600ft elevation gain.

  98. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by afterburn View Post
    Is anybody having trouble turning the rebound knobs on both the fork and shock? X-fusion on the Expert.
    They are fairly stiff to turn buy not horrible. I to like that they have a distinct detent for every turn. I like knowing I turned it a full click.

  99. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by afterburn View Post
    My new stem didn't arrive as scheduled. So I moved the seat forward and rolled the bar upward (rather, down, so the grips came up) and found a much better fit already. Pedalling wheelies pretty easy now. Manuals are still eluding me, but I only have backyard speed to play with . . . until tomorrow morning, that is.
    I have never been great at manuals with mtb's with suspension. My old rigid hardtail was not trouble but I don't get much out of the last two bikes I have had. I am guessing technique is mostly my issue. I can float the front enough on this to allow me to clear obstacles on the trail. It does seem the quicker you are going the easier it is to loft the front.

  100. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by brandon_ View Post
    The shock is much harder to turn than the fork but I still wouldn't call it 'hard'.

    To your other post, I still can't get a set of riser bars out of my mind.
    I am in the same boat. I am feeling pretty good with the feel of the bike other than the seat (this is probably a my butt problem) and the bars. These bars are a few inches wider than my last bike and that feels a bit weird every time I get on. I actually was thinking today while riding that my hands are pretty light on the bars so I am feeling really good about the setup.

    I do keep wondering about a riser bar though...

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