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  1. #1
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    Alternative XC 29er with the "Yelli Screamy" geometry, do the exist?

    Does anyone know of a decent hydro-formed aluminum XC 29er with the "Yelli Screamy" geometry in the XL frame:

    Yelli Screamy - the 29er that handles like a 26" mountain bike frame

    I love the idea of short chainstays, slack head tube angles , and wide tire clearance; but want to stay in the $300 range for the frame only (I would build it up myself).

    I mainly ride cyclocross, so this is just a fun bike for me, to try out MTBing; not a race bike.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Alternative XC 29er with the "Yelli Screamy" geometry, do the exist?-yelli1200-wgeo.jpg  

    Alternative XC 29er with the "Yelli Screamy" geometry, do the exist?-yelli-english.jpg  

    Alternative XC 29er with the "Yelli Screamy" geometry, do the exist?-yelli-metric.jpg  

    Alternative XC 29er with the "Yelli Screamy" geometry, do the exist?-yelli-screamy-xl-1024x682.jpg  


  2. #2
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    So you want a hydroformed alu frame with modern geo and tapered HT all for under $300 IF you find this, PLEASE, let the rest of us know the brand and how to get one ;-)

    I.E. the short answer=NONE, the long answer=NONE
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  3. #3
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    OK hydroformed alu is out how about a Yelli geometry in double-butted 7005 aluminum tubing. Similar in price to the Sette Razzo 29er Alloy Hardtail Frame
    Sette Razzo 29er Alloy Hardtail Frame | Sette | Brand | www.PricePoint.com

    I was all set to jump on this until ( http://forums.mtbr.com/member.php?u=598965 ) eb1888 pointed out that the Razzo 29er has too steep of a head tube angle at 71.5.

    It can't cost more to put a slack head tube angle and shorter chainstays on a similar frame, can it? OK I also want a 32mm seat tube since a weigh 220lbs and am 6'-4" so instead of the Razzo 29er at $250; I want to pay $300. I am OK with a Chinese frame for this project.

    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    So you want a hydroformed alu frame with modern geo and tapered HT all for under $300 IF you find this, PLEASE, let the rest of us know the brand and how to get one ;-)

    I.E. the short answer=NONE, the long answer=NONE

  4. #4
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    The short chainstays are where the higher price tag comes in to play. Most require custom CNCed chainstay yokes and bent seattubes in order to tuck the rear wheel so far up underneath the saddle.

    I picked up a lightly used Banshee Paradox frame a few months back for $350 so deals can be had but you're not likely to find anything new for the price you're looking for. Honestly, if you're used to cross bikes you may hate the way a slack MTB feels, it's a completely different ride than your cross bike. That being said I love my trail hardtails as much as my cross bike, fun to have both options for the same trails.

    Keep an eye out for a used Kona Honzo(steel)/Taro(AL), Transition TransAm 29er(steel), Canfield Yelli Screamy, Banshee Paradox. They're around but few and far between in the used market.

  5. #5
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    What about the Trek Stache 8:
    Trek Bicycle

    It has the slack head-tube; what do you think about the chainstays?

  6. #6
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    This is exactly what I was looking for as far as advice, thanks GTscoob!

    Which of these (in the XL frame size) will work best for general XC for a giant like me (6'-4" and 220lbs)?

    Kona Honzo
    KONAWORLD

    Kona Taro
    KONAWORLD

    Transition TransAm 29er
    Transition Bikes

    Banshee Paradox
    Paradox | Banshee Bikes: DH Race, Freeride, All Mountain, Trail, Slopestyle, DJ/Street/4x, Aggressive Trail, Cross Country

    vs:
    Canfield Yelli Screamy
    Yelli Screamy - the 29er that handles like a 26" mountain bike frame

    Also, does any one have one of the above for sale used in XL? I guy can only wish right?


    Quote Originally Posted by GTscoob View Post
    The short chainstays are where the higher price tag comes in to play. Most require custom CNCed chainstay yokes and bent seattubes in order to tuck the rear wheel so far up underneath the saddle.

    I picked up a lightly used Banshee Paradox frame a few months back for $350 so deals can be had but you're not likely to find anything new for the price you're looking for. Honestly, if you're used to cross bikes you may hate the way a slack MTB feels, it's a completely different ride than your cross bike. That being said I love my trail hardtails as much as my cross bike, fun to have both options for the same trails.

    Keep an eye out for a used Kona Honzo(steel)/Taro(AL), Transition TransAm 29er(steel), Canfield Yelli Screamy, Banshee Paradox. They're around but few and far between in the used market.

  7. #7
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    All great bikes, think you'd be happy with any of them, but I guess if I had to pick I'm partial to Banshee, but the new Yelli does look sweet. My next HT will be Ti though, so most likely candidate the Titus frame if I can find one or a custom Triton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erik_A View Post
    Which of these (in the XL frame size) will work best for general XC for a giant like me (6'-4" and 220lbs)?

    Kona Honzo, Kona Taro, Transition TransAm 29er, Banshee Paradox, Canfield Yelli Screamy
    Yup, as a matter of fact I'm being forced into selling my V1 XL Paradox However shipping would be a bit much to make it worthwhile.
    Also, does any one have one of the above for sale used in XL? I guy can only wish right?
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??
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  8. #8
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    Those are all big hit trail/all mountain bikes, not XC bikes by any stretch.

    What are you focused on, hitting jumps and railing berms or being the fastest guy to the top of the hill? All those bikes listed take a preference to descending. For 'general XC' I'd say to look elsewhere, these bikes really excel in steep techy downhills. The Sette Razo, while an old design, would be perfect for general XC riding and getting you comfortable with mountain biking. Build it up right and most of the parts will move over to a new frame if you decide you want something more capable/playful.

  9. #9
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    There is (or was) an XL Banshee Paradox in the mtbr classifieds for $300. Not mine, I was/am tempted by it, but I don't really like aluminum frames.

    edit: looks to be sold. Sorry.
    WTB: Specialized AWOL frameset, XL

  10. #10
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    I am 40 years old, so definitely not focused on, hitting jumps and railing berms. I want to do some 50k - 100k endurance rides that require more than a cross bike.

    What geometry should a tall, old, & heavy guy like myself look for (or should I just jump on the Sette Razo)?



    Quote Originally Posted by GTscoob View Post
    Those are all big hit trail/all mountain bikes, not XC bikes by any stretch.

    What are you focused on, hitting jumps and railing berms or being the fastest guy to the top of the hill? All those bikes listed take a preference to descending. For 'general XC' I'd say to look elsewhere, these bikes really excel in steep techy downhills. The Sette Razo, while an old design, would be perfect for general XC riding and getting you comfortable with mountain biking. Build it up right and most of the parts will move over to a new frame if you decide you want something more capable/playful.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTscoob View Post
    Those are all big hit trail/all mountain bikes, not XC bikes by any stretch.
    I've got a N9, and it gets around on flat to rolling trails just fine, and climbs OK. I've thought all along a racer would surprise themselves if they gave one a try. Maybe I'm wrong but I wouldn't dismiss them out of hand.

    Quote Originally Posted by Erik_A View Post
    I am 40 years old, so definitely not focused on, hitting jumps and railing berms.
    Don't give up so young, you're just a pup.
    When you get older, much of your hate comes from knowledge and experience, which is why really old people hate everyone

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTscoob View Post
    Those are all big hit trail/all mountain bikes, not XC bikes by any stretch.

    What are you focused on, hitting jumps and railing berms or being the fastest guy to the top of the hill? All those bikes listed take a preference to descending. For 'general XC' I'd say to look elsewhere, these bikes really excel in steep techy downhills. The Sette Razo, while an old design, would be perfect for general XC riding and getting you comfortable with mountain biking. Build it up right and most of the parts will move over to a new frame if you decide you want something more capable/playful.
    You are pigeonholing these frames. They are not just for hucking and screaming downhill. This 'new' geometry with short stays and slack angles makes for a bike that is just fun to ride. I've been riding a custom frame for about 5 years with a 69 degree headtube angle and sub 17" stays, and it's just fun. I am also over 40, and am not focused on racing or hucking, but just want to have fun when I am riding, and this geometry just works to that. It's not twitchy like a XC racer and the seating position is more upright. It sounds like just what the OP is looking for. Also, with a shorter fork you can increase the angles for quicker steering

    As for finding something for $300, good luck! Keep looking in the classifieds and Ebay and you may get lucky. Or just wait longer, I'm sure more frames will be released with similar geometry and lower price points.

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  14. #14
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    The Guardian gets killer reviews on here. It'll be a good starter bike and if you feel you want to get the front end a little slacker, drop a 100mm suspension fork on there to slacken the HA out a degree.

    Or 100mm fork with a Works components angleset to get down to a 69 deg static HA but imagine that might start making the bike feel a little portly. Part of what makes an AM hardtail feel so well is that the wheelbase is kept in check by having such a short rear end and a long front center, not the best for climbing as you'll be fighting to keep the front end on the ground but excellent for throwing the bike around.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTscoob View Post
    Those are all big hit trail/all mountain bikes, not XC bikes by any stretch.

    What are you focused on, hitting jumps and railing berms or being the fastest guy to the top of the hill? All those bikes listed take a preference to descending. For 'general XC' I'd say to look elsewhere, these bikes really excel in steep techy downhills. The Sette Razo, while an old design, would be perfect for general XC riding and getting you comfortable with mountain biking. Build it up right and most of the parts will move over to a new frame if you decide you want something more capable/playful.
    All this talk of "railing berms" and "steep techy riding" is giggle worthy. 2 degrees of head angle and 1/2" shorter chainstays has nothing to do with whether or not you can keep up with your buddies on the local Saturday morning ride.

    It's the Indian, not the arrow.

  16. #16
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    At your size and based on your description of how you like to ride, I would not worry about finding something slack/short like the N9. In fact, I'd probably tell you to go for something with longish chainstays and a "normal" (ie 70-71) HTA. If you want to sit in the saddle and crank out long rides, and you're not tiny, there is probably not going to be any huge benefit to getting something crazy short or super slack. Are those kind of bikes fun? Sure, I ride them myself. But for a long day in the saddle on XC trails I'd take a longer wheelbase setup.

    The other bonus of not worrying about slack/short is that you have a ton of inexpensive options for frames, many of which can be purchased, ridden, and then taken back apart and sold to someone else for not much less $ if you don't like them.

    -Walt
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  17. #17
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    I love the Yelli geo and had one (in steel) for a while. But specific to your use (endurance rides), I'd get something different. And probably in steel rather than aluminum.

  18. #18
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    Love my TransAM 29 for XC with some fun technical downhill sections. Climbs great....out of the saddle. I'm on a 120mm fork. I've never had so much fun on a bike. just my .02 cents
    Transition TransAM 29er
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik_A View Post
    I may give up on the slack head-tube angles and get this in the 22" size for $599 (complete build):
    Airborne Gaurdian


    ]
    You need an air fork.
    The XC coil fork has 28mm stanchions and so it's going to be too flexy at your weight. The coil spring is not really correct either.
    So a low price build would be a BikeDirect Gravity Point 1 with a Recon Gold air fork from Random Bike Parts or a Manitou Tower Pro off ebay with a Clysedale spring. $450 plus 240 or a bit more. Geo of 445CS and 69 HT angle.
    The Trek X-Cal range has very similar. The same Taiwanese company makes both frames.
    The 2012 Grav P 6 is more but has XT and XTR drive and a dual air Reba which is no longer offered as Sram has made the Reba solo air.

  20. #20
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    Dude thanks for the info, I will check it out. Which is better the old Reba dual air or the new solo air?

    Quote Originally Posted by eb1888 View Post
    You need an air fork.
    The XC coil fork has 28mm stanchions and so it's going to be too flexy at your weight. The coil spring is not really correct either.
    So a low price build would be a BikeDirect Gravity Point 1 with a Recon Gold air fork from Random Bike Parts or a Manitou Tower Pro off ebay with a Clysedale spring. $450 plus 240 or a bit more. Geo of 445CS and 69 HT angle.
    The Trek X-Cal range has very similar. The same Taiwanese company makes both frames.
    The 2012 Grav P 6 is more but has XT and XTR drive and a dual air Reba which is no longer offered as Sram has made the Reba solo air.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik_A View Post
    Dude thanks for the info, I will check it out. Which is better the old Reba dual air or the new solo air?
    There are plenty of informative threads in the Suspension section on people getting a good tune on the Reba. But you need to put the effort in, like many things. The solo is useable but not as tuneable. It's geared more towards entry level riders.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    All this talk of "railing berms" and "steep techy riding" is giggle worthy. 2 degrees of head angle and 1/2" shorter chainstays has nothing to do with whether or not you can keep up with your buddies on the local Saturday morning ride.

    It's the Indian, not the arrow.
    This is such solid advice... I think a lot of people, myself included, should really read this to themselves before spending a ton of money on bikes/parts.

    I rode a bike with v-brakes the other day and thought, "my, these work darn well... why do we have finiky disc brakes on xc/trail bikes again?"

  23. #23
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    look for a used one on pinkbike
    2012 Pivot Mach 429
    2010 Cervelo R3 SL

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