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  1. #1
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    29er+ bikes, really tempted

    My curiosity has recently wandered towards 29er+ bikes but the stupid search feature drops the "+" so I can't find anything specific to 29+ bikes without getting a big dump of regular 29er bikes.

    What 29+ bike choices are available? Any 29+ thread worth pouring through?

  2. #2
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    Non-custom and "stock" , the Surly Krampus. It has my attention too. I am sitting with a more than capable Santa Cruz Highball Carbon, yet my eye wanders--What I really want is to be able to take a Krampus out on some of the trails I ride and make a decision from there--maybe next summer.

  3. #3
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    I like mine, but it's a custom Ti belt drive Rohloff. The big tires really roll well and eat trail. It's a great way to go rigid.

  4. #4
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    I would read this: Surly Krampus

    The only production 29+ bikes are the Surly Krampus and ECR.

    You can convert or custom build a number of production fatbike frames to 29+, but be sure to verify the specific one you are looking at as some won't fit them.

    Then you can always commission a custom bike and go 29+.

    I've got a Krampus and it's been a lot of fun to ride and I use it mostly as a bikepacking/touring rig.

    The main issue with 29+ at the moment is you have exactly 1 tire in 2 tpi versions to pick from and they are both fairly delicate. Surly has a new 2.75" knobby coming out for next spring called the Dirt Wizard, but it will likely also be on the delicate side as it will use the same casing as the 29+ Knards.

    This is a niche niche so it's hard to say if anyone, but Surly will make tires for it so 29+ may stay as a really small pool of tire options for the time being.

    Personally I'm okay with that and I am happy to have any 29+ choice at all, but it's something to go into with open eyes.
    Last edited by vikb; 10-28-2013 at 01:38 PM.
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  5. #5
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    29er+ bikes, really tempted

    As usual, Vikb is spot on. Search for "Busted a Knard" to read about my adventures with the single tire choice.

    Regardless, I love the Krampus. I ride it single speed and in super techy, chunky, rocky terrain here in Austin, TX. I just did a 77 mile, 5700 ft ride on my rigid, geared 29er on Saturday, and wow did I miss the Krampus cush...

    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    The only production 29+ bikes are the Surly Krampus and ECR.
    There may be one other production choice, however. Check out the Carver Gnarvester. It's 29+ specific, built around their 420 frame. I'm running their carbon tapered fork and ti bar on my Krampus and have liked both. No other affiliation except Forrest Carver has been great to work with...

  6. #6
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    I've also considered jumping onto the Fat Bike bandwagon, or even a 29+. Are there Fat Bike tires out there that hold up better to singletrack riding than the 29+ offerings.
    I only ride bikes to fill the time when I'm not skiing.

  7. #7
    Give it a crank
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    One more, this "Rudy Fat" 29er looks pretty interesting: 29+ Frame "Rudy Fat" / Traversbikes

  8. #8
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    If you have an old rigid you like (love ma KM), then dropping some 45mm> rims, a 29"+ tyre on the front and big 2.4" tyre like the Ardent/RR/C.Monkey is an ideal way to make it more funner This is my plan for my Monkey, pair of Velocity DUALLY 45mm rims and a Chunky Money 2.4" outback and Knard upfront.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHouseMan View Post
    I've also considered jumping onto the Fat Bike bandwagon, or even a 29+. Are there Fat Bike tires out there that hold up better to singletrack riding than the 29+ offerings.
    Fatbikes and 29+ bikes are [for the most part] rigid mountain bikes. They will both hold up fine to singletrack use. I don't see any particular advantage to one option over the other in terms of durability.

    There are some suspension fork options that work with both fatbikes and 29+ bikes - to add some squish.

    I just remembered Lenz Sport bikes will build you a full suspension 29+ production mountain bike - just ask for a Fatmoth.

    Genre busting bikepacking rig?

    ...which might be the ticket for rougher singletrack.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    Fatbikes and 29+ bikes are [for the most part] rigid mountain bikes. They will both hold up fine to singletrack use. I don't see any particular advantage to one option over the other in terms of durability.

    There are some suspension fork options that work with both fatbikes and 29+ bikes - to add some squish.

    I just remembered Lenz Sport bikes will build you a full suspension 29+ production mountain bike - just ask for a Fatmoth.

    Genre busting bikepacking rig?

    ...which might be the ticket for rougher singletrack.
    Thanks for the reply, but I was specifically asking if there were better tires out there in fat bike world for ST than the 29+ tires that are currently available, not the bikes themselves.
    I only ride bikes to fill the time when I'm not skiing.

  11. #11
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    To me it's like, WHY if you've got an FS would you want/need 3" tyres, at least of this type that aren't very burly to take abuse.
    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    Fatbikes and 29+ bikes are [for the most part] rigid mountain bikes. They will both hold up fine to singletrack use. I don't see any particular advantage to one option over the other in terms of durability.

    There are some suspension fork options that work with both fatbikes and 29+ bikes - to add some squish.

    I just remembered Lenz Sport bikes will build you a full suspension 29+ production mountain bike - just ask for a Fatmoth.

    Genre busting bikepacking rig?

    ...which might be the ticket for rougher singletrack.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    To me it's like, WHY if you've got an FS would you want/need 3" tyres, at least of this type that aren't very burly to take abuse.
    Because you want to go somewhere skinnier tires won't take you and you don't enjoy riding a rigid MTB.

    I don't have the budget for a Fat-Moth, but I could put one to good use.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHouseMan View Post
    Thanks for the reply, but I was specifically asking if there were better tires out there in fat bike world for ST than the 29+ tires that are currently available, not the bikes themselves.
    Ahhhh got it.

    There are heavier fatbike tires that are more robust than the current Surly Knards, but any of the lighter fatbike tire suffer from the same issues as the 29+ tires for the same reasons - if you want to make a big tire light you have to make it thin walled and reduce the tread.
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  14. #14
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    29+ is okay. I had a Krampus and it wasn't too bad but in my opinion you may as well get a real fat bike. The 29+ is an imperfect compromise. Big and heavy like a fat bike tire but without the traction.

    I sold the Krampus for an ROS 9. It has these huge Scwalbe Nobby Nic tires on it that are nevertheless recognizable mountain bike tires. They really do roll over **** but are not so big and heavy and without the massive rims.

    Not disparaging the Krampus. Some people swear by it and I really liked it at first but it really did nothing I couldn't do on my Pugsley. I love fat bikes but the selling feature of the 29+, that you can use it with standard mountain bike parts and frames only makes sense if you only have one bike and want to change configurations every now and then.

    Now, if I had the inclination I'd get a titanium Salsa Bear Grease or the new Specialized Fat Boy. If you want a quality fat bike may as well go all in.

  15. #15
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    Very similar experience for me as well.. I had a few good months on the Krampus, both geared and SS, but it was not as fast as a 29er, nor as floaty as a true fat bike. I can see how a lighter version of it, 1x11 with a good suspension fork, would be a great bike for my needs, but as it was, it just wasn't the best choice for my only non-fat bike. If I could afford lots of bikes, it would be in the quiver for certain.

  16. #16
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    29er+ bikes, really tempted

    Same here as the last two posters. I think 29+ is the worst of both worlds. The Krampus rides like a really long, heavy 29er. Not a fan. If you can get two bikes, ride a normal 29er and a real fat bike. If only one bike is in the cards, get a fatty.

  17. #17
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    I replaced a 29er HT with the Krampus and have a fat bike as well. Of the three I like the Krampus best. It's faster rolling than the fatbike and has bigger wheels than either of the other bikes for amazing roll over. The large 29+ tires give me more traction and stability than the skinny 29er which makes for stable highspeed bombing.

    If I had to pick from those 3 options I'd take the Krampus every time.

    Not every bike is going to work for every rider so it's worth getting a test ride in if you can.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    I replaced a 29er HT with the Krampus and have a fat bike as well. Of the three I like the Krampus best. It's faster rolling than the fatbike and has bigger wheels than either of the other bikes for amazing roll over. The large 29+ tires give me more traction and stability than the skinny 29er which makes for stable highspeed bombing.

    If I had to pick from those 3 options I'd take the Krampus every time.

    Not every bike is going to work for every rider so it's worth getting a test ride in if you can.
    You wouldn't pick the fatbike that can run the 29+ tires?
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  19. #19
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    This one should be coming soon.


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  20. #20
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    Maybe someone should start a running list of available 29er+ bikes. There must be half dozen mentioned here already and here's another...

    29er+ Muru Mungo Ti bike....

  21. #21
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    Cool-blue Rhythm

    I wouldn't, here is why. I don't own a fatbike but have spent a lot of time on either friends bikes (Pugsley/Fatback) or the lbs "shop" bike (Krampus) and hanging around those guys.

    So I have no bias yet really. I'm really trying to figure out what I like better still.

    I think the problem with true fat bikes is the sheer weight of the tires right now. Lots of are starting at 4.7, 4.8" and don't ride on snow for the most part. Love the traction, but hate the tire weight after the honeymoon period. We have been taught all along best place to reduce weight is rotational weight - and guess what FAT bikes have too much weight in two of the most performance enhancing places: tires and rims. Carbon will help with that, but the barrier to entry for me will never happen. I'm not spending $2500+ on carbon 26" fat rims so I can climb faster.

    If you spend a lot of time on the FATBIKE forum, you will see people starting super fat, but seem to be working their way back down to 3.8" tires who are riding these as trail bikes through the entire year. Pretty much all of my friends have. The new Stans FAT rims in 52mm I think will create a new "niche" in the category which should produce some lighter weight bikes. But you still have the super wide Q factor/BB weirdness which goes with super fat tires. I have no desire to ride in the snow, we have no packed trails where I live and when it snows I go skiing.

    29+ right now is limited to pretty much one bike, one tire, and really one rim. The tire is super thin but heavy, the rim is super heavy and delicate, and the frame/fork is a pig. Literally. 30. pound.rigid bike. uuugh. The draw (for me) though is with 29+ is you still get most of the 29er benefits, same bb width, and the weight isn't as bad as a 26x4.8" tire. The traction of 26xFAT is way better than a 29+ but everything else is super slow. 29" by design has really good traction to begin with, so a 3.0 has really good traction but you can still rip the trails. The shop Krampus though has seen stick punctures and rock slices like a hot knife through butter. No way can you shred trail like you can a with say Nobby Nics or Ardent 2.4" tires on a standard 29".

    So my opinion is 29+ is super cool, but it is supported by one tire, one rim, and people are starting to branch out to custom TI offerings to get the weight down. A better rim is still needed (lighter) and a tire that can be ridden hard at trail bike speeds.

    So basically I think vikb is right. But a rigid 29+ for me that is 23 pounds or less would be ideal.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    You wouldn't pick the fatbike that can run the 29+ tires?
    If I could test ride it maybe, but I love the way the Krampus handles and for my needs now I can use 29+ a ton more than I can use fat tires so I wouldn't sacrifice much to get the 4" or 5" rubber clearance.

    Having said that my fat bike is paid for and does what it does well so I keep it and I am happy to have it.

    We may well convert my GF's Pugsley to 29+, but that is purely an economic decision because she would never spend the $$ on a new Krampus.
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post


    I have no details, but looks like another 29 x 3" tire. Not the knobby that some folks are waiting for, but at least it's another option.
    Stuff I've become aware of recently:

    29+ Tires

    Surly Knard 29 x 3 [available now]
    Surly Dirt Wizard 29 x 2.75 [spring 2014]
    Vee Rubber Vee8 29 x 3 [available ???]

    29+ Rims

    Surly Rabbit Hole 29 x 50mm [available now]
    Velocity Dually 29 x 45mm [available now]
    Velocity Blunt 35 29 x 35mm [available now]
    Derby Carbon 29 x 35mm [available now]
    Schlick North Paw 29 x 47mm [available now]

    29+ Bikes

    Surly Krampus
    Surly ECR
    Some fatbikes
    -- Pugsley
    -- Ti Mukluk [pre-2013]
    Carver Gnarvester
    Muru Mungo
    RSD Bikes
    Lenz Sport Fat-Moth
    Travers Bikes Rudy Fat
    38 Frameworks Mastadon

    All the custom frame builders can do a 29+ if they are interested in the format and design challenges.
    Last edited by vikb; 11-21-2013 at 08:09 AM.
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  24. #24
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    Great info guys. This is the fence I sit on. I don't think fat is worth the expense right now. I think 3"+ tires could be a good thing , but choices just aren't there. I built a 35mm wheel with a Knard for a friends rigid and he likes it, rolls over stuff great, but the tire is little thin. I have a Knard sitting on my bench but haven't built the wheel for myself yet. Arizona tends to be hard on tires so I'm surprised he hasn't torn it yet. He rides very hard so is a good test dummy :-)
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  25. #25
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    Looks like tires a the big issue, well actually it really is all about wider tires to begin with. Scary prices too, some tires go for over $100 each.

    Here's another 29+ frame I spotted while googling, not much info on it but there's more on their FB page.

    Twenty2Cycles - Bikes - 29+

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