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  1. #1
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    27.5 Tire Size Reference

    The intent here is to create a list of tires in a size ranking. Since I cannot ensure each tire is measured the same way or on the same rim, at same pressure, etc. my goal is strictly to quantify them in relative comparisons to one another. If we know A > B and B > C then we can list them as A, B, C as a ranking of large to small even if the A-B and B-C comparisons aren't the same. We need only ensure that any given comparison occur on same rim and at the same pressure for each tire in that comparison. I believe this is necessary both for overall tire diameter as well as tire width.

    Here is what I have culled from various threads, and if there is an omission or an error just please post and I can update the list accordingly (I expect there WILL be errors, so please point them out and help make this a great reference).

    Diameter, from largest to smallest:
    1. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.35 (Pacestar: 698 g - 730 g)
    2. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.35 (Trailstar: 790 g - 834 g, Pacestar: 813 g - 840 g)
    3. Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4 (735 g - 735 g)
    4. Maxxis Ardent 2.25 (690 g - 690 g)
    5. WTB Wolverine 2.2 (590 g - 590 g)
    6. Kenda Nevegal 2.35 (706 g - 706 g)
    7. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.1 (xxx g - xxx g)
    8. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.3 (740 g - 740 g)
    9. Schwalbe Racing Ralph 2.25 (501 g - 586 g)
    10. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.25 (575 g - 580 g)
    11. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.25 (xxx g - xxx g)
    12. Kenda Nevegal 2.1 (xxx g - xxx g)
    13. IRD Fire XC Pro 2.1 (xxx g - xxx g)
    14. Vee Rubber Mission 2.1 (629 g - 634 g)
    15. Maxxis Crossmark 2.1 (Standard: 611 g - 629 g, Exception: 501 g - 532 g)
    16. Vee Rubber Vee 10 2.1 (xxx g - xxx g)
    17. Pacenti Quasi-Moto 2.0 (xxx g - xxx g)


    Not ranked for diameter:
    Schwalbe Rocket Ron 2.25 (Pacestar: 463 g - 528 g)

    Width, from widest to narrowest:
    1. Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4
    2. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.35
    3. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.35
    4. Maxxis Ardent 2.25
    5. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.3
    6. Kenda Nevegal 2.35
    7. WTB Wolverine 2.2
    8. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.25
    9. Schwalbe Racing Ralph 2.25
    10. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.25
    11. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.1
    12. Kenda Nevegal 2.1
    13. IRD Fire XC Pro 2.1
    14. Vee Rubber Mission 2.1
    15. Maxxis Crossmark 2.1
    16. Vee Rubber Vee 10 2.1
    17. Pacenti Quasi-Moto 2.0


    Not ranked for width:
    Schwalbe Rocket Ron 2.25

    Fred
    Last edited by RagerXS; 02-08-2013 at 02:21 PM. Reason: Adjusted list

  2. #2
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    Interesting the Pac 2.1 is higher on list then the 2.3. Hhm. Looks like the Maxxis is the size I should be picking up for beter clearence on my conversion. Thanks for the list.
    Wait whuuut, who did he tell you that!?!?....

  3. #3
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    Nice work! that's a good easy to compare list you got there.
    UGG boots will germinate Paris Hilton like intellect in your soles!

  4. #4
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    Hi Rager, great work, but could you add the actual size? Thanks.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMac47 View Post
    Interesting the Pac 2.1 is higher on list then the 2.3. Hhm. Looks like the Maxxis is the size I should be picking up for beter clearence on my conversion. Thanks for the list.
    The Neo-Moto 2.1 and 2.3 supposedly share the same casing and differ only in the size of the tread pattern, so it could be just manufacturing tolerances that result in me measuring my 2.1 taller than my 2.3 and at least one other individual doing the same. But in my experience at least they are extremely close in overall diameter such that if you can clear one in that dimension then you should be able to use either. Depending on the feedback we get from others I may edit the original post to show some as ties either for diameter or width, as applicable.

    Fred

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by loamranger View Post
    Hi Rager, great work, but could you add the actual size? Thanks.
    I agree completely that the actual measured sizes would be of benefit, but unfortunately I do not believe it would be correct to include that at this time. Consider that if 'James' measures two tires, 'John' measures two, 'Jake' measures two, 'Joe' measures two, 'Jerry' measures two, 'Jen' measures two, and 'Jill' measures two we can legitimately collect all those comparisons and compile into a single listing (as I have attempted here, above). Likely they all used different measuring devices, different rims, different pressures, etc., they most likely will not all report the exact same specifications for a Neo-Moto 2.3 and Kenda Nevegal 2.35. However, all that compared those two tires are likely to agree which was taller and which was wider, even though their measurements are unlikely to agree exactly on either tire.

    What may help us all, however, is if folks reply here with their actual measurements. In doing so please include the specific rim used as well as the pressure (and for consistency let's all try to measure at 30 PSI). As we collect data we may then be able to then list size ranges for the tires as part of the list.

    Fred

  7. #7
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    Don't forget to try the Ritchey Shields! 2.1", pretty true to size.
    Great tires for XC racing...I wouldn't recommend them for aggressive trail, as the sidewalls are thin...but it's very light!
    My Bike: http://forums.mtbr.com/showpost.php?...3&postcount=49

    On-One Whippet 650b XC machine

  8. #8
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    I like it!

    Quote Originally Posted by RagerXS View Post
    I agree completely that the actual measured sizes would be of benefit, but unfortunately I do not believe it would be correct to include that at this time. Consider that if 'James' measures two tires, 'John' measures two, 'Jake' measures two, 'Joe' measures two, 'Jerry' measures two, 'Jen' measures two, and 'Jill' measures two we can legitimately collect all those comparisons and compile into a single listing (as I have attempted here, above). Likely they all used different measuring devices, different rims, different pressures, etc., they most likely will not all report the exact same specifications for a Neo-Moto 2.3 and Kenda Nevegal 2.35. However, all that compared those two tires are likely to agree which was taller and which was wider, even though their measurements are unlikely to agree exactly on either tire.

    What may help us all, however, is if folks reply here with their actual measurements. In doing so please include the specific rim used as well as the pressure (and for consistency let's all try to measure at 30 PSI). As we collect data we may then be able to then list size ranges for the tires as part of the list.

    Fred
    Wait whuuut, who did he tell you that!?!?....

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by RagerXS View Post
    The intent here is to create a list of tires in a size ranking. Since I cannot ensure each tire is measured the same way or on the same rim, at same pressure, etc. my goal is strictly to quantify them in relative comparisons to one another. If we know A > B and B > C then we can list them as A, B, C as a ranking of large to small even if the A-B and B-C comparisons aren't the same. We need only ensure that any given comparison occur on same rim and at the same pressure for each tire in that comparison. I believe this is necessary both for overall tire diameter as well as tire width.

    Here is what I have culled from various threads, and if there is an omission or an error just please post and I can update the list accordingly (I expect there WILL be errors, so please point them out and help make this a great reference).

    Diameter, from largest to smallest:
    1. Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4
    2. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.35
    3. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.35
    4. Maxxis Ardent 2.25
    5. Kenda Nevegal 2.35
    6. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.1
    7. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.3
    8. WTB Wolverine 2.2
    9. Schwalbe Racing Ralph 2.25
    10. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.25
    11. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.25
    12. Kenda Nevegal 2.1
    13. IRD Fire XC Pro 2.1
    14. Vee Rubber Mission 2.1
    15. Maxxis Crossmark 2.1
    16. Vee Rubber Vee 10 2.1
    17. Pacenti Quasi-Moto 2.0


    Width, from widest to narrowest:
    1. Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4
    2. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.35
    3. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.35
    4. Maxxis Ardent 2.25
    5. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.3
    6. Kenda Nevegal 2.35
    7. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.1
    8. WTB Wolverine 2.2
    9. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.25
    10. Schwalbe Racing Ralph 2.25
    11. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.25
    12. Kenda Nevegal 2.1
    13. IRD Fire XC Pro 2.1
    14. Vee Rubber Mission 2.1
    15. Maxxis Crossmark 2.1
    16. Vee Rubber Vee 10 2.1
    17. Pacenti Quasi-Moto 2.0


    Fred
    The Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4 is the widest, but not the tallest, I'll still give the award to the NN 2.35.

  10. #10
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    S those are out?

    Quote Originally Posted by dhbomber View Post
    Don't forget to try the Ritchey Shields! 2.1", pretty true to size.
    Great tires for XC racing...I wouldn't recommend them for aggressive trail, as the sidewalls are thin...but it's very light!
    Cool. Have to check them out for summer time zipping!
    Wait whuuut, who did he tell you that!?!?....

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by pastajet View Post
    The Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4 is the widest, but not the tallest, I'll still give the award to the NN 2.35.
    Gram,

    Have you compared the two? Can you verify where the TT fits in diameter as compared to the Hans Dampf?

    Fred

    P.S. I've added tire weights to the list, showing the lowest and highest reported weights. If yours fall outside the range I have listed, just post her please.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by RagerXS View Post
    Gram,

    Have you compared the two? Can you verify where the TT fits in diameter as compared to the Hans Dampf?

    Fred

    P.S. I've added tire weights to the list, showing the lowest and highest reported weights. If yours fall outside the range I have listed, just post her please.
    I'll measure when I get a chance, Schwalbe has been slot to the punch in getting me a set of HD's...ugh.

  13. #13
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    This makes sense and could prove quite useful. We could supplement this with measurements as they become more commonly understood.

    Also useful could be a corresponding list of 26" tires so we see the overlap in sizes, allowing me to answer the question, "which 26" tires are as tall or taller than a 650b Neo 2.1"?
    Last edited by morkys; 01-24-2013 at 08:11 AM.

  14. #14
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    I can add weights from my recent conversion --

    10. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.25 (xxx g - xxx g) 575g & 580g

  15. #15
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    info

    Really good info!

  16. #16
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    If we are talking about actual real life tires measured and/or compared on an actual bicycle, the ranking above for the Neomoto 2.1 vs Racing Ralph 2.25 are reversed.

    On my 2008 Brodie Mettle 26" fs xc mtb, a Neomoto 2.1 fits on the rear with ample clearance, but although the wheel actually fits on the bike seated fully in the dropouts with the 2.25 Racing Ralph, the tire contacts the frame and the tire won't turn. Either your width or diameter ranking for these tires is incorrect.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by morkys View Post
    If we are talking about actual real life tires measured and/or compared on an actual bicycle, the ranking above for the Neomoto 2.1 vs Racing Ralph 2.25 are reversed.

    On my 2008 Brodie Mettle 26" fs xc mtb, a Neomoto 2.1 fits on the rear with ample clearance, but although the wheel actually fits on the bike seated fully in the dropouts with the 2.25 Racing Ralph, the tire contacts the frame and the tire won't turn. Either your width or diameter ranking for these tires is incorrect.
    Thanks for this feedback - I have to assume the Racing Ralph is wider than the Neo-Moto 2.1 but want to confirm before I update either list. Was the rubbing you encountered on the sides or on the back of the seat post?

    Fred

  18. #18
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    Nice work on the list RagerXS. I was looking to try some other tires on my Rush conversion, but the 2.1 Nevs I'm running are about as big as I'd want to go on the rear.

  19. #19
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    27.5 Tire Size Reference-2.1-nevagal-26-vs-2.1-neomoto-650b.jpg

    Pictured is the rear triangle of my 08 Brodie Mettle with the 650B x 2.1 Neomoto on the left and my 2.1 x 26" nevegal on the right. When I tried a 650B x 2.25 Racing Ralph, it contacted right where those welds are.

    I realize the 2.1 Neomotoe is on backwards...was just rushed onto the rim for test fitting.

    Quote Originally Posted by RagerXS View Post
    Thanks for this feedback - I have to assume the Racing Ralph is wider than the Neo-Moto 2.1 but want to confirm before I update either list. Was the rubbing you encountered on the sides or on the back of the seat post?

    Fred
    Last edited by morkys; 02-20-2014 at 08:26 AM.

  20. #20
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    Really good stuff Rager, thanks!
    Everybody needs to remember to consider the age of the tire when making comparisons, in addition to rim width, pressure, etc.
    I mounted a 2.3 Neo Moto that was a mm or two smaller than the 2.1 it was replacing, but that 2.1 had survived longer than any other (and I've trashed a box full of them) and was reaaaaally supple and well stretched, where-as the 2.3 was brand spanking new and still kind of stiff and small.

  21. #21
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    Fred, thanks for posting this chart. Believe it or not, I was really getting frustrated
    on the min. clearance or lack thereof on my rear wheel with Nevegals 2.1 and was
    contemplating just saying the hell with it! I'm going to lace up a 26'er back on.

    So by chance, I stumbled on this thread and decided to give it another chance
    and try a couple of Quasi Motos. What the hell, I already spent $$$ converting,
    waiting (back order on P35's) the damn rims anyways.

    I sometimes (I have NO LIFE) dream about rocks and pebbles eating up my rear
    yoke on the bikes and finishing up a ride with barely any aluminum left between
    the tire and the rear triangle. Actually they are nightmares. Again thanks!

    Pics of my 650b converts: 2 stinkys, each now with sand blasted rear triangles
    from pebbles and stuff due to low rear tire clearance--not on the bottom but
    on the top portion. The bottom has 1-3/4" of clearance. Go figure.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 27.5 Tire Size Reference-p4pb8632301.jpg  

    27.5 Tire Size Reference-p4pb8632302.jpg  

    Ride More, Eat More

  22. #22
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    My two 2012 Racing Ralph tires were quite off the stated weight at 543g & 586g.
    Attached Images Attached Images   

  23. #23
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    Updated with more weights...

  24. #24
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    My measurements for a few 27.5 and 26 tires.

    Quote Originally Posted by morkys View Post
    Also useful could be a corresponding list of 26" tires so we see the overlap in sizes, allowing me to answer the question, "which 26" tires are as tall or taller than a 650b Neo 2.1"?
    I posted my measurements about a month ago in another thread, but for the life of me, I can't find it again using the Search function on this site. I must be an idiot... So, I'm re-posting this (sorry if you've seen it before):

    Brand, Model (Nominal Size) Rim: Measured Dia. x Measured Width

    Schwalbe, Hans Dampf SnakeSkin (27.5x2.35) Flow EX: 27.90 x 2.43
    Maxxis, Ardent EXO (27.5x2.25) Flow EX: 27.88 x 2.29
    Kenda, Nevegal (27.5x2.35) Flow EX: 27.75 x 2.43
    Pacenti, NeoMoto (27.5x2.1) Flow EX: 27.63 x 2.21
    Schwalbe, Hans Dampf SnakeSkin (27.5x2.25) Crest: 27.57x2.23
    Pacenti, NeoMoto (27.5x2.3) Flow EX: 27.56 x 2.41
    Kenda, Nevegal DTC (27.5x2.1) Crest: 27.53 x 2.24

    Maxxis, Ardent (26x2.4) Flow: 27.19 x 2.42
    Maxxis, Minion DHF 3C Wire Bead (26x2.7) Flow: 26.88 x 2.51
    Specialized Control, S-Works (26x2.3) Arch EX: 26.81 x 2.26
    Maxxis, Ardent (26x2.25) Flow: 26.81 x 2.23
    Kenda, Nevegal StickE (26x2.1) Arch EX: 26.63 x 2.17

    Tires inflated to 30psi for all measurements. Width measured at the widest point, be it the knobs, or the carcass.

    *Edit 24Aug2013: Added 27.5x2.35 Schwalbe HD
    *Edit 25Aug2013: Corrected 27.5x2.25 Schwalbe HD measurements, and added 26x2.7 Maxxis Minion measurements.
    Last edited by lixxfe; 08-25-2013 at 05:40 PM.

  25. #25
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    Rocket Ron - 27.5 x 2.25 - WTB Frequency i23 - actual: 27.60 x 2.20
    EVO, TLR, Pacestar
    weight: 496g
    Brand new, mounted with tube, 40psi

  26. #26
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    So does anyone know how far up that list I should be able to go with the stock Float RL fork on my Nickel and a 650B Arch Ex rim?

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcbliss View Post
    So does anyone know how far up that list I should be able to go with the stock Float RL fork on my Nickel and a 650B Arch Ex rim?
    Would like to know also

  28. #28
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    I have a Fox 32 Float FIT RL 150mm... it easily fits the 2.2" WTB Wolverine (3/8-1/2" clearance). I'm supposed to have a 2.4" Trail Taker delivered today, so I'll report back when I get it mounted on my Stans Arch EX front wheel.

  29. #29
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    Yeah, 2.35 Nevegal is an easy fit too. Can't speak with any experience beyond that.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by doismellbacon View Post
    Yeah, 2.35 Nevegal is an easy fit too. Can't speak with any experience beyond that.
    Can you define 'easy'? How many mm clearance at the arch, and how many mm clearance to the crown at bottom-out?

    From my experience with 2012 fox talas 32/150 and float 34/160, A 650b Nevegal 2.35 on a Flow EX barely clears arch (1-2mm max) and hits on bottom-out...

    Even on my 2011 36/160, I only have about 5mm clearance with the 2.35 Nev.

  31. #31
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    Here's a 2.35 Hans Dampf in a 36.


    From this thread

  32. #32
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    27.5 Tire Size Reference

    Quote Originally Posted by lixxfe View Post
    Can you define 'easy'? How many mm clearance at the arch, and how many mm clearance to the crown at bottom-out?

    From my experience with 2012 fox talas 32/150 and float 34/160, A 650b Nevegal 2.35 on a Flow EX barely clears arch (1-2mm max) and hits on bottom-out...

    Even on my 2011 36/160, I only have about 5mm clearance with the 2.35 Nev.
    Interesting. I've got 5mm at the tightest point on a Float 140, and for where I ride that's plenty. This is a well stretched 2.35 Nev on a Flow at 30psi, and open dropout Float from a couple years ago.
    I admit it does make gentle crown contact with 0 psi in the garage, so I should be careful what I say, but never the least bit of buzz while riding. On this pre-FIT damper fork at least, bottom out is impossible even under hard riding without setting it at basically un-rideably low pressure.
    But a call out was probably warranted.... Word to the wise: Always check everything yourself with your parts when doing a conversion....it's your collar bone at risk.

    27.5 Tire Size Reference-imageuploadedbytapatalk1361056909.603649.jpg

    And here's one with a 5mm Allen sliding through the tightest spot and tire size on casing visible.

    27.5 Tire Size Reference-imageuploadedbytapatalk1361057048.331286.jpg

  33. #33
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    I just mounted the 2.4" Trail Taker (on Stan's Arch EX rims) on my bike with a Fox 32 RL FIT 150mm, and there's approximately 3/16"-1/4" of clearance. I had the 2.2" WTB Wolverine on there before, and that gave me between 1/4-3/8" of clearance.

    The Trail Taker is definitely a BEEFY tire... it's every bit of 2.4"+ wide (if not more) which is exactly what I wanted on the front of my Blur LT. I got in 20 miles this morning and I like what I've seen so far. It's relatively light for its size and it seems to roll well in comparison to the Wolverine I had on there previously. I'll post a picture of the clearance a little later.

  34. #34
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    2013 Kenda 650b MTB Tires

    Add to that list:

    Kenda Honey Badger Pro - 650b x 2.20
    Kenda Karma Pro - 650b x 2.00
    Kenda Slant Six Pro - 650b x 2.10

    The Nevegal Pro in new catalog shows:
    650b x 2.35
    650b x 2.10

  35. #35
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    I don't have exact measurements, but here's a picture of the Vee Trail Taker on my Fox 32 RL Float FIT 150mm fork (and Stans Arch EX rims). There's about 1/4" of clearance on top, and plenty of clearance on the sides. The tire pressure is around 32 PSI and the tires have only seen one 20-mile ride so they're virtually new.


  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by smmokan View Post
    I don't have exact measurements, but here's a picture of the Vee Trail Taker on my Fox 32 RL Float FIT 150mm fork (and Stans Arch EX rims). There's about 1/4" of clearance on top, and plenty of clearance on the sides. The tire pressure is around 32 PSI and the tires have only seen one 20-mile ride so they're virtually new.

    That's plenty for my comfort level at the arch. What's happening at the bottom of the crown at bottom out? Gotta be rubbing slightly at least but I'll also default to what doismellbacon said about the Fox forks and their ability to NOT get full travel.
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  37. #37
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    Correct- when I let all the air out and compress the fork, it rubs slightly when it's completely bottomed out. I haven't used more than 130-140mm of the travel on a ride yet, so that doesn't really concern me. I can't remember the last time I bottomed out my front fork.

  38. #38
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    Schwalbe Racing Ralphs 650b x 2.25" (57-584)
    Mounted on Alex XD Lite 584x18
    Approx 12 light miles on dirt singletrack...so pretty new.

    As measured with digital calipers.

    Width @ 30psi
    knob to knob
    53.6mm (2.112")

    sidewall to sidewall
    52.1mm (2.053")
    ____________________________

    Width @ 50psi
    knob to knob
    53.9mm (2.122")


    sidewall to sidewall
    52.9mm (2.086")

  39. #39
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    bump

  40. #40
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    Clearance on my Nickel.

    I got my new wheels installed on my Nickel this week, and I am happy to report that with the Neo Motos I have plenty of space. I have the Fox Alps 130mm fork. The crown comes a little lower than the arch at full bottom with no air in the chamber, but there is still plenty of clearance.
    27.5 Tire Size Reference-wp_20130219_004.jpg

  41. #41
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    Bump! Good info that needs to get a "sticky."
    MTBP
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    I wish they'd make a 2.4x27.5 Ardent. The 2.25 Ardent is just Ok, but I love the 26x2.4 version. Those are some serious knobs! For those of you with a Vee TT, how would you rate it in cornering compared to the Ardent or Hans Dampf?

  43. #43
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    27.5 Tire Size Reference-2013-02-23-14.34.02.jpg

    Hi Guys,
    This is a great thread for us upgraders. With the front Fox Fork, I'm also getting about 5mm clearance with Crest 650b and RocRon 2.1. It seems to be enough clearance for even rainy muddy days here in Malaysia.

    Now I am trying to get the rear of my Trance X converted. The last "dry test" showed about 5-6mm clearance for the contact edge of tire, see attached photo. The side walls have ample 15mm of clearance.

    Does anyone have any experience of minimal clearance for rear conversions ? Anyone ridden in muddy conditions where the accum mud was causing friction ?

    Thanks for being part of this group...

  44. #44
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    I'm converting my 2007 Rush to 650B, just ordered the wheelset (Stans Flow EX). I notice many or the forum postings list 2.1" widths for the rear and 2.3" in the front. Is this because many conversions run into a clearance problem in the rear with wider tires, or is it just a general preference for narrower rear wheel?

  45. #45
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    Hi tamu, I believe this is more because most riders want a lower weight tire in the rear if they can do so without sacrificing too much in traction. Though certainly there are some frames that require it.

    Fred

  46. #46
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    I have a 2006 Rush converted. The issue on my bike isn't so much frame clearance as it is front derailleur clearance. Running a 2.1 Nevegal in the rear, the side knobs would rub the front d in the small chainring. I solved the problem by slightly changing the dish of the rear wheel, and shifting my bottom bracket to the right. I'm running a Race Face X-type bottom bracket which comes with spacers to adjust chainline. The 2006 Rush swingarm doesn't have the chainstay bridge which I believe the 2007 does. I'm not sure how that will affect your tire choice. Looking at the tire, I might be able to run a slightly larger size, if it had low profile side knobs. Hope this helps!
    By the way, the conversion really improved the bike. My only complaint about the bike before was the low bottom bracket. I was always having pedals strikes when riding. They are greatly diminished in both frequency and severity now, and it rolls through the rock gardens easier. The Nevegal's grip great, but do roll noticeably slower than the 2.1 Panaracer Fire Pros and 2.1 IRC Mythos tires I used to run.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clipless in PA View Post
    I have a 2006 Rush converted. The issue on my bike isn't so much frame clearance as it is front derailleur clearance. Running a 2.1 Nevegal in the rear, the side knobs would rub the front d in the small chainring. I solved the problem by slightly changing the dish of the rear wheel, and shifting my bottom bracket to the right. I'm running a Race Face X-type bottom bracket which comes with spacers to adjust chainline. The 2006 Rush swingarm doesn't have the chainstay bridge which I believe the 2007 does. I'm not sure how that will affect your tire choice. Looking at the tire, I might be able to run a slightly larger size, if it had low profile side knobs. Hope this helps!
    By the way, the conversion really improved the bike. My only complaint about the bike before was the low bottom bracket. I was always having pedals strikes when riding. They are greatly diminished in both frequency and severity now, and it rolls through the rock gardens easier. The Nevegal's grip great, but do roll noticeably slower than the 2.1 Panaracer Fire Pros and 2.1 IRC Mythos tires I used to run.
    Might want to consider the Shimano M665 E Type FD. It's a compact double specific (wont work for 3 rings) and the cage is quite a bit shorter than your typical LX/XT FD and the shifting is better overall from what I read. It also might mount more forward to the seatpost as well just looking at it. Wait...as a matter of fact I have a brand new one I'd sell you that I never mounted on my Prophet since that bike is for sale.
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  48. #48
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    27.5 Tire Size Reference

    Thanks for doing the work and posting this up. You've just made my life a lot easier!

  49. #49
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    I will show pics tomorrow but the new WTB Wolverine 2.2 I mounted last night to a LB Carbon rim measured true in width at 2.2" but almost 28" in overall diameter. Much taller than I expected from what I've read.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by kburati View Post
    I will show pics tomorrow but the new WTB Wolverine 2.2 I mounted last night ...
    I am about to try out the Wolverine's on an Orbea Occam conversion, so I would be very interested in your results.

    Pj
    Phoenix, AZ

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by kburati View Post
    I will show pics tomorrow but the new WTB Wolverine 2.2 I mounted last night to a LB Carbon rim measured true in width at 2.2" but almost 28" in overall diameter. Much taller than I expected from what I've read.
    Quote Originally Posted by pdinphx View Post
    I am about to try out the Wolverine's on an Orbea Occam conversion, so I would be very interested in your results.

    Pj
    Phoenix, AZ
    Me2

  52. #52
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    So is anyone making a 2.5" width tire yet... I have looked around and haven't seen one?
    -------------------------------------------------
    bikepacking.com

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by kburati View Post
    I will show pics tomorrow but the new WTB Wolverine 2.2 I mounted last night to a LB Carbon rim measured true in width at 2.2" but almost 28" in overall diameter. Much taller than I expected from what I've read.
    Mounted a pair on Stan's Crests and they measured at a disappointing 27.6" ... are yours the race or AM version?

    Pj
    Phoenix, AZ

  54. #54
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    FYI: Eyeballing the tire height can be a bit inaccurate. To properly get the height you need to make a jig for measurement. Something like this seems to work well...

    27.5 Tire Size Reference-tirejig_1.jpg27.5 Tire Size Reference-tirejig_2.jpg

  55. #55
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    Bump!

    Just added dimensions for the 2.25HD to my list (Post #24)

  56. #56
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    Just also picked up a Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.25 Snakeskin Evo...weighs in at 680g for the record. I noticed the list on the first post was missing the weight.

  57. #57
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    Just picked up a MAXXIS 2.30 High roller 2 today
    i can measure it if when i get it installed if you want to add it to the chart?

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by julesverne View Post
    Just picked up a MAXXIS 2.30 High roller 2 today
    i can measure it if when i get it installed if you want to add it to the chart?
    Would appreciate the measurement, and will look forward to a ride report as well.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosquito1 View Post
    Would appreciate the measurement, and will look forward to a ride report as well.
    +1 It would be great if you could also provide measurements of a tire that is already on the charts (if you have one) so that your measurements can be 'normalized'. Everyone has a slightly different way of measuring tires so values may not all be consistent. Including a reference tire measurement should take care of that variable.

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by RagerXS View Post
    The intent here is to create a list of tires in a size ranking. Since I cannot ensure each tire is measured the same way or on the same rim, at same pressure, etc. my goal is strictly to quantify them in relative comparisons to one another. If we know A > B and B > C then we can list them as A, B, C as a ranking of large to small even if the A-B and B-C comparisons aren't the same. We need only ensure that any given comparison occur on same rim and at the same pressure for each tire in that comparison. I believe this is necessary both for overall tire diameter as well as tire width.

    Here is what I have culled from various threads, and if there is an omission or an error just please post and I can update the list accordingly (I expect there WILL be errors, so please point them out and help make this a great reference).

    Diameter, from largest to smallest:
    1. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.35 (Pacestar: 698 g - 730 g)
    2. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.35 (Trailstar: 790 g - 834 g, Pacestar: 813 g - 840 g)
    3. Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4 (735 g - 735 g)
    4. Maxxis Ardent 2.25 (690 g - 690 g)
    5. WTB Wolverine 2.2 (590 g - 590 g)
    6. Kenda Nevegal 2.35 (706 g - 706 g)
    7. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.1 (xxx g - xxx g)
    8. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.3 (740 g - 740 g)
    9. Schwalbe Racing Ralph 2.25 (501 g - 586 g)
    10. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.25 (575 g - 580 g)
    11. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.25 (xxx g - xxx g)
    12. Kenda Nevegal 2.1 (xxx g - xxx g)
    13. IRD Fire XC Pro 2.1 (xxx g - xxx g)
    14. Vee Rubber Mission 2.1 (629 g - 634 g)
    15. Maxxis Crossmark 2.1 (Standard: 611 g - 629 g, Exception: 501 g - 532 g)
    16. Vee Rubber Vee 10 2.1 (xxx g - xxx g)
    17. Pacenti Quasi-Moto 2.0 (xxx g - xxx g)


    Not ranked for diameter:
    Schwalbe Rocket Ron 2.25 (Pacestar: 463 g - 528 g)

    Width, from widest to narrowest:
    1. Vee Rubber Trail Taker 2.4
    2. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.35
    3. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.35
    4. Maxxis Ardent 2.25
    5. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.3
    6. Kenda Nevegal 2.35
    7. WTB Wolverine 2.2
    8. Schwalbe Hans Dampf 2.25
    9. Schwalbe Racing Ralph 2.25
    10. Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2.25
    11. Pacenti Neo-Moto 2.1
    12. Kenda Nevegal 2.1
    13. IRD Fire XC Pro 2.1
    14. Vee Rubber Mission 2.1
    15. Maxxis Crossmark 2.1
    16. Vee Rubber Vee 10 2.1
    17. Pacenti Quasi-Moto 2.0


    Not ranked for width:
    Schwalbe Rocket Ron 2.25

    Fred
    A few of my tires vary from your ranking. All measured as clearance from a fork crown, on the same rim. Variance is very small though. If it's that tight your in trouble.
    Neo 2.3 is taller than a neo 2.1 by about 1mm[ due to taller tread].
    Hans Dampf 2.35 is about 1mm taller than a no ni 2.35.
    Ra Ra 2.25 is virtually same height but 0.5mm wider than a Neo 2.1.
    HD 2.25 is similar height to Neo 2.3 and 2mm narrower but with a larger casing volume.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by gvs_nz View Post
    HD 2.25 is similar height to Neo 2.3 and 2mm narrower but with a larger casing volume.
    How do you get more volume from a tire that's the same height and narrower? Are the lugs that much shorter on the HD?

  62. #62
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    Maxxis Crossmark 27.5 x 2.1 dimensions

    I've got a Maxxis Crossmark 2.1 mounted up on a 28mm wide Flow that measures 27 3/8", or 695mm in diameter, and 52mm (2.05") wide on both the casing and the side lugs.

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by doismellbacon View Post
    How do you get more volume from a tire that's the same height and narrower? Are the lugs that much shorter on the HD?
    "You had my curiosity, but now you have my attention." (Django Unchained) On the contrary, actually. I just measured a set of new, unused 27.5 NeoMoto 2.3 and Hans Dampf 2.35 that I have in the garage. The NM knobs measure 3.5mm tall, and the HD knobs measure 4mm tall.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by MntnMan View Post
    "You had my curiosity, but now you have my attention." (Django Unchained) On the contrary, actually. I just measured a set of new, unused 27.5 NeoMoto 2.3 and Hans Dampf 2.35 that I have in the garage. The NM knobs measure 3.5mm tall, and the HD knobs measure 4mm tall.
    Haha... "You silver tongued devil, you."

    Yes, exactly what I thought.....so.....I'm still wondering how you get higher volume out of a skinnier tire?....

  65. #65
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    Hi, I would like to add the new Vee Rubber Speedster and XCX 650x1.95b tires.

    They both measure approximately 49mm on Velocity Blunt rims.

  66. #66
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    maxxis 2.30 high roller 2
    2 1/4" width
    27 3/4" diameter
    mounted to a flow ex
    forgot to weigh

    schwalbe nobby nic 2.35
    2 5/16 width
    27 13/16 diameter
    mounted to a flow ex
    27 13/16" diameter

  67. #67
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    where'd you buy the high roller II's?

    weird that the maxxis site only lists the 2.4 inch size.
    Originally posted by bucksaw87
    I still fail to see how mustaches, fixies, and PBR are ironic.

  68. #68
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    it is weird
    lbs got them for me
    they didnt even know to look for them
    high roller has always been a good back tire for me
    ride mostly light all mountain with lots of climbing

  69. #69
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    Michelin Wild Grip'r Advanced 2.25
    weight 714g
    on a light-bicycle carbon rim @ 25PSI:
    * casing/knobs width is a hair over 2.3"
    * the diameter is almost exactly 28", or perhaps 1/32" less than that

    It is a *massive* tire for 2.25, almost as big as the 2.4 Trail Taker. It barely fits in the rear of my Mojo HD; if you have a tight fit conversion, do not recommend it. It is mucho bigger than a Hans Dampf 2.25 or Neo Moto 2.3.

    I like the Grip'r a lot though. It has an excellent grip on dry/wet rocks, loose stuff, in mud / swamps but I skidded off a few wet roots. Tested in Bear Brook NH.

  70. #70
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    have a Michelin Wild Grip'r Advanced 2.35...weight is 801 g. Not yet mounted, so unstretched, but bead-to-bead distance is 15.0 cm which will translate into a pretty large casing volume. Will provide measurements after I mount it (next week hopefully, once wheel is built. light bicycle carbon rim.).
    Originally posted by bucksaw87
    I still fail to see how mustaches, fixies, and PBR are ironic.

  71. #71
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    Sounds like a nice size. The 26" model seems larger in the reinforced version too, wondering about the b

  72. #72
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    One more side note - my initial experience says the Grip'r's sweet spot is 18-20PSI tubeless. 25PSI == loss of traction on wet rocks and roots.

  73. #73
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    For comparison;
    New Vee Rubber Mission 2.3 measured smaller in width and slightly smaller in diameter than my used Nevegal 2.1's on Velocity Blunt SL rims.
    Width - Mission 2.3 2.07" casing 2.16" tread. Used Nevegal 2.05" casing 2.2" tread. Don't have a jig to measure diameter, but using a ruler and a level, it looks like the Mission is a skosche smaller than the Nevegal. Perhaps a 1/16th to 1/8th of an inch, but the Kenda has half a season on it.

  74. #74
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    could someone update the list with high rollers 2, both 2.3 and 2.4? trying to figure out if they would fit my mojo HD conversion
    thanks

  75. #75
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    Hi guys
    Seems like the rocket ron was not ranked...lookin at it for the rear of my 160 mojo hd (light shim) in conjunction with a Nobby nic on front (34) anyone comment?

  76. #76
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    Doesn't anyone tried any of the Hutchinson offerings ?
    2006 Cannondale Rush 650b
    2010 Cannondale Trail SL 650b
    2013 Norco Range Killer-B

  77. #77
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    I picked up a pair of the Hutchinson Cross Country Cobra 27.5 X 2.25 at the Sea otter classic 2013 in Monterey CA. Good news is they seal up well tubeless but Bad news is they don't even spin once I put them on my 2012 Cannondale Scalpel. They Rub hard on the rear bridge.

  78. #78
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    How about the Geax tires, are they crap or something? Not seen any reviews.

    But pricepoint has the 650B AKA and Saguaro tires for just $30 each. Tempting.

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by njsanna View Post
    Schwalbe Racing Ralphs 650b x 2.25" (57-584)
    Mounted on Alex XD Lite 584x18
    Approx 12 light miles on dirt singletrack...so pretty new.

    As measured with digital calipers.

    Width @ 30psi
    knob to knob
    53.6mm (2.112")

    sidewall to sidewall
    52.1mm (2.053")
    ____________________________

    Width @ 50psi
    knob to knob
    53.9mm (2.122")


    sidewall to sidewall
    52.9mm (2.086")
    These measurements are consistent with my experience with Neo-Moto 2.3 and Trail Taker measured size growth with higher pressures.

    I also found no significant measurable difference in width or height (rollout) within commonly ridden tire pressure range, 25 to 35 psi.

    Rim width difference does change sidewall and tread profile. Using the same tire pressures, wider rims increase sidewall width mostly near the rim, and very slightly narrow tread widths, and edge knobs stand up to slighlty flatten or square the tread profile, and the casing under the edge knobs is firmer allowing using much lower air pressures without reducing sidewall stability.

  80. #80
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    Hutchison 27.5 X 2.25

    Here is the tire on the 2012 scalpel size medium
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 27.5 Tire Size Reference-20130711_152834.jpg  


  81. #81
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    At 32 psi

  82. #82
    What? There's more?
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    Ordered a couple yesterday because the price was too good to pass up. Will advise when I get them into service.
    Also have Kinda Honey Badger 2.2 on a WTB Frequency i23 rim at 30 psi measures 28.0" OAD, 2.14" casing width, 2.34" tread width.

  83. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyrebyter View Post
    Ordered a couple yesterday because the price was too good to pass up. Will advise when I get them into service.
    Also have Kinda Honey Badger 2.2 on a WTB Frequency i23 rim at 30 psi measures 28.0" OAD, 2.14" casing width, 2.34" tread width.
    Wow. The Honey Badger is really a full 28" in diameter? I thought they'd be a little shorter based on the 29er version.

  84. #84
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    Measured twice. Surprised me too.

  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by doismellbacon View Post
    Wow. The Honey Badger is really a full 28" in diameter? I thought they'd be a little shorter based on the 29er version.
    So if I'm not mistaken this would make it the tallest 650b tire yet? Little heavy though @ 780 grams (taken from tyrebyter's other post about the tire).

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by doismellbacon View Post
    Wow. The Honey Badger is really a full 28" in diameter? I thought they'd be a little shorter based on the 29er version.
    That's because the Honey Badger is the baddest tire of them all, he doesn't give a s**t.
    2006 Cannondale Rush 650b
    2010 Cannondale Trail SL 650b
    2013 Norco Range Killer-B

  87. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrock831 View Post
    At 32 psi
    Thank you for posting. How tall is the tire?

  88. #88
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    Bump! Super helpful thread: should be a sticky! I'm curious where the honey badger sits on the chart, high roller as well..
    On heavy rotation: White Lung: Deep Fantasy

  89. #89
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    I'm about to mount up a HR2. I'll post up the #s when I do.

  90. #90
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    can you also provide the RR 27.5 x 2.25 tire diameter?

  91. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by buggymancan View Post
    can you also provide the RR 27.5 x 2.25 tire diameter?
    He did. It's number 9 for diameter and width. See the chart in the first post of this thread.

  92. #92
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    Having it listed as number 9 in daimeter ranking does not provide me with the needed dimension.

  93. #93
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    FYI
    Just put a Ardent 2.25 on my stans flow rear rim and have a neo-moto 2.3 on the front. Ardent is taller, but not wider as ranked here. both at about 33psi.

  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by ymiller996 View Post
    FYI
    Just put a Ardent 2.25 on my stans flow rear rim and have a neo-moto 2.3 on the front. Ardent is taller, but not wider as ranked here. both at about 33psi.
    See my post, #24 in this thread. My measurements agree with your observations: Ardent taller, but not wider.

    In case anyone is interested, I just mounted up Hans Dampf in 2.35 and 2.25. Will post results soon.

  95. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by MntnMan View Post
    He did. It's number 9 for diameter and width. See the chart in the first post of this thread.
    Ranking is great, but I need to know the actual diameter measurements, don't you? Anyone have that for the Racing Ralph 27.5 x 2.25?

  96. #96
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    my 27.5 tires, casing/tread/weight
    Continental Trail King 2.4 - 61/59/1027g - on Pacenti TL28
    Continental Mountainking II 2.4 - 60/60/766g - on WTB Frequency i23
    Mavic Charger 2.4 - 57/59/1074g - on WTB Frequency i23

  97. #97
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    Can anyone confirm the diameter of the 650b x 2.25 Schwalbe Racing Ralph? I hear 27.25"? How about the Maxxis High Roller 2 27.5 x 2.3? I see the diameter listed anywhere form 27.75" to 27.5"? Please confirm.

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    27.5 Tire Size Reference

    I can post RR dims tomorrow if nobody replies before then.

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    Photos of 2.35HD in 2011 Fox 36

    Quote Originally Posted by lixxfe View Post
    See my post, #24 in this thread. My measurements agree with your observations: Ardent taller, but not wider.

    In case anyone is interested, I just mounted up Hans Dampf in 2.35 and 2.25. Will post results soon.
    Just updated my list with HD2.35. Also, here are photos of arch clearance in my 2011 Fox 36: Just about 3mm (1/8") at the top.

    27.5 Tire Size Reference-2.35hd_arch_clearance.jpg27.5 Tire Size Reference-2.35hd_archside_clearance.jpg

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    27.5 Tire Size Reference

    A new Schwalbe Racing Ralph 27.5 x 2.25 ( Evo, TLR, Snake skin, Pacestar ) measures exactly 700 mm or 27 9/16" in diameter. Casing width is 57mm, just like its labeled, and lug width is 55mm. Tire is mounted on original Flow (23mm internal) at 28psi, and only has 5 miles on it. Measurements were taken w a square and calipers.
    Fits a Mojo SL pretty well BTW.

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