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  1. #1
    dwt
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    Pivot Firebird 27.5"

    Haven't see this posted. If so my apologies for duplicate

    Another 6" AM

    http://www.bikerumor.com/2013/04/18/...ctual-weights/




    "I ride my bike to ride my bike"- Zen proverb

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  2. #2
    Cleavage Of The Tetons
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    Word is it will only accept a 2.2 with low tread depth.
    Pffffft.
    Weak.
    "We LOVE cows! They make trails for us.....

    And then we eat them."

  3. #3
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    The very day they announced this, I received my Neo Moto 2.3 tires and Sun Ringle Charger Expert 650B wheels.

    I did the conversion last night. No problem at all with the clearance of the 2.3 Neo Moto tires in the frame, or in my Lyrik RC2DH fork. BB height comes out to 14" even unsagged, and about 12" when sagged.

  4. #4
    Cleavage Of The Tetons
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    Good to hear.
    So the word also is that this isn't a 'true' 650/27.5 bike, but an old Firebird with some new decals.
    Anyone have the straight dope?
    "We LOVE cows! They make trails for us.....

    And then we eat them."

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    Good to hear.
    So the word also is that this isn't a 'true' 650/27.5 bike, but an old Firebird with some new decals.
    Anyone have the straight dope?
    I don't have any direct knowledge, but I can't in a million years imagine Cocalis doing that, and then calling it:
    "a dedicated 27.5 / 650B mountain bike"

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by twowheelsdown2002 View Post
    The very day they announced this, I received my Neo Moto 2.3 tires and Sun Ringle Charger Expert 650B wheels.

    I did the conversion last night. No problem at all with the clearance of the 2.3 Neo Moto tires in the frame, or in my Lyrik RC2DH fork. BB height comes out to 14" even unsagged, and about 12" when sagged.
    So your's is a regular 26" Firebird that you've converted to 650b? Did it take any "converting" other than mounting the new wheels?

    If so, and there's plenty of clearance for 2.3 Neomotos, then the "dedicated" 650b version should have more than enough clearance.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post
    So your's is a regular 26" Firebird that you've converted to 650b? Did it take any "converting" other than mounting the new wheels?

    If so, and there's plenty of clearance for 2.3 Neomotos, then the "dedicated" 650b version should have more than enough clearance.
    Mine is a regular Firebird, and so is the one Pivot is selling. They went with a wheelset, angleset, and fork. I read they may also mod the bridge just a bit for a few extra mm of clearance on their new builds coming up. As it stands, the Neo Moto clears fine.

    All I did on mine was switch the wheels and tires, and that is all.

  8. #8
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    *TEST RIDE COMPLETE*
    I got a good test ride under my belt and really got a good feel of it. I will give you some info on the rider so you understand the perspective better. I have been riding MTB since 1985 and am 51 years old. Started riding full suspension in 1996. Have owned a shitload of bikes. I love technical trails and pride myself on my ability to clean rocky climbs others can't. Downhill I am decent, but not a big air hucker. I ride full suspension more for the ability to mow through rock gardens than to catch air. I also like to earn my downhills, so my riding is a cross between XC and all mountain. Distance and climbing plus gnar. Currently have a Firebird, Endorphin, and RIP-9.

    Test ride had a climb up a rocky wash, technical climb up rocky stair steps. Downhill through rocky chunk, and loose, baseball sized rocks. Some flowy sections, a couple sand washes and lots of ups and down with plenty of chunk and techy spots.

    Those that say you won't feel a difference are either full of crap, or have not ridden enough to be able to feel the difference. There is a big difference!! But it is not acceleration, or roll over ability. It is the steering. And for me it was a big, big plus! The thing I like on the 29er is when just cruising, you can relax, and it is steady. I always feel like I am over correcting the 26er and like they are a bit twitchy. The 29er is stable and relaxing, but at times it is cumbersome and a bit slow to respond. Enter the 650B. Steering is neutral. Just plain perfect to me. It was not just noticeable at speed, it was noticeable at all speeds. Climbing up rocky sections, it did not flop around like the 26er. It was more steady, and I could hit my spots with much more perfection. But it did not feel overly slow like the 29er does at times. At speed, I could relax much more than with the 26er wheels, and it was just so much more neutral. I never found myself over steering, yet it never felt too sluggish. For me, it was the perfect blend of steady, neutral, and responsive. It had the best qualities of 29er stability without the loss of nimbleness.

    As for acceleration, it was almost imperceptible from the 26er wheels. Both sets of wheels are the same rim, and the 2.3 CG AM tires are 750 grams vs 720 grams for the Neo Moto 2.3 tires, so slight rim weight increase vs slight tire weight decrease equals a wash pretty much. I noticed very little difference in acceleration. I did notice that the Neo Moto tires rolled faster than the 26" CG AM tires. Also, they went through sand a lot like a 29er tire. Cornering was really good as well. I also could feel better rolling over obstacles, and much better stability down rocky, chunky, loose descents.
    So basically, the good parts of the 29er wheel with the increased roll over ability and speed, but I did not feel that sluggish feel the 29er has many times.

    Seems to me, that the 650B wheels had most of the good aspects of each wheel size, without accentuating the bad aspects of either size. Much better acceleration, and more nimble than the 29 inch wheel, but better stability, rolling, sand float, and especially steering feel, than the 26 inch wheel.

    Again, I am going to say it was the steering that was my favorite part of the wheel size. Just plain neutral. I could steer right where I wanted both when climbing chunk, and when descending, without over steering and missing my lines. Yet no monster truck feeling like the 29er when you needed agility. So neutral and relaxing, but not slow.

    Bottom line. Was there any point in the ride I wished I was on my 29er instead? NO! Was there any point of the ride I wished I was on my 26er instead? NO!

    Next ride, will I want to be taking either of those wheel sizes out instead? Hell no!

  9. #9
    74 & 29 pilot
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideit View Post
    Word is it will only accept a 2.2 with low tread depth.
    Pffffft.
    Weak.
    The 2.3 Neo Moto works in the back of the 26" frame, so I'm sure the 27.5 version will be able to fit more than a 2.2. This is the crap that makes the internet so unreliable, "Word is..."

    See my last two post on this page to see the clearance of the 26" frame.

    http://forums.mtbr.com/650b-27-5/my-...376656-41.html
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  10. #10
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    Ok, here is the scoop on my 2010 Firebird 650B conversion. 2010 and prior Firebirds have 135mm rear axel spacing unlike the newer firebirds which have 142mm spacing. This means different rear triangles.

    Here is my attempt to convert the 135mm spacing firebird to 650B
    Wheelset: Stans NoTubes ZTR Flows
    Tires: Maxxis 650B ardent 2.25
    Fork: 2010 Fox Talas 36 140-160mm
    No use of a Angelset headset to slacken the frame

    No clearance issues with either front and back under full compression.

    Static clearance: 0.2" clearance between tire to fork arch (see pic below). 1mm clearance between rear tire to a cross bar in the rear triangle. The 1mm clearance in the rear is a little unnerving. I put carbon tape on the cross bar to prevent scratching if it occurs (see pic below).



    Conclusion: the newer 142mm axel firebird probably offers more rear tire clearance for the conversion than the 135mm axel firebird. Although the tire choice by Pivot for the rear is Kenda Honey Badger 2.2 which is a very low profile tire so this makes me wonder how much more clearance the 142mm has over the 135mm. Not much would be my guess. Yes, I would ride this 650B conversion but would swap back the 26" rear tire back on on any hint of mud. I would only ride in dry conditions as any mud will spell trouble. I might experiment with smaller size tires like 2.1 instead of 2.25.

    On ride quality: The bike feels taller. Cornering is slower than the 26". It's a expected trade off. I need more time on the bike to see if I like it. The initial impression is, this conversion made it a better climbing bike but it gave away some maneuverability on the descent.

    Here are some pictures.
    Front under full compression

    Fork arch clearance

    Rear tire clearance

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