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  1. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by twangcat View Post
    I thought the Burner was in the shoot out, just not available as a production model until December. Perhaps I am mistaken. I'm really looking forward to the comparison, especially given the 13" BB on the Burner. The BB on my 650b front 5.Spot is at 14" with a Neo in a Fox 140 fork and I've gotten quite used to it. Going down to 13" will certainly be different, both pro and con, IMO.
    Maybe I misunderstood Francois when he said it wouldn't be available for a few months. I thought they sold all the prototype demos they had at I-bike/Outerbike.

    Burner??

  2. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by twangcat View Post
    I thought the Burner was in the shoot out, just not available as a production model until December. Perhaps I am mistaken. I'm really looking forward to the comparison, especially given the 13" BB on the Burner. The BB on my 650b front 5.Spot is at 14" with a Neo in a Fox 140 fork and I've gotten quite used to it. Going down to 13" will certainly be different, both pro and con, IMO.
    No Burner. There is a redesign going on so there will be no press demo bikes until December, best case. That means production is farther away into 2013.

    fc

  3. #128
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    Took the modified Sight out today. Kashima front/rear with 140/160. Tubeless Rocket Ron and Hans Dampf.

    I have to say it is one of the finest rides I have ever done on my 6 mile descent. 650b is here and it will take over.

    fc
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 27.5 All Mountain Bike Shootout-img_6943.jpg  

    27.5 All Mountain Bike Shootout-img_6953.jpg  

    27.5 All Mountain Bike Shootout-img_6945.jpg  

    27.5 All Mountain Bike Shootout-img_6948.jpg  


  4. #129
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    Anyone see the new Bicycling? Looks like they already did this.

  5. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Took the modified Sight out today. Kashima front/rear with 140/160. Tubeless Rocket Ron and Hans Dampf.

    I have to say it is one of the finest rides I have ever done on my 6 mile descent. 650b is here and it will take over.

    fc
    I'm curious to hear your impressions of the lighter cheaper 150mm Revelation, vs the Blingy 160/34 Fox.

  6. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by reformed roadie View Post
    Anyone see the new Bicycling? Looks like they already did this.
    As I posted in the AM Forum, this shoot out is sort if a buyer's guide for people who are already sold on the wheel siz, are set to buy a trail or AM bike in 2013, and are trying to decide which one. If you're looking for a buyer's guide or a "shoot out," and do not have the means and opportunity to demo the bikes personally, who are you going to trust, Bicycling
    Magazine or Francois and MTBR ?
    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

  7. #132
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    In Francois we trust! This forum is the capital of the MTB 650b universe.

  8. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by StiHacka View Post
    In Francois we trust! This forum is the capital of the MTB 650b universe.
    Oh come on, everyone knows they're in love with 650B on PB...NOT

    I'm curious to hear your impressions of the lighter cheaper 150mm Revelation, vs the Blingy 160/34 Fox.
    Good to know about both forks but I'm interested about the Revelation also.

    6 mile descent is sweet Francois but more important is how the bike(s) does on the way up that 6 miles Gravity is the easy part for these Swiss Army knife type bikes. Climbing the ugly gnarl is what will separate them for me personally
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  9. #134
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    I just ordered a Turner Burner frame today. Should ship mid December.

  10. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by reformed roadie View Post
    Anyone see the new Bicycling? Looks like they already did this.
    Yeah, I've been reading and re-reading their impressions of the Burner and Altitude. The Burner test in particular is dated--they were on a prototype with a low BB and 65 degree front end. Plus, they don't really go into much detail--it's mostly impressions and a catchy summary...which is typical for their bike reviews.

  11. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidad View Post
    Oh come on, everyone knows they're in love with 650B on PB...NOT



    Good to know about both forks but I'm interested about the Revelation also.

    6 mile descent is sweet Francois but more important is how the bike(s) does on the way up that 6 miles Gravity is the easy part for these Swiss Army knife type bikes. Climbing the ugly gnarl is what will separate them for me personally
    Ditto , forums seem to be dominated by shuttlers, I also climb a trail before descending.

  12. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridezum View Post
    Ditto , forums seem to be dominated by shuttlers, I also climb a trail before descending.
    Rule 55 - earn your turns.

  13. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    As I posted in the AM Forum
    Congratulations!



    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    this shoot out is sort if a buyer's guide for people who are already sold on the wheel siz, are set to buy a trail or AM bike in 2013, and are trying to decide which one. If you're looking for a buyer's guide or a "shoot out," and do not have the means and opportunity to demo the bikes personally, who are you going to trust, Bicycling
    Magazine or Francois and MTBR ?
    SInce Bicycling headquarters is about an hour from where I live, and some of the writers race in local race series, Bicycling's tests, though brief, actually do carry a bit more weight with me, since they are testing on the same or similar terrain I ride...
    YMMV

  14. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidad View Post

    Good to know about both forks but I'm interested about the Revelation also.

    6 mile descent is sweet Francois but more important is how the bike(s) does on the way up that 6 miles Gravity is the easy part for these Swiss Army knife type bikes. Climbing the ugly gnarl is what will separate them for me personally
    I agree. The best bike for me would climb and shred the descents.

  15. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raja View Post
    I agree. The best bike for me would climb and shred the descents.
    Climbing on the Norco Sight is A+. Last Saturday, I climbed 5000 feet with this bike on a mix of rocky, singletrack and steep fire roads. This bike has an FSR rear end but they have a lower rear pivot than the rear axle. This design seems to allow it to have a stable pedaling platform while climbing. I put the rear shock in 'Trail' mode and just pedaled yo without much pedal bob.

    Yesterday on the 6 mile singletrack descent, I took a 7 mile asphalt road to get back to my car. Again, climbing was fine and not a problem at all for a a big-tired 30 lb bike. I put both shocks in 'Climb' mode since I rode out of saddle a lot. The bike had no pedal bob at all front or rear but if I pounced on the bike, I could get the front and rear suspension to go down about 2 inches. I'm starting to appreciate Fox's 'Climb-Trail-Descend' system more.

    Of course the bike is 30 lbs, huge tires and has a 50mm stem so there were no Strava uphill records. But I still tried to pass a bunch of roadies. All I got were recumbents

    The Intense Tracer 275 is a great climber too. It is a very familiar system to me with the VPP rear suspension. It just climbs well with a stable platform. The rear end is sooo stiff but it is very capable on very rocky, tech climbs.

    fc

  16. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by reformed roadie View Post
    Congratulations!
    Well, I thought the AM people might be interested. By they tend to be slack HT 26'er diehards


    SInce Bicycling headquarters is about an hour from where I live, and some of the writers race in local race series, Bicycling's tests, though brief, actually do carry a bit more weight with me, since they are testing on the same or similar terrain I ride...
    YMMV
    Where and what terrain? Thx


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  17. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by doismellbacon View Post
    I'm curious to hear your impressions of the lighter cheaper 150mm Revelation, vs the Blingy 160/34 Fox.
    The 140mm Revelation was very impressive indeed. It was plush and controlled. It did not hold back the Norco Sight at all and even matched up well with that Fox CTD shock in the rear.

    That fork with a big 650b front tire can manhandle most terrain I think. It is light too at under 4 lbs.

    I only have two rides on the Fox 160mm Kashima CTD 650b fork. It is heavier by about half a pound compared to the Rockshox. It is way more tuneable and easier to set up initally. CTD is up top and rebound at the bottom. The 'Trail' mode has another tuning dial to set preferences. The 34 mm stanchions is just ready for a fight. Rut and rock deflection is minimized. And fork flex under heavy braking is now removed from the experience. You don't really know it's affecting you when using other forks until you experience how good it is on this fork. Just a couple rides so far so more impressions coming on the Fox fork.

    fc
    Last edited by francois; 11-10-2012 at 09:24 PM.

  18. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post

    Where and what terrain? Thx


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  19. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    This is a good point. It's just that I've had this 2012 Jamis test bike for the last three months. I'll ask them for a new one on Monday.

    fc
    fc,
    Did you ever hear from Jamis about getting a 2013. I know they've been going through some weather stuff, but just curious. Rode one of these @ outerbike, and it was great.

  20. #145
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    Also Francois,

    When you get the Scott I'd like to know your feeling about the long 29'erish wheel base and how it feels in every way vs the other bikes.

    It's got about an inch on most of the bikes, 2 " over the Jamis and 2.5" over a 650B HD 140
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  21. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidad View Post
    Also Francois,

    When you get the Scott I'd like to know your feeling about the long 29'erish wheel base and how it feels in every way vs the other bikes.

    It's got about an inch on most of the bikes, 2 " over the Jamis and 2.5" over a 650B HD 140
    That's an interesting detail I had not noticed.

    And is another example of how this shoot-out is cool, given the fact that most will not be able to personally demo all or many of these bikes ourselves. Other than the one we end up buying.


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  22. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidad View Post
    Also Francois,

    When you get the Scott I'd like to know your feeling about the long 29'erish wheel base and how it feels in every way vs the other bikes.

    It's got about an inch on most of the bikes, 2 " over the Jamis and 2.5" over a 650B HD 140
    Wheelbase and cost are going to be the main concerns on the Scott. I rode it in the Bootleg Canyon desert and while it handled the rocky desert pretty well. It might not do as well in the very tight stuff. Also, they have a rear locking DT shock that is synced with the front locking fork. Cool stuff but is definitely bleeding edge. And DT is not as tuneable or reliable as a Fox.

    I have my TRc still and I will be putting the 140mm Rockshox 650b Revelation fork on it. Should be super cool. The wheelbase on it is sooo short (probably like the HD) and it will be good to stretch it out a tad.

    Check out the photos of the Scott and TRc here and you'll see the contrast in wheelbases. 650b/27.5″ Mountain Bikes and Components | Mountain Bike Review

    fc

  23. #148
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    Are you going to keep the Rockshox at 140mm?
    If I am not mistaken, A/C at 140mm for 650b will be 529mm. That sounds like too far from intended 501mm (130mm 26")...

  24. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Are you going to keep the Rockshox at 140mm?
    If I am not mistaken, A/C at 140mm for 650b will be 529mm. That sounds like too far from intended 501mm (130mm 26")...
    Great question. Can this Rockshox be converted easily?

    I've ridden the TRc with a 150mm 26er fork and it's pretty good. Canadian ready good.

    fc

  25. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Great question. Can this Rockshox be converted easily?

    I've ridden the TRc with a 150mm 26er fork and it's pretty good. Canadian ready good.

    fc
    Again, if I am not mistaken, the new Revelation can't be converted easily, you will need to replace the whole internals in order to change the travel, which would be costly...

    150mm 26er = 521mm A/C
    140mm 650b = 529mm A/C

    You will still be about 8mm higher on the 650b fork compered to the 26er...= higher BB, slacker HA... It might be good on descends, but I am not so sure about climbing and flats...
    This is the reason I am considering a 130mm RS Revelation (519mm A/C)
    Let us now how you like it.
    Thanks for doing all the testing, cannot wait for the results

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