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Thread: Surly Krampus

  1. #4001
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    lastchance - you could always lose the spacers under the stem to get the bars a bit lower.

    Also I recommend a -2 degree headset. This will also drop the front end to increase the extra fork length.

    I am tempted to put the monkey nuts back in the rear drop outs to increase the chainstay length. I know most people want short rear ends but longer chainstays will help with the front rear balance and make it climb better. May require grinding the mech a little to fit the 42t cog but cest la vie.

  2. #4002
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    Quote Originally Posted by fartymarty View Post
    lastchance - you could always lose the spacers under the stem to get the bars a bit lower.

    Also I recommend a -2 degree headset. This will also drop the front end to increase the extra fork length.

    I am tempted to put the monkey nuts back in the rear drop outs to increase the chainstay length. I know most people want short rear ends but longer chainstays will help with the front rear balance and make it climb better. May require grinding the mech a little to fit the 42t cog but cest la vie.
    Defo have a -2° Cane Creek, needed it to convert the 44mm (straight) HT to tapered of the Manitou (and the older Fox fork prefiously).

    I have probably 5mm on top of the stem and 12mm below it, I'll need to ride a few times to figure out if I need to drop or raise the bars. I suspect since I'm used to a slammed stem I'll hack off another 8-10mm from the steerer but I'm not about to sacrifice steerer length because I "think" the bars need to be dropped without a few hundred miles behind them.

    I've always ridden a slammed wheel but currently have some space because my rear tire has a weird bulge that causes a bit of rub. Rim is true, tire's center line is dead on, both sides. Weird.

    You should get the DT Swiss RWS axles, they're MAGIC and completely negate the need for monkey nuts or other tensioners.

  3. #4003
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    Krampus + 140mm w/ 15TA is insane.

    The only real noticeable change (so far) is the bit sits taller at rest, I'll have to futz around with my saddle height/angle and bars to get this dialed in but I'm already in love with this fork.

  4. #4004
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    Good to hear. I am hoping to get my Pikes cranked up to 140mm before a ride this Sunday.

  5. #4005
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    Have cranked the Pikes up to 140mm and increased the CS length to 460mm (with monkey nuts re-installed). It goes down faster than the Tories majority in Westminster and seems to climb fairly well as well. It took a little grinding of the Zee mech but the monkey nuts lengthen the rear to offset the increase in bar height. I have mainly ridden down with a few small ups so can't comment on long steep ascents.

  6. #4006
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    Quote Originally Posted by lastchance View Post
    Krampus + 140mm w/ 15TA is insane.

    The only real noticeable change (so far) is the bit sits taller at rest, I'll have to futz around with my saddle height/angle and bars to get this dialed in but I'm already in love with this fork.
    I have a Talas 36 130-160 on my Ti Carver and love it! When u take the forks sag into it not so bad, but so much fun. I also used a can creek angle adjust headset slacked it out 1 degree.


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  7. #4007
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    Quote Originally Posted by lastchance View Post
    Krampus + 140mm w/ 15TA is insane.

    The only real noticeable change (so far) is the bit sits taller at rest, I'll have to futz around with my saddle height/angle and bars to get this dialed in but I'm already in love with this fork.
    I didn't love my Krampus with a 130mm Fox 34 on it. It was a bit too tall/slacked out for bikepacking.
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  8. #4008
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    I didn't love my Krampus with a 130mm Fox 34 on it. It was a bit too tall/slacked out for bikepacking.
    Yeah, I can see that for sure at 130-140mm.

    I rode an absolutely punishing old OHV trail this morning and had a blast with miles (that's what it feels like at least) of squish up front.

  9. #4009
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    Is the new Krampus compatible with GX Eagle?

    Thanks

  10. #4010
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    Yeah so long as you go with a 30t or smaller chainring.

  11. #4011
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    Changing up my Krampus. I sold my Rohloff hub Rabbit Hole wheel. I'll be running a 1x10 or SS setup in the future. The bike is in parts at the moment. I need to get off my butt and get her rolling again.
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  12. #4012
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    Vik,

    Why the change from the Rohloff?

  13. #4013
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    Quote Originally Posted by fartymarty View Post
    Vik,

    Why the change from the Rohloff?
    I'm not doing the kinds of trips where the use of a Rohloff would be most beneficial - long remote trips where a weatherproof low maintenance hub is key.

    1x10 drivetrains are lighter, cheaper and pretty robust these days. For the 1 or 2 week fair weather trips that I am more realistically going to undertake They are a better fit.

    I've also started thinking that for a lot of the steeper bikepacking I've done I'd be just as far ahead to ride a SS. When trails are so steep it's hard to push your bike up you don't need a wide gear range drivetrain. You are walking up and coasting down so the only place you need to pedal is on flat to rolling terrain. I think a SS setup would be light, cheap and robust for that sort of trip.

    I built up a Rabbit Hole + Hope hub wheel so I can run either 1x10 or go SS depending what makes sense for a specific trip. I could also carry the SS cog and spacers so I could go SS should I rip off my derailleur if that was a concern on a longer/remote trip.

    As an engineer I dig lots about the Rohloff, but I just wasn't doing any trips where it was justified.
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  14. #4014
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    Survey says: 140mm travel makes for faster descents, my DH times are getting destroyed with this new fork.

    Ascents though? Struggling.

    Why?

  15. #4015
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    Quote Originally Posted by lastchance View Post
    Ascents though? Struggling.

    Why?
    The longer fork rotates the whole bike backwards. That changes your riding position. It worst on climbs because your putting less and less weight on the fork so it gets longer as it will have less sag.

    I had to change my stem and bar position with a 130mm fork vs. stock rigid.
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  16. #4016
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    Ahhhh, gotcha. I've only put down 70-80 miles and haven't much futzed around with my positioning up front, perhaps it's time?

    On the 100mm fork before I was running 100% slammed but only out of necessity (the steerer tube had been hacked short by the previous owner), I was quick on climbs with that. Maybe I need to drop my bars a bit, at the moment I have 25-35mm of stack, which is a lot, the bike already feels tall enough with the longer travel so on flat ground the bars feel sky-high for sure.

  17. #4017
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    lastchance,

    It is because the front is higher and you have more weight on the rear. It is the reason XC racers use negative rise stems.

    This is the reason I have added the Monkey Nuts in the rear of my frame. It lengthens the rear and stops the front popping up so much (still to be properly tested but that's my theory)

    Things that will help : flat or low rise bars, a longer stem (I am now up to 50mm from 35mm), slamming the seat forward on the rails, maybe a -2 degree headset as this will drop the front slightly.

    It's all a balancing game between ascending and descending. For me the issue with my Large Krampus is that it could do with a longer reach and steeper seat tube. Your weight is then balanced over the middle of the bike and it will climb and descend well. But saying that it is a 2012 bike and things have moved on a bit since then.

    Let us know how you get on.

  18. #4018
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    lastchance - also lose the spacers under the stem as that will put more weight on the front. also thinking about it a -2 degree headset will slacken the HA but also steepen the seat angle which should transfer weight forward.

  19. #4019
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    Quote Originally Posted by fartymarty View Post
    lastchance,

    It is because the front is higher and you have more weight on the rear. It is the reason XC racers use negative rise stems.

    This is the reason I have added the Monkey Nuts in the rear of my frame. It lengthens the rear and stops the front popping up so much (still to be properly tested but that's my theory)

    Things that will help : flat or low rise bars, a longer stem (I am now up to 50mm from 35mm), slamming the seat forward on the rails, maybe a -2 degree headset as this will drop the front slightly.

    It's all a balancing game between ascending and descending. For me the issue with my Large Krampus is that it could do with a longer reach and steeper seat tube. Your weight is then balanced over the middle of the bike and it will climb and descend well. But saying that it is a 2012 bike and things have moved on a bit since then.

    Let us know how you get on.
    Thanks for this.

    I have a box of stems, perhaps before hacking off another inch from the steerer I'll experiment with stem length/rise, stacking on top of the stem to drop the bars, etc. I really like the factory Salsa whatever-they-are bars that are wide and flat, have some risers but my shoulders are too broad to feel "stable" with 650-680s.

  20. #4020
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    Vik - interesting on the Rohloff.

    I used to be of the opinion that gearboxes (and good IGHs) were the holy grail of mountainbiking but have recently have changed my mind due to a few reveiws on Pinion gearboxes. I had the Krampus set up as a single speed over winter and it was a revelation - it felt very efficient and mad you ride faster as you had to attack the hill to make it up them. I currently running 10 speed though as it's cheap and works relatively well despite the UK mud.

    The beauty of the Krampus is it's so versatile. I guess 4000+ posts are testament to this.

  21. #4021
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    yeah wide bars help too. I'm on 780s but have pretty wide shoulders. I was riding a mates 740s over the weekend and they felt narrow.

  22. #4022
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    Dropped on the stock 80mm stem, flipped, fully stacked with like 40mm of spacers - seeming solved my problem with a much more forward reach - down over the front end (again).

    We'll see if this helps with climbing.

  23. #4023
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    Surly Krampus-2017-06-17-16.56.20-2.jpg

    140mm Pikes. HA is about 64.5.

  24. #4024
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    How did you come about 64.5 HA?

  25. #4025
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    -2 degree headset and 140mm forks. It is probably about 65 as I have just compared to another bike with a 64.5 and its marginally steeper.

  26. #4026
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    Thanks for the response man. I definitely am not starting an arguement/that is not what my comment is intended to, just trying to figure out if it is actually 65 HA how that happened? The legacy Krampus has an original HA of 69.5 right? So with the -2 degree headset that gets us to 67.5. Then the 140mm which is 20mm more travel than the 120mm it was based upon stock wouldn't that only get you to 66.5 (0.5 degree per 10mm)?

  27. #4027
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    I did measure it off a photo so there maybe a little error. The stock rigid fork has a 483mm AC (which gives the 69.5HA), the Pike at 140mm is 550mm, therefore 67mm extra.

    I will do a little maths and drawing and see what I get.

  28. #4028
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    anybody know if the new large frame has braze ons for 2 bottle cages inside the triangle? pictures just seem to show one.

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  29. #4029
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    2017 Krampus size Large. See picture floor question above.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Surly Krampus-img_2043.jpg  


  30. #4030
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    Quote Originally Posted by Purdue22 View Post
    2017 Krampus size Large. See picture floor question above.
    thanks for the post. thats not what i was hoping for. why get rid of the bosses on the seat tube? i dont wear a pack and i need two bottles...

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  31. #4031
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    Yes, it sucks... I don't get it, why add fender, rack, anything cage mounts, mounts for everything except a second water bottle inside the triangle...

  32. #4032
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    But it has internal cable routing!

  33. #4033
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    Quote Originally Posted by lastchance View Post
    But it has internal cable routing!
    You can't have everything!
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  34. #4034
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    You can't have everything!
    -Surly

  35. #4035
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    Hi. I am new here.
    Few months ago got a rather doubtful blue krampus second hand.
    I learned that its a 16". Though the engraving on the bb shell says M12****** hence an M from 2012.
    Its blue. The previous owner mentioned it as a prototype(?)
    The blue he said is original.
    Any thoughts or valid info?
    Thanks

  36. #4036
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    Quote Originally Posted by tedi View Post
    Hi. I am new here.
    Few months ago got a rather doubtful blue krampus second hand.
    I learned that its a 16". Though the engraving on the bb shell says M12****** hence an M from 2012.
    Its blue. The previous owner mentioned it as a prototype(?)
    The blue he said is original.
    Any thoughts or valid info?
    Thanks
    One of Surly's recent blog posts indicates that the first prototypes were blue, so it may be legit.

  37. #4037
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    Quote Originally Posted by liem View Post
    One of Surly's recent blog posts indicates that the first prototypes were blue, so it may be legit.
    2017 KRAMPUS UPDATES, OR, IF YOU LIVED HERE, YOU’D BE HOME BY NOW | Blog | Surly Bikes

    Yep. Does it look like this one?
    I like turtles

  38. #4038
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    how exactly do you mount two cages on the downtube? i see there are 3 bosses but i dont see how 2 bottles will fit

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  39. #4039
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasnavy05 View Post
    how exactly do you mount two cages on the downtube? i see there are 3 bosses but i dont see how 2 bottles will fit

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    One on top and one on the bottom! There are now 2 bosses under the downtube. Why wouldn't they make three down there right away? From my experience, that under-the-downtube location works fine for bikepacking or mellower rides, but isn't ideal for techy riding. You may be able to get 2 bottles inside the triangle using one of the Wolf tooth B-RAD bases if you're on a bigger frame.

    It does stink that they got ride of the bottle bosses on the seat tube. I'm guessing it has something to do with the bend, shorter seat tubes, and dropper compatibility. If there's room, you can always mount one there using another method, like hose clamps, electrical tape, SKS mounts, etc. Not ideal, but it will work.

  40. #4040
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    From my experience, that under-the-downtube location works fine for bikepacking or mellower rides, but isn't ideal for techy riding.
    I've done days of techy rough riding with bottles under the DT and it's totally fine. Having the weight down low is beneficial. I just use that bottle to refill a bottle mounted higher up as it's not a spot you are going to reach down and grab a bottle while riding.

    You can add a couple bottle mounts to the seat tube inside the frame if you want a 3rd bottle. It's not a big deal. I suspect Surly didn't include brazeons there as that might have interfered with some droppers that need lots of insertion depth.
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  41. #4041
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    I've done days of techy rough riding with bottles under the DT and it's totally fine. Having the weight down low is beneficial. I just use that bottle to refill a bottle mounted higher up as it's not a spot you are going to reach down and grab a bottle while riding.

    You can add a couple bottle mounts to the seat tube inside the frame if you want a 3rd bottle. It's not a big deal. I suspect Surly didn't include brazeons there as that might have interfered with some droppers that need lots of insertion depth.
    I've broken bottle cages and bottles running them under the downtube on a Jones a few years back. When you need to get over big logs and large boulders they can get smashed.

  42. #4042
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    I've broken bottle cages and bottles running them under the downtube on a Jones a few years back. When you need to get over big logs and large boulders they can get smashed.
    They can get smashed I guess. I've done lots of that. I just lift the bike over the logs and rocks without trashing the under DT bottle. I've never damaged a bottle or cage in that position.
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  43. #4043
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    So, hydration pack then?

  44. #4044
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    They can get smashed I guess. I've done lots of that. I just lift the bike over the logs and rocks without trashing the under DT bottle. I've never damaged a bottle or cage in that position.
    I think it depends how and where we ride. I don't want to get off my bike and carry it over logs and rocks all the time, I want to ride over them. Again, I'm talking about general trail riding here. If I'm bikepacking, I'll be more more conservative and then stuff under the downtube is no problem.

  45. #4045
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    Quote Originally Posted by lastchance View Post
    So, hydration pack then?
    We just listed a bunch of ways to get another bottle inside the front triangle, did you read any of it?

  46. #4046
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    Maybe this will help, maybe not eh..

    https://www.wolftoothcomponents.com/...e-cage-adapter
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  47. #4047
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    I think it depends how and where we ride. I don't want to get off my bike and carry it over logs and rocks all the time, I want to ride over them. Again, I'm talking about general trail riding here. If I'm bikepacking, I'll be more more conservative and then stuff under the downtube is no problem.


    I don't get off unless the obstacle is too big to ride over and I don't see how you are damaging that under the DT cage while riding.

    If you smashed the cage under the DT on the Krampus you would be driving the log/rock into your chainring given where the cage sits. So you are not going to hit it on any log/rock you have a hope of riding over.

    If you are just carelessly ramming your bike into obstacles without a second thought I can see damaging the cage, but if you are doing that and there is no cage there you chain and chainring will get killed instead. So I wouldn't recommend it.
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  48. #4048
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post


    I don't get off unless the obstacle is too big to ride over and I don't see how you are damaging that under the DT cage while riding.

    If you smashed the cage under the DT on the Krampus you would be driving the log/rock into your chainring given where the cage sits. So you are not going to hit it on any log/rock you have a hope of riding over.

    If you are just carelessly ramming your bike into obstacles without a second thought I can see damaging the cage, but if you are doing that and there is no cage there you chain and chainring will get killed instead. So I wouldn't recommend it.
    Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Yup, sometimes I try to ride over big logs, sometimes my chainring hits those logs, sometimes I crash, sometimes I make it over, sometimes when there was a bottle and cage under the downtube they would break. Therefore I don't run them in that location when trail riding. I'm done with this conversation.

    On another note, I was looking over the Jones blog earlier and noticed the Plus also doesn't have bottle mounts on the seat tube. It does have 2 sets on the top of the down tube and a triple set on the bottom of the downtube.

  49. #4049
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Yup, sometimes I try to ride over big logs, sometimes my chainring hits those logs, sometimes I crash, sometimes I make it over, sometimes when there was a bottle and cage under the downtube they would break.
    I can confirm this happens. It's extremely uncommon out here in The West™, like getting wide bars stuck between two trees, but when I was riding trail down in The South® you'd come across logs all scarred up from chainrings that could absolutely crush a bottle cage down there if you hit them wonky.
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  50. #4050
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    Quote Originally Posted by hirschmj View Post
    ... you'd come across logs all scarred up from chainrings that could absolutely crush a bottle cage down there if you hit them wonky.
    Okay we can all agree that if you ram your bike into obstacles you can damage a bottle under the DT. My solution would be to not ram the bike into obstacles since that's likely to cause issues with your DT even without a bottle mounted there. That seems to be Surly's take on it as well.
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  51. #4051
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    Check out this blog post about adding riv nuts to the bottom of a DT on a Surly frame for a Salsa Anything cage. Same approach would work on the ST of a Krampus MK3 as long as they didn't interfere with your seatpost of choice.

    https://gypsybytrade.wordpress.com/2...er-and-bigger/

    Of course you'd have to drill holes in your frame. If that bothers you hose clamps would also work and would be removeable.
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  52. #4052
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    We just listed a bunch of ways to get another bottle inside the front triangle, did you read any of it?
    You must be fun at parties. Grump.

  53. #4053
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    Quote Originally Posted by lastchance View Post
    You must be fun at parties. Grump.
    And you must be one of those people that asks a question and then doesn't listen to the answer...

  54. #4054
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    And you must be one of those people that asks a question and then doesn't listen to the answer...
    For suggesting a hydration pack?

    Side note: you said you were done with this conversation.

  55. #4055
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    Quote Originally Posted by lastchance View Post
    For suggesting a hydration pack?

    Side note: you said you were done with this conversation.
    I was done with the conversation about breaking bottle cages mounted under the downtube!

    I hate hydration packs! It's so much nicer riding without one, especially when it's 95 deg. with 98% humidity!

    I don't know if I'd go as far as drilling holes in the seat tube of my new frame though...

  56. #4056
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    I was done with the conversation about breaking bottle cages mounted under the downtube!

    I hate hydration packs! It's so much nicer riding without one, especially when it's 95 deg. with 98% humidity!

    I don't know if I'd go as far as drilling holes in the seat tube of my new frame though...
    I feel ya, I hate hydration packs with a passion, I rode with one for a few seasons before ditching it for regular bottles... Then again, I have an OG Krampus, not the silly new one with no mounts. Haha!

    I wouldn't mod my frame for bottles, either.

  57. #4057
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    Quote Originally Posted by lastchance View Post
    I feel ya, I hate hydration packs with a passion, I rode with one for a few seasons before ditching it for regular bottles... Then again, I have an OG Krampus, not the silly new one with no mounts. Haha!

    I wouldn't mod my frame for bottles, either.
    I did the same, Camelbaks for a few seasons and then back to water bottles. I don't have a Krampus at all, but I do have a 29+ Waltworks, and you can bet it has mounts on the seat tube as well as above and below the downtube.

    If I had a frame I needed to add mounts to, I would use either these:

    https://www.amazon.com/SKS-Germany-1.../dp/B00ZFHW1MI

    or the King USB mounts:

    King Cage - Bicycle waterbottle cages handmade in Durango, CO

  58. #4058
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    I did the same, Camelbaks for a few seasons and then back to water bottles. I don't have a Krampus at all, but I do have a 29+ Waltworks, and you can bet it has mounts on the seat tube as well as above and below the downtube.

    If I had a frame I needed to add mounts to, I would use either these:

    https://www.amazon.com/SKS-Germany-1.../dp/B00ZFHW1MI

    or the King USB mounts:

    King Cage - Bicycle waterbottle cages handmade in Durango, CO
    I use the SKS mounts to put an Anything Cage on my fork. They work surprisingly well.
    I like turtles

  59. #4059
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    I visited The Broken Spoke shop in Santa Fe yesterday looking for a new bike for my 10 year old son. Found a nice Jamis 26" disk on sale. Talked to the salesman about me needing a new bike soon to replace my 2003 Fisher 29er. Test rode a med '17 Krampus. I'm like it a lot.

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